ADVrider

Go Back   ADVrider > Bikes > GSpot > GS Boxers
User Name
Password
Register Inmates Photos Site Rules Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 02-03-2012, 08:03 AM   #1
rdcyclist OP
Beastly Adventurer
 
rdcyclist's Avatar
 
Joined: Sep 2004
Location: SanHo, NorCal
Oddometer: 1,052
NHSTA Opens Investigation into BMW Final Drive Failures

A number of us have been wondering when this would happen. Apparently you have to be pretty diligent to get the process started. This is crossposted from an Iron Butt Rally list:


After over 145 individual complaints filed between April 2001 and August 2011, the NHSTA has finally opened its first official investigation into the failure of crown gear bearings on BMW models equipped with the Paralever style final drive. NHSTA investigation DP12001 opened 1/20/12 is centered on 1999-2005 K1200LTs for now. But, if the findings are what we all believe they will be, the scope of the investigation should be expanded. I found the only way to get NHSTA to listen and focus was to pepper its director, David Strickland, with repeat letters as well as inquiries from WA Senator Patty Murray who chairs the subcommittee over funding for the NHSTA. If you have had a final drive failure on your Paralever equipped BMW, and have NOT already reported it to the NHSTA, I urge you do it now.

You will need your VIN, (est.) date of failure and mileage. State your model as well. While they should be able to identify from VIN, their data was wrong 50% of the time. Specify if gear oil leaked.

www.safercar.org

or call (888) 327-4236

or mail to:

NHSTA

Office of Defects Investigation (NVS-210)

West Building

1200 New Jersey Ave SE

Washington DC 20590


In your complaint, select "Power Train" as the component and reference that you have had the same failure as described in ODI No. 10439549, and currently being investigated under Campaign DP12001.

Send an email to your Congressman and US Senator to follow up on your behalf as well.

Chris Cimino

_______________________________________________
rdcyclist is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2012, 08:54 AM   #2
WeazyBuddha
Carbon-Based Humanoid
 
WeazyBuddha's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2008
Location: RGV Texas
Oddometer: 4,390


Have not had my FD fail but am glad to hear this so I'm ready when mine fails. (I know, I know, most don't fail)
__________________
A drunk driver killed someone I love
WeazyBuddha is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2012, 09:01 AM   #3
GB
Mod Squad
 
GB's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2002
Location: Toronto, ON
Oddometer: 55,557
It's good to light a fire under bmw's butt... but i doubt anything will come of it..
__________________
ADV decals, patches & flag? Here
GB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2012, 12:05 PM   #4
Hawk Medicine
Coyote's Brother
 
Joined: Jun 2008
Location: NOR CAL
Oddometer: 3,303
Bmw rear drive investigation

I don't know how many of you have heard about this buy I found this imbeded in my BMW mail list this morning. Don't bother asking me for more info, I'm an Airhead rider! Just thought that this might help someone down the line:



-------- Original Message --------
Subject: [IBDone] NHSTA Opens Investgation into BMW Final Drive Failures
Date: Fri, 3 Feb 2012 07:46:00 -0800
From: Chris
To: 'IBDone list'



(IF SOMEONE COULD PLEASE CROSSPOST THIS LD RIDERS AND OTHER SITES, I WOULD
REALLY APPRECIATE IT)



After over 145 individual complaints filed between April 2001 and August
2011, the NHSTA has finally opened its first official investigation into the
failure of crown gear bearings on BMW models equipped with the Paralever
style final drive. NHSTA investigation DP12001 opened 1/20/12 is centered
on 1999-2005 K1200LTs for now. But, if the findings are what we all believe
they will be, the scope of the investigation should be expanded. I found
the only way to get NHSTA to listen and focus was to pepper its director,
David Strickland, with repeat letters as well as inquiries from WA Senator
Patty Murray who chairs the subcommittee over funding for the NHSTA. If
you have had a final drive failure on your Paralever equipped BMW, and have
NOT already reported it to the NHSTA, I urge you do it now.



You will need your VIN, (est.) date of failure and mileage. State your
model as well. While they should be able to identify from VIN, their data
was wrong 50% of the time. Specify if gear oil leaked.



www.safercar.org



or call (888) 327-4236



or mail to:

NHSTA

Office of Defects Investigation (NVS-210)

West Building

1200 New Jersey Ave SE

Washington DC 20590



In your complaint, select "Power Train" as the component and reference that
you have had the same failure as described in ODI No. 10439549, and
currently being investigated under Campaign DP12001.



Send an email to your Congressman and US Senator to follow up on your behalf
as well.



Chris Cimino

_______________________________________________
IBDone mailing list
IBDone@ibdone.org
http://ibdone.org/mailman/listinfo/ibdone_ibdone.org
__________________
Hawkdude

Hate rots the pocket that carries it.
Hawk Medicine is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2012, 12:31 PM   #5
Bill 310
Poser Emeritus
 
Bill 310's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2002
Location: Hopefully Upright
Oddometer: 3,007
Quote:
Originally Posted by GB View Post
It's good to light a fire under bmw's butt... but i doubt anything will come of it..
Well there is nothing like a little investigation in an election year.

I posted the note from Chris on our local Sport bike forum and added these two factoids

This is really good news for BMW owners. I have had rear drive failures on my 2001 GS, 2003 GS Adv and my 2008 K1200GT. My LT was written off before it had a chance to fail.

Fortunately they all were covered under the warranty due to BMW's 3 year / no mileage restriction on CDN bikes. This is BMW making marketing a no cost marketing benefit as a result Canada's 5-6 month riding season.

As Chris outlines in his email below, the initial investigation will be on the K1200LT's, expect more bikes to follow.The classic photo of the GS's rear drive on fire and melting is one of the great pieces of motorcycle photography.

Canadian recalls generally follow the US it seems.

So the issue that "never existed" is finally being investigated.


A couple of notes

2009 IBR

The four BMW final drive failures that occurred in the 2007 Iron Butt Rally are having
an effect on hardware choices this year. Another K1200GT rider, Jeff Earls, will actually be carrying a spare final drive with him. Long time BMW rider Eric Jewell has taken an even more effective step to minimize the risk of having his ride end with a final drive failure; he sold his BMW and purchased a Honda ST1300. Tom and Rosie Sperry, who have been riding BMWs 2-up for many years, have adopted the same strategy. After experiencing a final drive failure on their K1200LT following the last Iron Butt Rally,
they switched to a Honda Gold Wing.
While BMW continues to claim that there is no significant problem with its final drives, a number of long-time BMW riders disagree and are switching brands. BMWs reputation for building the most reliable motorcycles has been damaged within the long distance riding community.




There's a *very* extensive article in the September 2008 Motorcycle Consumer News magazine on the final drive failures.

Limited summary:

- BMW uses two different final drive systems: the older Paralever design, which is still used on the K1200LT, and the 2nd-generation "EVO" Paralever, introduced in 2004 and, used on most current bikes. EVO design is easily identified by the 50mm hole in the rear axle.
- From 1980 to 2000, BMW final drive failures were rare
- Starting in 2001 an increasing number of final drive failures started appearing on K1200LT and R1150GS models
- Most of those were on 1st generation Paralever bikes, although some were on EVO Paralever bikes.
- Of 38 Paralever-equipped BMWs in the 2007 Iron Butt Rally, 14 were R1200 EVO models. Of these four didn't finish due to final drive failure -- a 29% failure rate.
- In Sept 2006 BMW revised the service recommendation for final drives to include final drive oil change at the 600-mi service (previously was considered lifetime lubricated).
- In 2007 BMW increased the size of the pinion gear needle bearing on EVO Paralevers, and added a magnetic drain plug.
- BMW didn't publicize but extended the final drive warranty to five years on bikes sold after January 2007
- Owners can check final drive status by putting bike on center stand, grabbing back wheel at 12 and 6 o'clock positions and rocking back and forth. Repeat at 3 and 9 o'clock positions. On EVO bikes up to 1 mm of play measured at the wheel rim is considered normal. More is abnormal and might indicate an impending problem
- A better inspection inspection method is draining final drive oil and inspecting magnetic plug for metallic particles. If any uncertainty, the final drive must be removed and gears/bearings inspected and gear lash measured
- A survey on the BMW LT forum resulted in 174 reported final drive failures
- A separate survey resulted in 80 people reporting failures, of which 11 were EVO Paralevers
- So far no reported crashes resulting from final drive failures
__________________
Canada "It's a rough place, son. In fact, you have to puke twice and show your razor just to get in. Better grow some whiskers if you wanna go to Canada." Ronnie Hawkins when asking Levon Helm to join his band and play in Canada.
Bill 310 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2012, 12:50 PM   #6
Beemerlover
Gnarly Adventurer
 
Joined: Oct 2011
Oddometer: 294
Thumb Finally!

I can't believe the Flamers haven't jumped in on this since everybody knows that BMW FD's NEVER FAIL and anybody who claims otherwise is a lying crybaby & a whiney little bitch!

Seriously though, I think it's great that something is finally being done on an official level. If there, in fact, is no basis for these complaints, then it will be found to be a non-issue and that will be the end of it. Otherwise, BMW will be forced to diagnose and correct the design defect that's responsible for the problems.
Beemerlover is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2012, 12:54 PM   #7
Bill 310
Poser Emeritus
 
Bill 310's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2002
Location: Hopefully Upright
Oddometer: 3,007
Well now that it is being examined, I expect that the BMW family fratricide will be put on hold. After all those who claimed that it never happens will be possibly gain something of value.

The Goldwing and FJR ship jumpers will remain bemused and continue riding.




Quote:
Originally Posted by Beemerlover View Post
I can't believe the Flamers haven't jumped in on this since everybody knows that BMW FD's NEVER FAIL and anybody who claims otherwise is a lying crybaby & a whiney little bitch!

Seriously, though, I think it's great that something is finally being done on an official level. If there, in fact, is no basis for these complaints, then it will be found to be a non-issue and that will be the end of it. Otherwise, BMW will be forced to correct the design defect that's responsible for the problems.
__________________
Canada "It's a rough place, son. In fact, you have to puke twice and show your razor just to get in. Better grow some whiskers if you wanna go to Canada." Ronnie Hawkins when asking Levon Helm to join his band and play in Canada.
Bill 310 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2012, 12:58 PM   #8
mrt10x
Dumba$s Jarhead
 
mrt10x's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2008
Location: Woodland Park, CO
Oddometer: 3,189
A couple of questions??

Five year warranty on Final Drives sold after 2007?? True??

The test for play in the final drive as described.. you grab the wheel and try to move it how??
__________________
We are enmeshed in the cancerous discipline of "security." And in the worship of security we fling our lives beneath the wheels of routine - and before we know it our lives are gone.
mrt10x is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2012, 01:05 PM   #9
GB
Mod Squad
 
GB's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2002
Location: Toronto, ON
Oddometer: 55,557
Hold the wheel at 3 and 9 / 12 and 6 o'clock and try to move it towards you and away from you.. there should be no lateral movement.
__________________
ADV decals, patches & flag? Here
GB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2012, 01:06 PM   #10
mrt10x
Dumba$s Jarhead
 
mrt10x's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2008
Location: Woodland Park, CO
Oddometer: 3,189
Quote:
Originally Posted by GB View Post
Hold the wheel at 3 and 9 o'clock and try to move it towards you and away from you.. there should be no lateral movement.
Perfect ..thanks
__________________
We are enmeshed in the cancerous discipline of "security." And in the worship of security we fling our lives beneath the wheels of routine - and before we know it our lives are gone.
mrt10x is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2012, 01:07 PM   #11
GB
Mod Squad
 
GB's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2002
Location: Toronto, ON
Oddometer: 55,557
Be sure to break out the worry beads while doing this
__________________
ADV decals, patches & flag? Here
GB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2012, 01:10 PM   #12
mrt10x
Dumba$s Jarhead
 
mrt10x's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2008
Location: Woodland Park, CO
Oddometer: 3,189
Well with 5 or 6 faulty fuel strips, and a rear ESA shock that went at 15k, and both of the rubber boots on my final drive having pulled away from their housings on a couple of occasions, I am not real confident that my FD is in it for the long haul.
__________________
We are enmeshed in the cancerous discipline of "security." And in the worship of security we fling our lives beneath the wheels of routine - and before we know it our lives are gone.
mrt10x is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2012, 02:20 PM   #13
desmoface
Gnarly Adventurer
 
desmoface's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2005
Location: Mentor, Ohio
Oddometer: 299
I've always been a fan, but have to admit, the rumors of final drive failures have always kind of scared me. I know the faithful will downplay the problem, but where there's smoke, there's usually fire.

Steve
05 st3
00 sv6fity
desmoface is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2012, 03:10 PM   #14
JimVonBaden
"Cool" Aid!
 
JimVonBaden's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2005
Location: Alexandria, VA
Oddometer: 49,398
Quote:
Originally Posted by GB View Post
It's good to light a fire under bmw's butt... but i doubt anything will come of it..
This has been tried many times before.

Jim
JimVonBaden is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2012, 03:17 PM   #15
configurationspace
delooper
 
configurationspace's Avatar
 
Joined: Jan 2003
Location: Kanadia
Oddometer: 8,616
With the abuse I've put my FD through, I'm just happy it hasn't failed yet.
configurationspace is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Share

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

.
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


Times are GMT -7.   It's 02:03 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ADVrider 2011-2014