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Old 12-10-2012, 11:04 PM   #9
XL-erate OP
Gnarly Adventurer
 
Joined: Mar 2008
Oddometer: 154
Quote:
Originally Posted by FlySniper View Post
If nothing else, you are very obtuse.

Try to focus here....

My original point from the very start has been: Your "limited slip differential" as you originally described it (dry clutch, no housing, no machine work, adjustable springs to control slip, junkyard parts) won't work.

My reasoning: You said (and I'm repeating myself)
1. No machining except for maybe cutting splines.
2. All salvaged/junkyard parts.
3. Dry clutch with adjustable spring tension to control slip.

I took exception to this because I know how finiky LSDs can be. Flex MUST be controlled, therefore it must either have a housing or the entire structure must be extremely rigid (read:massive), even with a low torque motorcycle engine. A housing would be more practical... no machining (point 1) means we fall back to point 2 and source it from the boneyard. Now where in the heck to find a ready made diff/clutch housing suitable for something like this?? I've spent enough time in boneyards to know that gems like that refuse to materialize 99x10^23 times when you're looking for them.

But you really meant no housing and shafts supported only with pillow blocks, right?

Duck, sidestep and dance around as you will. You presented your idea as being complete and workable... and worse, as being the best thing since sliced bread.

Now you claim to have presented it looking for suggestions on ways to make it better....(which was not the way it was originally presented)


And now you whine that I have mortally insulted you and continue to do so... Hmmm... I'm actually not couching anything, no hidden insults or agendas. An Ace is an Ace and a Spade is a Spade... a stinker of an idea is a stinker of an idea....

And there is no one here I'm worried about impressing. If you and I were locked together in an abandoned box factory in Siberia... in the winter with only one, threadbare blanket and no electricity or internet and you presented this same idea in the same manner, I'd still say you don't know what you're talking about and make fun of you.


Can you build it?

For all I know you may be a true mechanical genius/McGyver and able to crank out this thing one handed while drunk, blindfolded, naked and entertaining the Swedish Bikini Team. If so I will recant every mean thing I said...


So far though, I've seen no indication that I'll ever need to recant the things I've said.


Build one that works and I'll give you some mature, polite conversation if that's all you're after.


EDIT:... Maybe I'm not being fair. Maybe I am doing a poor job of understanding or you a poor job of explaining. I'll be more civil and hit you up with some reasonable, mature questions later... polite? eh... That varies from individual to individual, but I will tone it down some since your threshold seems a bit low.

Thing is, sometimes folks will read/scan over something and get an idea in their brain that's actually not a correct understanding of what was written. Then that incorrect concept and thought is held close and it effects all the rest of their understanding of what was actually written, skewing the entire thing in their mind. I know I do that at times until I reread.

This is not sarcasm at all - It was expected that anyone with the moxie to build this system would know by the description that where one or more clutch discs are forced against one or more driven discs that there must be thrust washers, and that only bearings of a particular type would work, as in thrust bearings.

It's theoretically and even literally impossible for me to correctly or completely describe exactly what bearing carriers, bearings, thrust washers, u-joints, shafts, splines, clutch discs, driven discs or anything else should be used. Why? Because I have no earthly idea what application someone is going to try to use it in???

The piece I wrote was a conceptual description, a semi [barely] technical description of a working concept of a design for Limited Slip 2WD that could be adapted, that's adapted, to virtually any sidecar by a well skilled gearhead/mechanic/fabricator. It was obvious that it was not a concise 'Insert tab A into Slot B' detailed build description and wasn't intended to be.

Points listed per ORIGINAL post:

1] Yes, pretty close, but I think I said something more like 'virtually' or 'probably' or 'possibly' no machining required except for having splines cut? There is a difference from a flat statement that absolutely no machining processes are required; again because I have no idea how an individual would personally choose to build it.

2] Again I believe I included a qualifier like 'virtually' or 'possibly' salvaged parts or leftover parts? How can I possibly know what parts anyone has in their stash without a detailed inventory? Is it even logical to assume I could?

3] Yes, a dry clutch with adjustable spring tension to control rate of slip. Pretty hard to miss that part.

"Flex MUST be controlled, therefore it must either have a housing or the entire structure must be extremely rigid (read:massive), even with a low torque motorcycle engine. A housing would be more practical... no machining (point 1) means we fall back to point 2 and source it from the boneyard. Now where in the heck to find a ready made diff/clutch housing suitable for something like this?? I've spent enough time in boneyards to know that gems like that refuse to materialize 99x10^23 times when you're looking for them."

I have a golf cart rear differential that is very similar to what you haven't been able to find, I suggest you look in that direction. Old ones are really stout. As concerns the design described that's one of the primary things that's avoided because it isn't necessary, which is pretty much the basic premise of all of the rest of the whole description! Really, that was the main point: light weight, no differential or heavy carrier needed, no need to source such a difficult to find and expensive to buy part. The answer given by me: DIY, simple, and the post described how, which was point #2.

Yes, I really meant no differential housing and bearings supported by bearing carriers, of one's own design when they build. Bad to assume, but the assumption is that the builder will fully know exactly what they are doing, either from prior experience or from a crash course and in-depth education, one or the other.

You might be surprised to see how bearing carriers are used in automated industry and manufacturing to support tremendous loads, with astonishing horsepower applied under far from optimal conditions, running 24 hours a day for years and years. Another example is in the bowels of an ocean going ship of very large displacement, to see how the drive system, shafts, bearings and bearing carriers are configured. Some of the engines used for motive power dwarf the size of a locomotive with driveshaft supported in open bearing carriers with suitable thrust bearings. On the other hand, modern design practices and advancements mean that strong, inflexible and robust construction no longer has to rhyme with 'massive'.

.

XL-erate screwed with this post 12-21-2012 at 12:04 AM
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