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Aurelius 08-23-2012 07:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gummee! (Post 19425793)
Can ya tell I think strava is about the most idiotic thing I've heard of?

If you're going to race. Race. If you're not, then why bother?!

M

Only a tiny percentage of bicycle riders have an interest in racing, in the sense that you understand the term. Many more find it interesting to chart their own progress or compare their achievements at local trails with others. That's what Strava allows them to do.

vfr700 08-23-2012 08:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gummee! (Post 19425793)
Can ya tell I think strava is about the most idiotic thing I've heard of?

If you're going to race. Race. If you're not, then why bother?!

M

Yup...what he said. Burying yourself to bridge a gap can't be reproduced by using Strava, nothing replicates racing. Unless the atmospheric conditions are the same for everyone on a given circuit it is apples & oranges. Never been much for high score in Pong either, don't use a Camelbak, still use a frame pump, a San Marco Regal, GP4's...

Aurelius 08-23-2012 09:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vfr700 (Post 19426688)
Yup...what he said. Burying yourself to bridge a gap can't be reproduced by using Strava, nothing replicates racing.

Strava users aren't trying to replicate racing.

Gummee! 08-23-2012 09:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chisenhallw (Post 19425894)
Yeah, you need to stop disseminating your feelings. Really, let it out. You'll feel better! :eek1:lol3

Honestly, there's so much gear out there, there's bound to be ridiculousness all around. I distinctly recall you being indignant when I said that carbon-fiber water bottle cages were ridiculous! Different strokes and all. Any reason to ride a bicycle is a valid one.

I did? Sorry.

The PRICES for CF cages are ridiculous. ...to hold a bottle?! (I got my pair for free, so there nyaa!)

AFA strava users not trying to replicate racing: What ARE they doing then?! Sounds like a race to me. ...only without any kind of real competition involved.

M

vfr700 08-23-2012 09:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aurelius (Post 19426872)
Strava users aren't trying to replicate racing.

Call it what you want, it's racing. Attempting to beat the best time is what then? I'm glad people are out riding, supporting the industry, acclimating the public to sharing the roads with cyclists, etc. Strava is goofy, but if it is the motivation for riding, that's great.

frazman 08-23-2012 09:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aurelius (Post 19417413)
Strava's website states that even in optimal conditions, GPS tracking is only accurate to within 10 meters (33 feet). ... are riders placing entirely too much faith in their GPS to provide the degree of accuracy these results require?

Yup (without differential correction, that is).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Error_a...tioning_System

Factor in tree cover, cloud cover and how many satellites are used to triangulate your position and you have yourself more error than that. I wouldn't count on it in race conditions. Like Gumme said, first across the line is where it's at. Or a stopwatch at a TT.

HOT DAMN! 08-23-2012 09:45 AM

Wow. While at my age I have absolutely ZERO interest in racing bikes, I do have a new found respect for those that do it competitively and do it well.

I've recently incorporated bike riding into my workout routine, nothing special, 20 to 25 mile rides on my mountain bike averaging 16/17 mph about 4 to 5 days a week for the last 3 months.

Had to take about 2 weeks off the bike but continued my other workout blocks, which include running 3-4 miles for cardio.

Wholly molly, I got back on the bike last evening to tackle a very familiar 25 mile ride only to break down (physically/mentally) at about mile 13 with an average speed of about 14 mph. :huh

Pathetic.

I clearly see why some of you ride and train so aggressively, as if you don't someone else will.

Really? 2 measly weeks off the bike to drop this far back? :eek1

Race on brothers, race on. :bow

Aurelius 08-23-2012 09:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vfr700 (Post 19426982)
Call it what you want, it's racing. Attempting to beat the best time is what then? I'm glad people are out riding, supporting the industry, acclimating the public to sharing the roads with cyclists, etc. Strava is goofy, but if it is the motivation for riding, that's great.

When I trained with weights, I kept records of all my past performances. I did this to gauge my improvement and to test the results of various training methodologies, NOT because I had the slightest inclination to be a weight lifter or partake in weight lifting competitions. That's what Strava does for bicyclists, runners, etc. Others use it for no other reason other than to keep an electronic log of all the places they've been on their bicycles, motorcyclists, boats, etc.

It's as absurd to assume that anyone who uses Strava is a wannabe racer as it is to assume that racers don't use Strava. Both are patently false assumptions.

Aurelius 08-23-2012 10:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gummee! (Post 19426917)
AFA strava users not trying to replicate racing: What ARE they doing then?! Sounds like a race to me. ...only without any kind of real competition involved.

M

:poser You've earned the :norton:norton:norton award this week.

vfr700 08-23-2012 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aurelius (Post 19427088)
When I trained with weights, I kept records of all my past performances. I did this to gauge my improvement and to test the results of various training methodologies, NOT because I had the slightest inclination to be a weight lifter or partake in weight lifting competitions. That's what Strava does for bicyclists, runners, etc. Others use it for no other reason other than to keep an electronic log of all the places they've been on their bicycles, motorcyclists, boats, etc.

It's as absurd to assume that anyone who uses Strava is a wannabe racer as it is to assume that racers don't use Strava. Both are patently false assumptions.

Ok, I get that. What you were not doing is comparing your training records with another weight lifter's records/progress. Using other people's Strava posting's isn't exactly an academic approach to track progress. I have training records that date back to the 80's, they are only useful to me.

I wasn't assuming that those who use Strava are "wannabe racers", but if they are competing against other Strava users then what are they? How is that a measure of one's progress? I can ride the same circuit every day, and depending on the conditions have a large disparity in average speed. Comparing my ride with another rider when wind and temp conditions are variable is not an accurate measure of progress.

Tracking you personal information with GPS data is great, I use Garmin products to accomplish the same thing. I don't compete with other Garmin users though.

Gummee! 08-23-2012 11:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aurelius (Post 19427088)
When I trained with weights, I kept records of all my past performances. I did this to gauge my improvement and to test the results of various training methodologies, NOT because I had the slightest inclination to be a weight lifter or partake in weight lifting competitions. That's what Strava does for bicyclists, runners, etc. Others use it for no other reason other than to keep an electronic log of all the places they've been on their bicycles, motorcyclists, boats, etc.

It's as absurd to assume that anyone who uses Strava is a wannabe racer as it is to assume that racers don't use Strava. Both are patently false assumptions.

That's great, but did you post your weights up on the innerwebs for people to try and beat? Hey LOOKIT ME! I lifted 300#! Beat that! That's strava.

Keeping records on your own is easier to do on other software.

I know racers that are strava users. Rode with at least one last nite. The difference is emphasis. They're using strava as a training tool, its certainly not a race to them.

M

k7 08-23-2012 11:46 AM

Everyone knows the real reason for Strava to use the KOM concept - it's simply there to drive traffic to their site. More traffic means more $$$ for them. The KOM crap is simply a gimmick and a rather good one at that. Some will certainly find it useful, others could care less. YMMV of course.

Aurelius 08-23-2012 11:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vfr700 (Post 19427421)
Ok, I get that. What you were not doing is comparing your training records with another weight lifter's records/progress. Using other people's Strava posting's isn't exactly an academic approach to track progress. I have training records that date back to the 80's, they are only useful to me.

I wasn't assuming that those who use Strava are "wannabe racers", but if they are competing against other Strava users then what are they? How is that a measure of one's progress? I can ride the same circuit every day, and depending on the conditions have a large disparity in average speed. Comparing my ride with another rider when wind and temp conditions are variable is not an accurate measure of progress.

I imagine that those vying for top honors on the leader boards make sure that all their attempts are made under optimal conditions. And from what I've seen so far, there are no large disparities. For example, I did three hill climbs one week apart and my results in order were: 1min 8 seconds, 1min 9 seconds, and 1min 12 seconds. My lap time at another trail is almost exactly 7 minutes, both times. These are heavily wooded areas so there is no wind to contend with, and weather conditions were identical (mid 90's, high humidity, dry ground). I've been following the rivalry between two riders at a popular local trail lately. One of them held a number of KOMs there, but the other has been steadily improving his times. Now he's tied for KOM on one segment and is the undisputed leader on another. If that's not an indicator of progress, I don't know what you'd call it.

Quote:

Tracking you personal information with GPS data is great, I use Garmin products to accomplish the same thing. I don't compete with other Garmin users though.
There are different types of competition. When I began working out at the gym, I'd pay attention to how much weight other people of my size, age, and build were training with, and I'd set myself the goal of exceeding those amounts. That's obviously not the same as competing in a sanctioned weight lifting match, but it is nonetheless a type of competition. As I got much stronger, I eventually only had my own previous records to compete against. This is what I hope to use Strava for.

vfr700 08-23-2012 12:02 PM

My better half wanted a steel rig to match the Peg, this is now living on the shelf next to the Peg.

http://bikyle.com/images/Road2012/To...lgium_blue.jpg

Aurelius 08-23-2012 12:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gummee! (Post 19427882)
That's great, but did you post your weights up on the innerwebs for people to try and beat? Hey LOOKIT ME! I lifted 300#! Beat that! That's strava.

The comparison doesn't make sense. In order to see my Strava results, I have no option but to upload them to Strava's website. When I do that, Strava automatically arranges them alongside other people's results. I don't post them there for others to look at; that's just how the software works. Now, let's say that my times were in fact good enough to be at the top of the leader board. Why would it trouble you that other riders might see that as a challenge and try to beat my times? If wanting to better my results inspires others to improve their skills, what's wrong with that? Conversely, what's wrong with me training harder because I'm dissatisfied with results that place me somewhere in the middle of the pack, when I prefer to be near the top?

Quote:

I know racers that are strava users. Rode with at least one last nite. The difference is emphasis. They're using strava as a training tool, its certainly not a race to them.
Precisely my point. Strava is not racing, and I don't know of anyone who thinks it is. There is no reason to assume that anyone looking to earn a KOM has any interest in doing the sort of racing you do.


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