Stuff to irk you.

I was at the ducati dealer asking questions to the owner. He was as helpful as a guy who counts money could be. He was nice too, but some of the things he said kind of irked me.

We were discussing motorcyles (of course) and he said people who ride harleys are riding toys. They cant turn, they're slow, and useless pieces of flash. I should believe him because he rode a harley for 15 years and now he never wants to ride it again... actually that didnt irk me, but i thought it was funny.

What did irk me was later on he was praising European made bikes. They are a work of science that americans cannot manufacture. (maybe he meant dont manufacture as his english was iffy). He said that the harleys were pretty much the same parts as my daelim daystar in terms of quality. Now I really dont know jack shit about motorcycles compared to you guys, but I dont think HD would sell bikes at the price they do and use some dog shit parts.

Even the mirrors on the ducati were tested to have 0% distortion whereas a harley would have 19%... Its an effin mirror, there's not much science or technology involved in making a flat reflective surface.

This Panigale is made from science (ok my memory might be taking liberty with what he meant at this point), this carbon fiber, is all the highest quality material (implying it such material can only be european). Chinese, american and Korean companies can make a motorcycle but they cannot create a comprehensive high perfomance machine with such design and materials. You see this plastic on the panigale? Its dupont plastic specially made for this bike.... Really dude? Americans are unable to design such a bike but an american company supplies the material for it.

I hate on my home nation of America more than most, and to be fair again this guy wasn't directly hating on America, so much as he made it come off as American companies have not and are incapable of producing such a fine bike which is a sneaky way of dispensing the haterade. I gotta question this guy's intelligence. American companies produce software and CPUs the world uses, our passenger jets fly all over the world. The world relies on our GPS systems, which used out rockets to get into space. An american discovered/invented carbon fiber and then refined it to be a viable material decades ago. And just to be clear I dont think American products are superior, my point is that developed nations are equally capable of developing high end machines, and further, not fully developed nations such as india and thailand are capable of manufacturing them.

when the rubber hits the road, it's the quality of the experience that matters, not what the fenders are made of. Obviously many Americans prefer the Harley experience to the Ducati experience. Carbon fiber and desmo valves really don't mean much when the spped limit is 55mph, however comfy ergos and a nice sound makes for a sweet ride.

You should have asked him why Ducati can't make a fuel tank that will last more than a couple of years.

Forgot to mention that he thought the L twin and Boxers were out of the league of the americans. Thats when I thought this dude was off his damn rocker. Its piston technology that over a century old. Im not sure why BMW is the only company with a boxer engine but I doubt its because no one knows how to build it.

You're right, it really doesnt matter when the speed limit is 55. He knocked my bike a little bit saying the experience on a ducati cant compare (and it probably cant if I had more time to ride a nice bike), but when he said that all I could think about was getting from point A to B. I suppose if I had a $100,000+ salary I'd be spoutin off too.

OOOOOOHhhhh SNAP!

What happens? Does the plastic crack? Does it rust inside? Serious question.

Ural makes a boxer.

the people at the local BMW/Ducati dealership are the same way. I guess if you're going to pay way too much for a product, you have to be able to convince yourself that it's worth the difference.

As for me, I lustedf after BMW for many years. Finally got one, kept it two years. That cured me. I still like BMW, just not any better than I like anything else. All designs have their merits.

There's stupid blind 'brandism' in every group. Harley and BMW, Apple and Android, Democrats and Republicans, once you start talking to one of 'the converted' you're not going to get anything remotely resembling the truth from them. That sounds like what you've got with this guy.

I say all that from the perspective of someone that absolutely loves European bikes and has no interest in any current Asian or American bikes. That's not because I have anything against them, I'd love to buy (for example) an American made bike that both spoke to me aesthetically and performed technically, but for now that doesn't exist. To me, currently the European manufacturers are the leaders. They have all the reliability of the asian bikes (this has not always been the case) but still keeping the design abilities they've always been known for. If that changes though and one of the others manufacturers makes something that appeal to me, I'll certainly give it a chance.

Having said that, I don't think that Harley's or the Japanese bikes are 'crap'. Harley has probably the best fit and finish of any bike (at it's price point) available. The chrome is beautiful and their paint jobs are quite nice for factory jobs. I think they pay too much attention to style and not enough to substance though and as such I find their bikes gutless and uninteresting. The Jap bikes are technically quite sound but to me they are uninspired and cheap looking. I don't 'lust' after any of them, I don't loose myself in the details of any of the designs, even though technically they are quite good.

Now these are all my opinions and as such, very much like an asshole. But I'd never say that Harleys were cheap crap, or that Jap bikes were terrible. Neither of those statements is remotely true. I also don't think it is necessary to talk down one brand (or country) in order to complement another. So take what anyone says that denigrates everything else with a handful of salt. You don't need to talk down a good product to exalt a great one.

Feel free to buy a bike from this guy, but don't buy everything he's sayin'

He's a salesman. Maybe a little more hardcore than most, but still a salesman.

His job is to convince you his product is superior to all the rest, and get you to buy it.

Well, sounds like he turned you off, so he needs to adjust his spiel a little when it comes to Americans. Probably works just fine for the natives.

Truth is not an issue, sales are.

Honda has made a very popular boxer for the past 37 years. Many of those years it was made in USA.

I hate guys like that. I usualy start talking crap about their bike and pissing them off. I am not brand loyal. Heck I am about to pick up a 2011 Ninja 1000.

Those Ducati's are perfect now that they edited the owners manuals to extend the time between valve adjustments.

Only the Italians could do that.

Mine hasn't changed .0015 thou in over 5 years.

That's a lot of wharrgarble for what is essentially a qualifying aside.


To the OP - I don't really trust anything negative that a bike salesman says about bikes that he doesn't sell.

And don't trust anything positive he has to say about bikes he does sell.
Maybe just don't trust anything he says at all.

I don't know why anyone gives a crap about what a bike salesman says, in terms of bike quality or whatever.
In 2012 if you can't do your own homework and arrive at a choice, then you deserve to have your head filled with the above misinformation. Use the Google machine. Use Duckduckgo. Use ADVrider.

The only thing that the sales guy should be consulted on is "what's the out the door price?" That's it.

You should have avoided listening to his words and instead listened to his message, which quite simply was:

"Regardless of which motorcycle you choose to buy, you don't want to buy it from me. Our business relationship is built on falsehoods from the ground up".

Bashing the competition with lies and baseless claims (I love the claims about mirror distortion) thinly represented as "fact" doesn't sell bikes. Getting someone excited is what sells bikes. Function, image, sound, look, feel, emotion. Different buyers place different priority levels on each of these items, but if you appeal to the majority of the buyer's list you sell the bike. Conversely lies, misrepresentations, and statements claimed as fact that can easily be dispelled with a simple google search on serve to make the salesman look like a fool and lose credibility.

Buy somewhere else.

"Indiana"...mention that particular Ducati work of art if you happen to stop by that dealership again.....

I do have to say it is fairly annoying how the only motorcycle companies in America which actually care about technology are producing electric bikes (Zero, Brammo). I would love to buy an American made sport motorcycle. I don't care about air cooled twins. That leaves me exactly zero options (well, I guess there is that one Buell).

http://www.erikbuellracing.com/

They're getting ready to announce some stuff, building up a dealer network etc.