BergDonk's DR650s and the Odd Tangent

I've been asked a few times what all the crap is that I lug about everywhere, so:

Spare HD tubes, one in each side of the bash plate.




The tank bag has some rolls of tape, a pair of safety glasses for the rain in the soft bag, some rag, and in the lid, a 8 mm spanner, tyre gauge, pen and lighter. In the pocket at the back is a Chapstick. Its also equipped with 2 x 12v outlets for the GPS, phone, UHF radio, etc. And enough space for a snack or whatever on the day. The yellow thing is a strap wrench for the fuel cap. It leaks if it isn't tight, and its then a locking cap too.





The Ventura bag on the back rack has a can of chain lube, some 'Wet Ones' and a telescopic stand for propping either wheel in the back pocket with room to spare. One side pocket has some straps for whatever, and the other has a throttle rocker for when it makes sense, and some soft ties.

Some who have been paying attention might note that its not the Gearsack that appears in previous pictures. It was new in 1982 and had probably done over 200,000 kms on various bikes of mine over the years. It finally died. A Ventura has replaced it, and I doubt it'll last a fraction of that. Don't make em like they used to

The stuff to the lower left is from the stock tool tube under the lhs sidecover. Some tape, zip ties, spare levers, chain breaker and some chain and a few master links.




In the bag that lives on the 'sub' rack out back is a Leatherman clone, spare spokes and nipples for both wheels, tube patch kit, clutch and throttle cables, a cable repair kit in the round tin, tyre levers and pump, more tape, a wiring diagram and mini multimeter, some wire, epoxy putty, some rag, and a first aid kit.



In the Kelly Tool bag behind the seat is some rag, a brush, some spare bolts and nuts, and a variety of hand tools including a small socket set that will give me access to pretty much anything on the bike.

Other than when my clutch went, all this stuff is used to fix other peoples bikes

And some of you with an eye for detail might note the FE650 sticker on the sidecover above. The original Suzi stickers wore off, and I had a spare set of the FE650 ones in the shed, so I thought I might play some tricks with some peoples heads. Has been noticed by a few, and questions have been asked

Steve

Are you heading beyond Cairns (ie Cape York)? If yes, keep an eye out for 3 DRs (maybe a 4th one) and a yellow F800. We're leaving Cairns 14 May.

BTW: enjoying your thread

Planning, and have permission from SWMBO, to be up there for the DSMRA AGM, 19/20 May.

http://www.dsmra.asn.au/

I'm on the national committee, and also former VP for a few years and like what they try to do. And its an excuse for a ride, although I've also offered to transport others bikes up there who might fly up, so we shall see. If I did that, I guess the Berg would go, but I like the idea of riding the DR up and back.

Did the Cape in 2001, and no plans at this stage to go further north this trip, yet....

Seems like you might be about a week ahead of me.

Steve

Thought I might put this pic in, I've mentioned my Bergs a couple of times, and my GTR. Here are my 2 650s and my 1400GTR. If you haven't figured it out b y now, I'm no photographer.



As mentioned earlier, with pipe and carb mods, Berg has 63 hp at the wheel on the dyno, and with the stock 10.5 l tank filled, its 122 kgs wet, ready to go. Got a 16 l Clarke on in the pic. Lost the scales, so yet to weigh the DR650. My missus' KLX250 with less fuel, 8l, but similar bling, and 300 cc is 129kg on the same scales.

Steve

I ‘T’ vented the carb and removed the limit switch while I was in there, just in case.

can you please explain the whys and hows as to these mods to me please? i have an 05 dr650 and cant wait to get better set up for touring.
Cheers Nick

The later DRs in some (all?) markets have an electrical, limit, switch on the BST40 carb that tells the ignition when full throttle is applied. Presumably it retards the ignition at some high revs. It doesn't seem to make a noticeable difference and it just clutters up the carb. It also has the potential to jam up and perhaps create other issues. Disconnecting it causes no problems, and removing it from the carb cleans up the carb. One less thing to go wrong if removed.

The RHS of the carb has a breather hose that does just that. It goes down under the engine and equalises the pressure in the carb. When going through water, the bottom of this hose is blocked, and the carb stops breathing properly and can result in a stall which isn't nice in the middle of a deep water crossing. T venting is to install a T fitting near the carb and run a second hose up. I ran mine up under the tank. The stock BST40 isn't too bad for stalling, but its an easy mod to do. Its also worth putting a filter on the top hose, else some dust will find its way into the carb. A small fuel filter works fine.

The FCRs like I've fitted are really bad for stalling when the vents get wet. The FCRs have 4 breather hoses and already have a version of T fittings. What I did here was to take the 2 upper hoses and run them up under the tank and behind the headlight. For a filter I used the original small round black filter from the BST40, the one that vents the diaphragm and lives on top of the airbox. You know about that one, right? Needs to be serviced when you do your air filter, or at least checked. If they clog up, or don't filter properly, you'll have carb problems.

Steve

So now at almost 47,000 kms and nothing much to report other than routine servicing. The last valve check at 40,XXX involved 1 inlet valve being adjusted. This is the first one, it was just at, or below, min clearance.

The Pirelli Scorpion Rally used on the front now has over 7,000 kms on it and will likely go to at least 10,000 kms. A very good tyre, stable in sand, cuts through ball bearing gravel, doesn't shred on the rocks, and good enough on the bitumen too. Its also got a stiff sidewall which helps reduce rim damage and pinch flats. They wear evenly with mminimal to no cupping, and keep a square edge. I have another in the shed to replace this one with and feel this is the perfect front tyre for me on the DR650.

The T63 I used for the Flinders trip lasted just over 5,000 kms but did worry me abit as some of the tread blocks started to separate from the carcass. Stayed intact, but... It only happened on the rhs, and for about 1/3 of the tyre so presumably a quality control issue. This tyre was made in Czechoslovakia, presumably at the Mitas factory. I have another in the shed which is made in Thailand. We shall see. At $110 they are much cheaper than the seemingly equivalent Mitas E09 at $150+.

The V Rubber VRM140 was not very good. Lasted 2,400 kms and I couldn't wait to get it off. Unstable, and only predictable in the sense that it was unpredictable. Got better as it wore down though. It was also a 120 90 18 which was/is a very small tyre, more like a 100 100 18. I note that a good mate of mine, whose judgement I trust likes the 130 17 on his DR, and it certainly doesn't slow him down. Their 130 18 is too big for me with my 18" rim and longer travel shock. A 120 80 18 606 is the biggest tyre I can use, it just kisses the underside when bottomed.

So right now, for road biased travel, the E07, for mixed riding, the E09 or T63, and for more off road, the 606 up back all matched with the Scorpion Rally up front is where I'm at.

Steve

Thanks very much steve for the reply. muchly apprieciated. I'll do both at my next service.
cheers Nick.
Ps and you have just made my tyre choices a whole lot easier too. ta

No worries.

ER70 just posted this about the scondary filter, with pics:
http://www.advrider.com/forums/showpost.php?p=18843899&postcount=82

Thanks to judge Sidetrack Bob for the accolades. I think he liked the suspension, but maybe it was the patina of crud? Plenty of other worthies too, so no doubt a tough decision.





Steve

looks good mate.

Shame about the dr650 its sitting on

Yeah, bit of a catch 22 though as to be eligible for the trophy, that's what was needed

I assembled this table as a summary of my comments above, so might as well post it here too:

<table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="456"><colgroup><col style="mso-width-source:userset;mso-width-alt:4973;width:102pt" width="136"> <col style="width:48pt" span="5" width="64"> </colgroup><tbody><tr style="height:15.0pt" height="20"> <td class="xl68" style="height:15.0pt;width:102pt" height="20" width="136">Rears</td> <td class="xl69" style="border-left:none;width:48pt" width="64">Mud</td> <td class="xl69" style="border-left:none;width:48pt" width="64">Gravel</td> <td class="xl69" style="border-left:none;width:48pt" width="64">Rocks</td> <td class="xl69" style="border-left:none;width:48pt" width="64">Sand</td> <td class="xl69" style="border-left:none;width:48pt" width="64">Life</td> </tr> <tr style="height:14.25pt" height="19"> <td class="xl67" style="height:14.25pt;border-top:none" height="19">Heidenau K60</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">70%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">90%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">100%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">80%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">85%</td> </tr> <tr style="height:14.25pt" height="19"> <td class="xl67" style="height:14.25pt;border-top:none" height="19">Mitas E07</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">50%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">80%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">80%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">80%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">100%</td> </tr> <tr style="height:14.25pt" height="19"> <td class="xl67" style="height:14.25pt;border-top:none" height="19">Mitas E09</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">80%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">90%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">100%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">90%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">55%</td> </tr> <tr style="height:14.25pt" height="19"> <td class="xl67" style="height:14.25pt;border-top:none" height="19">Michelin T63</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">80%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">90%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">100%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">90%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">55%</td> </tr> <tr style="height:14.25pt" height="19"> <td class="xl67" style="height:14.25pt;border-top:none" height="19">Dunlop 606</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">100%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">100%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">95%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">100%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">40%</td> </tr> <tr style="height:14.25pt" height="19"> <td class="xl67" style="height:14.25pt;border-top:none" height="19">VRM 147</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">90%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">80%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">90%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">80%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">30%</td> </tr> <tr style="height:12.75pt" height="17"> <td style="height:12.75pt" height="17">
</td> <td>
</td> <td>
</td> <td>
</td> <td>
</td> <td>
</td> </tr> <tr style="height:15.0pt" height="20"> <td class="xl68" style="height:15.0pt" height="20">Fronts</td> <td class="xl69" style="border-left:none">Mud</td> <td class="xl69" style="border-left:none">Gravel</td> <td class="xl69" style="border-left:none">Rocks</td> <td class="xl69" style="border-left:none">Sand</td> <td class="xl69" style="border-left:none">Life</td> </tr> <tr style="height:14.25pt" height="19"> <td class="xl67" style="height:14.25pt;border-top:none" height="19">Pirelli MT21</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">90%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">90%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">100%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">85%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">100%</td> </tr> <tr style="height:14.25pt" height="19"> <td class="xl67" style="height:14.25pt;border-top:none" height="19">Pirelli Scorpion Rally</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">95%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">100%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">100%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">100%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">100%</td> </tr> <tr style="height:14.25pt" height="19"> <td class="xl67" style="height:14.25pt;border-top:none" height="19">Mitas E09</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">50%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">60%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">85%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">70%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">60%</td> </tr> <tr style="height:14.25pt" height="19"> <td class="xl67" style="height:14.25pt;border-top:none" height="19">Dunlop 606</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">100%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">100%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">90%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">90%</td> <td class="xl70" style="border-top:none;border-left:none">70%</td> </tr> </tbody></table>
Note that I haven't got any criteria for sealed road operation, they are all good enough. The bit of an outlier is the Heidenau which I haven't used as their 18" doesn't suit me, but their 130/17 did service on another DR650 on our last Flinders loop and so the ratings relate to that.Also did some time on a KLR that I'm familiar with, so happy to include it. The other rears are all 18s for me, but have suitable 120 or 130 17s for more normal DRs.

Just fitted a fresh E07 rear and Scorpion Rally to head for Qld next week and expect to do about 6-6,500 kms. Tagging along with some mates to Julia Creek. They are then going on to the OCR, but I have to be home sooner, so that's as far as I get this time, probably....

Over a year ago I posted the above solution to my grip wiring after breaking the resistor. Worked OK, but the low heat setting wasn't great, and the high of course was high as normal.

Doing the sums tells why. The grips are about 8 ohms each, so are 18 w at 12 v so 36w total. When in series, its 16 ohms total for 9 watts total, so 1/4 the power for the series connection compared to the parallel. OK for a low setting, just, but something in between like the resistor solution would be nice too.

I could revert back to the original resistor solution, or install a flasher relay for a similar 18w total outcome.

On my 1400GTR I have some Oxford grips with a variable output controller which work well and gives me more options for heat settings. I thought it'd be nice to have something similar on the DR, its winter here now! I didn't want to lose the ability to use any dirt bike grips I like, so wanted to keep the existing heaters.

I tried to track down a variable controller and came up with some options, ending up with Tusk kit from eBay for $54 delivered. 10 days from the US. Just a controller only was more expensive. The kit is nominally for a snowmobile or ATV, so both grips are the same size inside, but didn't want them anyway, so cut them off and used the controller and harness attached to my original grips. 5 heat settings now.



The kit spread out.



The controller mounted up next to the headlight switch.


Steve

As mentioned above I was supposed to heading to Queensland right now, but failed, and am now back home

Rode the DR to Sydney on Weds, now Fri, to meet up with Tim who was heading to the OCR. My plan was to travel with him and meet up with a few others coming up from Vic at Hungerford, then on to Julia Creek, then separate, and while the rest kept heading north for Cape and the OCR, I would then head for Townsville solo and catch up with a mate then home. I expected to be away for 2 weeks, and no longer, as have family stuff to do in a couple of weeks. I expected to do 6-6,500 kms and didn't have time to get to the OCR this time.

Prior to the off, I did the usual service and once over which this time involved a new chain and countershaft sprocket, a new cush drive bearing, and fresh oil.

I had previously noted the counter shaft seal starting to weep just a smidgen, so I changed it last week before I did the oil change. I knew it was coming, and had a fresh seal in the shed waiting. And because I knew I would be changing it, had another as well, so as to have a spare just in case after the change. I figured 47,000 kms for a cs seal was OK too.

I did the seal swap easily enough, bash the one in situ a bit to shrink the outer and lever it out, as I've done numerous times in the past on other bikes. All good. Press in the new seal with a large socket so it sitting just right, with the outer face in line with the bevel in the housing. No leaks, confirmed by a test ride. The ride was also the warm up for oil so I could dump it. Fresh Delo 400, and a filter, and good to go.

So loaded up the bike Tuesday, and ready for the off Wednesday. Out to the shed after the frost melted with plans to head to Sydney the back way. Roll the bike out of the shed, lock the shed up, and kiss SWMBO goodbye. It was her one morning off a week from work. I fired up the mighty DR and killed the choke after 15 secs or so like normal, and clicked into gear and off. A couple of seconds later, my attention was drawn to SWMBO yelling STOP, STOP, STOP.

What had I forgotten?

"Look down" she said. There was a large puddle of oil. "Bummer" I thought, "What's broken now? What have I stuffed up?"



Above is a pic of the oil trail. Bike was started on the concrete where most of the oil was dumped, but cleaned up before the pic.

'Hmmmmm, popped the cs seal" I suspected.

Rolled back into the shed and sure enough, the cs seal had popped. What to do? I pushed the seal back in, and wondered. I put 4 'dabs' epoxy metal on it to act as a keeper, and a couple of old seals I had lying about with the same ID. My thinking was that if it popped again, at least it couldn't fall out like it'd just done. Top up with 500 ml of oil and head north, and hour later than planned. No worries, just go a more direct route, and keep looking down at my left foot.

And wonder what might have been if my wife hadn't been there to wave me off. Fried engine? Crash on the twisties outside my gate with a rear tyre covered in oil :huh

Stopped and checked it a couple of times enroute, and no problems, so one of those things?

Met up with Tim as planned, and next morning, Thursday, yesterday, 08.00, and we are off. I needed to top up with fuel, so 10 kms or so up Windsor Road, pull in to the servo, fuel up and have a look at the cs sprocket area and it wet with fresh oil.

BUGGER

So it seems that on 2 consecutive cold starts, the new seal has popped. Not catastrophically this time as my old seal spacers had worked as intended, but what to do? Tim said there was a bike shop a bit up the road at Windsor, so we pulled in there. I had the sprocket cover off, and the cs sprocket off just as the service manager for Hawkesbury Honda, Eric, came over to see what was going on. I had my back up fresh seal with me, and he seemed impressed. He took control, and I watched. After some discussion and checking, he inserted the new seal, commenting that it seemed to go in too easy. Fired it up, and all good.

What now concerned me was that we were heading over the mountains, west and north, and further away from help, spares, and my shed. I didn't have another cs seal, and what if it popped tomorrow on the next cold start. And why was it popping on cold starts?

Seals can pop from too much crankcase pressure which is something that happens at higher revs. This had gone with a cold engine at just over idle revs. A check of the oil flow diagram by Eric confirmed that the cs area gets pressurised oil.



You tend to get max oil pressure when the oil is cold, so, dunno? No issues with the housing in the case, as confirmed with Eric, and using Suzuki genuine seals. Eric checked the crank breather too, and all good, so WHY?

I sent Tim on his way solo and headed south for home, keeping an eye on my left foot.

Cruising down the Hume in case I needed mobile phone contact to call SWMBO to come and get me, I contemplated the problem, and kept an eye on my left foot.

I decided I would manufacture a seal 'keeper' so it couldn't pop again. I called in to Dahlitz in Queanbeyan and ordered a couple of new seals and then headed over to Fyshwick to get some 90 mm nylon bar. Cruising the Hume, I had developed a plan.

I arrived home about 17:30, and surprised SWMBO when she got home a few hours later.

Out to the shed this morning and unload the bike, then have a good look, and refine the plan.



Above you can see that the second new seal was still in place and there is some evidence of the 'dabs' of epoxy I'd applied, that had mostly 'gone walkabout'.





Above is similar pic, but if you look closely, you can see the old seal spacers I put in place, just in case.





Above is the cardboard template, then a version in 2 mm Al sheet, and then a slighlty different version, and hopefully the final one, Al in 3 mm sheet. Right to left.





Above is the 3 mm version bolted up. I've used the top 2 bolts from the gear shift cover, and the rear crank case bolt. A bit tricky getting all the spacers the right length. The crank case bolt is actually replaced with a stud I made up. Everything seems like it'll clear the chain, and the cover bolts up like normal.

Tomorrow, I plan to machine up some nylon that'll attach to the plate and lock the seal in place.

In summary, with nothing other than a fresh cs seal and oil it now pops them on a cold start. The oil is the same I've been using in it for the last 40,000 kms. I don't want to glue the seal in because that can be problematic when I have to change it later. I also recall that the big DR thread has had reported a few cs seals popping too, but I don't recall any analysis, or what the posters did to fix it.

More to come.
Steve

Seems like its not as uncommon as I'd thought:
https://www.google.com.au/#hl=en&gs...335&bih=853&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.&cad=b

http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=811368

nice one steve that's not coming back out

my berg sucks the crank seals in cause I run a second reed valve over the upper hole near the intermediate shaft, loctite 401 works good with rubber to ally gotta be quick to press them in though.

The countershaft is the lower of the 2 above, and the output is on the left. The section shows the sprocket and its retainer, and the chain.




Having a closer look at the lube system. Apparently we have a pressurised feed to the countershaft from the crank case between the seal and bearing. The above diagrams don't seem to confirm that though. It then goes into the shaft and out at appropriate locations. I'm not convinced its blocked in any way, but I guess I can't be certain. I think the ease with which the replacement seals went in is the clue. There is also no play in the cs bearing FWIW. There is however no doubt that there is pressurised oil behind the seal.

Whizzing up some spacers for the plate to get it the right distance from the crankcase. Each of the 3 bolts/studs used needs a different length to get it to line up properly.




Paring off the 90 mm diameter retainer. Note the 'lip' that will protrude into the case and make contact with the seal, which sits <> 1 mm below/inside the case.




The nylon bit now bolted with countersunk 5 mm screws and nylocks to the plate. Nice and snug.




Should be enough clearance, <> 1 mm from the pins on the RK EXW which is 1 mm overall wider than the DID VMs used previously. Might not fit with a stock 525 though, I'm using a 520.




All back together, started up, and the seal is retained.

What's next, 3rd gear?

Cheers Bushy, it will not blow out now.

I recall my old IT490 used to suck base gaskets into the transfer ports. Wasn't much meat there. I ended up making my own 'different' gaskets that stayed put. Always something to fix

I didn't want to glue the seal in place the other day as it would have delayed my departure waiting for it to go off, not that I got where I'd planned anyway

If I had glued it in, cleaning up next time I have to swap the seal would increase the chances of getting crud into the cs bearing and inside, so I wasn't keen on the idea. No doubt a possible expedient fix though, and if I couldn't figure a out a suitable keeper, would have happened.