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Old 11-19-2011, 02:51 PM   #1
ClearwaterBMW OP
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ALREADY need new front tire for my hack... please help choose a BETTER one for me

my '11 GS Adventure came with a Metzeler Tourance (like most others)
http://www.metzelermoto.com/web/cata.../enduro_street

i sent my bike to be hacked when it had 2,100 miles on it...
the front tire looked almost brand new

i've ridden almost 2,000 miles with the sidecar attached
there aren't many twisties, but i DO ride in a "spirited" manner whenever i can (which isn't that often where I live)
so....
tire pressure kept at recommended values... checked often
so....
i looked at my FRONT tire today
75% GONE
what on earth?
2K miles with the sidecar attached?
that doesn't sound correct to me
maybe most of you here know otherwise

so.....
regardless of that
i'll be buying a NEW tire IN THE VERY NEAR FUTURE
i sure as hell won't be buying another tourance
and.... so few tires are made in the WEIRD GS-Adventure front tire size
so....
what tire would YOU suggest i buy that is FAR HARDER but still good?

thanks, as always, in advance
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'11 R1200 GS Adventure with a DMC M72DX Sidecar
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Old 11-19-2011, 03:34 PM   #2
leejosepho
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I have yet to ride on three wheels, but I have a Michelin Crusader rear on the front of my bike that will soon be a tug, and it took over 150 miles on two wheels just to wear the mold nubs off the tread even in the center of the tire.

While remembering I am still just a wannabe hack driver, I would suggest a reduction in your toe-in. According to one well-seasoned builder who has helped me review my own design, 3/8" to 1/2" toe-in should be sufficient ... and then adjust your lean if your rig still pulls toward the chair. But if you have too much toe-in, your front tire must continually fight it back.
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leejosepho screwed with this post 11-19-2011 at 03:49 PM
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Old 11-19-2011, 03:54 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leejosepho View Post
I have yet to ride on three wheels, but I have a Michelin Crusader rear on the front of my bike that will soon be a tug, and it took over 150 miles on two wheels just to wear the mold nubs off the tread even in the center of the tire.

While remembering I am still just a wannabe hack driver, I would suggest a reduction in your toe-in. According to one well-seasoned builder who has helped me review my own design, 3/8" to 1/2" toe-in should be sufficient ... and then adjust your lean if your rig still pulls toward the chair. But if you have too much toe-in, your front tire must continually fight it back.
appreciate your thoughts, lee
thank you
will contact jay and barry about this very issue
the rig seems to ride great
but.... something must be causing that unusually quick front tire wear

again..... thank you
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'11 R1200 GS Adventure with a DMC M72DX Sidecar
'14 R1200 GS & '14 R nineT (march, 2014)
Live life like you mean it... but take your family and friends (and DOGS) along for the "ride"
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Old 11-19-2011, 04:17 PM   #4
bikeridermark
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Got over 20,000 miles on my Harley front tire with chair on. Not so much on the rear.....about 5,000.
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Old 11-19-2011, 04:43 PM   #5
BeeMaa
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ClearwaterBMW View Post
i looked at my FRONT tire today
75% GONE
what on earth?
2K miles with the sidecar attached?
I remember asking you about this after you got your rig back but you didn't have that many miles on it.
I unfortunately do not have any suggestions in this area.
But I will keep an eye on this thread to see what you do, as I will be going through the same thing in the not too distant future.
Good luck.
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Old 11-19-2011, 05:59 PM   #6
Boondox
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Something's not right, Greg. I got 8500 miles out of a cheap Shinko 705 radial front, and 10,000 plus on a Tourance rear mounted on the hack. My wear issue has always been on the tug's rear. Shinko, Tourance, Anakee all lasted less than 4000 miles. Have had a BF Goodrich Radial T/A car tire on the tug for the past 8k and probably have that much left...though without rain grooves in the tread design it tends to hydroplane in the wet stuff. I'll probably go with a Vredestein when it wears out.

That Tourance you wore out so fast wasn't the softer EXP by any chance..?
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Old 11-19-2011, 06:21 PM   #7
ClearwaterBMW OP
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holy crap....
i DO have the Tourance EXP on my bike
is it softer?
is THIS the reason?
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'11 R1200 GS Adventure with a DMC M72DX Sidecar
'14 R1200 GS & '14 R nineT (march, 2014)
Live life like you mean it... but take your family and friends (and DOGS) along for the "ride"
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Old 11-19-2011, 06:24 PM   #8
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i just wrote jay and barry over at DMC an email
maybe they can shed some light on this issue
hmmmmmm
not sure what to think
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'11 R1200 GS Adventure with a DMC M72DX Sidecar
'14 R1200 GS & '14 R nineT (march, 2014)
Live life like you mean it... but take your family and friends (and DOGS) along for the "ride"
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Old 11-20-2011, 04:24 AM   #9
Boondox
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ClearwaterBMW View Post
holy crap....
i DO have the Tourance EXP on my bike
is it softer?
is THIS the reason?
User reports on the EXP consistently complain about the short life span, especially on commuter bikes that don't lean. I now run an Anakee II (harder compound on the contact patch) on my GS and they appear to be wearing very well. I'll probably put one on the GSA/sidecar rig.
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I got a sidecar to travel with my dog. He never complains, is delighted to be with me, approves of my dietary choices, is a social butterfly who helps me meet folks, appreciates a good beer, snuggles better than my wife, and hangs on my every word as if it's the most profound thing he's ever heard. TravelsWithBarley.com
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Old 11-20-2011, 05:14 AM   #10
ClearwaterBMW OP
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boondox View Post
User reports on the EXP consistently complain about the short life span, especially on commuter bikes that don't lean. I now run an Anakee II (harder compound on the contact patch) on my GS and they appear to be wearing very well. I'll probably put one on the GSA/sidecar rig.
the annakee II is a great tire
i appreciate your experience with it, as well
thank you
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'11 R1200 GS Adventure with a DMC M72DX Sidecar
'14 R1200 GS & '14 R nineT (march, 2014)
Live life like you mean it... but take your family and friends (and DOGS) along for the "ride"
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Old 11-19-2011, 06:39 PM   #11
hackman
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front tire

I strongly suspect setup. I'm running Dunlops, and they seem as good as any. I get 16,000 miles plus on the front and 5,000 miles on the rear. I think I got about 35,000 miles on the last hack tire. No reason why you should be using up your front that quickly.

Love to get a car tire on the rear, but can't find a 16" narrow enough. Is anyone running Duros? I see RTW Doug ran them on the chopper. If they're good enough for Doug...

Good Luck.
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Old 11-19-2011, 09:41 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hackman View Post
I strongly suspect setup. I'm running Dunlops, and they seem as good as any. I get 16,000 miles plus on the front and 5,000 miles on the rear. I think I got about 35,000 miles on the last hack tire. No reason why you should be using up your front that quickly.

Love to get a car tire on the rear, but can't find a 16" narrow enough. Is anyone running Duros? I see RTW Doug ran them on the chopper. If they're good enough for Doug...

Good Luck.
thanks for your thoughts and help
i really appreciate both
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'11 R1200 GS Adventure with a DMC M72DX Sidecar
'14 R1200 GS & '14 R nineT (march, 2014)
Live life like you mean it... but take your family and friends (and DOGS) along for the "ride"
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Old 11-19-2011, 06:41 PM   #13
windmill
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Hey Greg,

This is mostly conjecture on my part, but it seems builders and dealers sometimes put excessive toe-in to make rigs feel more directionally stable then they really are for new riders.

My dealer set up my rig with 3/8" toe-in, it did track very straight and stable, but really went through tires. Now I run 0 toe-in, it does yaw more under throttle and braking, and does tend to follow the contours of the road more, but is easier to steer through the twisties, and the tires last much longer.

Once you get used to it and learn how to use it, a sidecars inherent instability can be a useful tool to control your rig.
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Old 11-19-2011, 09:36 PM   #14
ClearwaterBMW OP
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Originally Posted by windmill View Post
Hey Greg,

This is mostly conjecture on my part, but it seems builders and dealers sometimes put excessive toe-in to make rigs feel more directionally stable then they really are for new riders.

My dealer set up my rig with 3/8" toe-in, it did track very straight and stable, but really went through tires. Now I run 0 toe-in, it does yaw more under throttle and braking, and does tend to follow the contours of the road more, but is easier to steer through the twisties, and the tires last much longer.

Once you get used to it and learn how to use it, a sidecars inherent instability can be a useful tool to control your rig.
the thing is...
i'm not even sure how to effectively "0" the TOE-IN...
now my "mechanical ignorance" will show very strongly
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'11 R1200 GS Adventure with a DMC M72DX Sidecar
'14 R1200 GS & '14 R nineT (march, 2014)
Live life like you mean it... but take your family and friends (and DOGS) along for the "ride"
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Old 11-20-2011, 05:27 AM   #15
leejosepho
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Quote:
Originally Posted by windmill View Post
This is mostly conjecture on my part, but it seems builders and dealers sometimes put excessive toe-in to make rigs feel more directionally stable then they really are for new riders.

My dealer set up my rig with 3/8" toe-in, it did track very straight and stable, but really went through tires. Now I run 0 toe-in, it does yaw more under throttle and braking, and does tend to follow the contours of the road more, but is easier to steer through the twisties, and the tires last much longer.

Once you get used to it and learn how to use it, a sidecars inherent instability can be a useful tool to control your rig.
Your actual experience certainly trumps any theory of mine, but I have been told 0 toe-in will result in wobble ... but then maybe that is actually just the seeming "looseness" you like to use as a control tool.

@Greg: Checking toe-in can be tedious and challenging with fenders and stuff in the way, but it amounts to placing straightedges or strings against the sides of the rear and chair tires and then measuring from one side to the other both at the front and the back (at the front of the front tire and at the back of the rear tire) to see how far the tires' tracks are from being parallel (0 difference).
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