ADVrider

Go Back   ADVrider > Bikes > Thumpers
User Name
Password
Register Inmates Photos Site Rules Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 04-08-2012, 11:31 AM   #62596
shaddix
Banned
 
Joined: Mar 2012
Location: Central AL
Oddometer: 647
carb jetting Q

Hey guys! I looked at my spark plugs today and they were black. So going by this guide it says to run it at full throttle and check to see if they're black or white or tan as a first step to determining jetting needs. Now considering that my plugs are already black, will that mean that if it's too lean at full throttle they won't be white? Do I need to clean the plugs first before I test for lean/rich mixture?

Thanks!
shaddix is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2012, 11:43 AM   #62597
ER70S-2
Beastly Adventurer
 
ER70S-2's Avatar
 
Joined: Sep 2009
Location: SE Denver-ish
Oddometer: 5,917
Quote:
Originally Posted by shaddix View Post
Hey guys! I looked at my spark plugs today and they were black. So going by this guide it says to run it at full throttle and check to see if they're black or white or tan as a first step to determining jetting needs. Now considering that my plugs are already black, will that mean that if it's too lean at full throttle they won't be white? Do I need to clean the plugs first before I test for lean/rich mixture?

Thanks!
How old is your bike and how many miles? What's your gas mileage, has it gotten worse? If you've had the bike for a while the jetting may be fine. The two o-rings in the carb may be failing causing a rich mixture at all throttle settings. We spend most of our time on the needle circuit, so this would be the one start with. Since the USA bikes don't have an adjustable needle, you can't drop the needle one clip. This means that I'd check the needle for wear (smaller diameter would flow more gas) and check the needle jet for 'ovaling', another wear point on some bikes (larger hole, more fuel).
__________________
2004 DR650: 62,400 miles
2013 WR250R

SUZUKI DR650SE INFORMATION INDEX
Quote:
Originally Posted by Threewheelbonnie View Post
"BTW, I don't do style. It's a dirt bike, not some girlie dress-up thing." -
ER70S-2 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2012, 11:57 AM   #62598
sagedrifter
Southern Explorer
 
sagedrifter's Avatar
 
Joined: Apr 2006
Location: Jacksonville, Alabama
Oddometer: 1,412
Plugs should be a grey color, reminds me of graphite.



Sent from my GT-S5690L using Tapatalk
sagedrifter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2012, 12:18 PM   #62599
Potosi Joe
Gnarly Adventurer
 
Joined: Feb 2010
Location: Caledonia Mo.
Oddometer: 306
A+ to Procycle jet kit.

I installed my PC jetting kit with air box mod and drilled slide, installed a WR450R stock muffler (custom fit) with insert removed a couple weeks ago. Rode it yesterday over back-roads, gravel and some highway. Runs great. Fuel mileage was 53.8 mpg.
Potosi Joe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2012, 12:33 PM   #62600
sandwash
Beastly Adventurer
 
sandwash's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2007
Location: Flagstaff Az
Oddometer: 1,314
Tunning by spark plug color is alittle tougher these days,gas burns alot cleaner.Google it,alot different these days:arc(where,timming),) on eletrode,color (how many,heat range) on threads and the color on the base(inside,wide open) of the insolator.
__________________
97dr650
sandwash is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2012, 12:38 PM   #62601
Adv Grifter
on the road o'dreams
 
Adv Grifter's Avatar
 
Joined: Jan 2010
Location: Passing ADV Stalkers in California
Oddometer: 6,128
Quote:
Originally Posted by shaddix View Post
Hey guys! I looked at my spark plugs today and they were black. So going by this guide it says to run it at full throttle and check to see if they're black or white or tan as a first step to determining jetting needs. Now considering that my plugs are already black, will that mean that if it's too lean at full throttle they won't be white? Do I need to clean the plugs first before I test for lean/rich mixture?

Thanks!
You are running too Rich. Forget about Full throttle and all that. Black plugs means you are WAY on the rich side and wasting lots of fuel. After you solve the puzzle ... treat your self to NEW PLUGS.

What is your current jetting? (untouched from new?)
What is current altitude?
What air box configuration do you have? (Stock, modified ... or ?)
What exhaust? Stock or other?

An older/high mileage bike could have worn O rings (in float bowl, in float needle) Or could be restriction in air box or non stock Jets, clogged jet, torn rubber diaphragm, fuel or air leak.

Many put in a bigger (richer) Pilot jet. This is wrong. For the stock carb in almost any tuning configuration, the stock Pilot Jet is retained.

A totally stock DR650 will run very very lean. Plugs will be nearly White no matter the throttle opening. This is how the bike was meant to run to pass EPA and such. A Dyno Jet needle/Jet kit will let the Carb be the best it can be and still get decent fuel economy.

I would remove the Carb. Replace the nasty Phillips screws holding float bowl on with Allen head screws. Work slowly and carefully. Choke and Throttle cables come off. All vent hose removed, put out of way. Take Pics so you know how it all goes back.
Adv Grifter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2012, 12:53 PM   #62602
Aerocycle
Gnarly Adventurer
 
Aerocycle's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2011
Location: Oregon (The valley)
Oddometer: 233
Quote:
Originally Posted by jon_l View Post
My new boots are Gaerne Balance Oiled. I have wide feet and big calves. The boots were comfortable right out of the box.

Beautiful!!!
__________________
2006 DR650
Oregon Tag-O-Rama
http://www.advrider.com/forums/showt...=752387&page=3
Aerocycle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2012, 12:56 PM   #62603
Aerocycle
Gnarly Adventurer
 
Aerocycle's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2011
Location: Oregon (The valley)
Oddometer: 233
Quote:
Originally Posted by AST236 View Post
Michelin Anakee 2's on my '98.....Put a hundred miles on them today and like them a lot. Smooth, quiet and not bad on dirt roads.


I could be wrong here, but doesn't the axle shaft go through the other direction? Just something I noticed. Guess it wont make a difference if the spacers are placed correctly. But my Axle shaft is running through from the other direction. Maybe I screwed up....
__________________
2006 DR650
Oregon Tag-O-Rama
http://www.advrider.com/forums/showt...=752387&page=3
Aerocycle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2012, 12:59 PM   #62604
shaddix
Banned
 
Joined: Mar 2012
Location: Central AL
Oddometer: 647
edit:r emoved bad photos
e
I may be wrong about them being black, so I took some photos!



The other plug is like grey on one side and black on the other..

Quote:
Originally Posted by ER70S-2 View Post
How old is your bike and how many miles? What's your gas mileage, has it gotten worse? If you've had the bike for a while the jetting may be fine. The two o-rings in the carb may be failing causing a rich mixture at all throttle settings. We spend most of our time on the needle circuit, so this would be the one start with. Since the USA bikes don't have an adjustable needle, you can't drop the needle one clip. This means that I'd check the needle for wear (smaller diameter would flow more gas) and check the needle jet for 'ovaling', another wear point on some bikes (larger hole, more fuel).
The bike is an 09 with 11k miles. I get about 38mpg city, 46 highway ~70mph, moderate hills. I've only had the bike for three weeks. The previous owner rejetted it, I am not very familiar with carb construction and function even though i've read many articles. When I take it apart I'm sure the rest of your post will make sense to me!

Quote:
Originally Posted by sagedrifter View Post
Plugs should be a grey color, reminds me of graphite.



Sent from my GT-S5690L using Tapatalk
They might be grey, but they looked black to me

Quote:
Originally Posted by sandwash View Post
Tunning by spark plug color is alittle tougher these days,gas burns alot cleaner.Google it,alot different these days:arc(where,timming),) on eletrode,color (how many,heat range) on threads and the color on the base(inside,wide open) of the insolator.
doh........ I have more reading to do then :x


Quote:
Originally Posted by Adv Grifter View Post
You are running too Rich. Forget about Full throttle and all that. Black plugs means you are WAY on the rich side and wasting lots of fuel. After you solve the puzzle ... treat your self to NEW PLUGS.

What is your current jetting? (untouched from new?)
What is current altitude?
What air box configuration do you have? (Stock, modified ... or ?)
What exhaust? Stock or other?

An older/high mileage bike could have worn O rings (in float bowl, in float needle) Or could be restriction in air box or non stock Jets, clogged jet, torn rubber diaphragm, fuel or air leak.

Many put in a bigger (richer) Pilot jet. This is wrong. For the stock carb in almost any tuning configuration, the stock Pilot Jet is retained.

A totally stock DR650 will run very very lean. Plugs will be nearly White no matter the throttle opening. This is how the bike was meant to run to pass EPA and such. A Dyno Jet needle/Jet kit will let the Carb be the best it can be and still get decent fuel economy.

I would remove the Carb. Replace the nasty Phillips screws holding float bowl on with Allen head screws. Work slowly and carefully. Choke and Throttle cables come off. All vent hose removed, put out of way. Take Pics so you know how it all goes back.
The current jetting is unknown to me. The previous owner told me the previous previous owner had rejetted it and cut the airbox(the whole top of the airbox under the seat is gone, k&n filter). And after this the first previous owner(guy I bought it from) told me he put the next biggest main jet in. So I really have no idea how it's setup currently, and no way to find out unless I'm lucky enough that the parts are labeled what they are.

I'm probably 500 feet over sea level, central alabama.
Stock exhaust


I will give a shot at taking the whole thing apart today and maybe I won't tear it up

shaddix screwed with this post 04-08-2012 at 02:40 PM
shaddix is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2012, 01:52 PM   #62605
TonyTooTall
Adventurer
 
Joined: Apr 2012
Location: Anchorage
Oddometer: 20

DSC00083 by TonyTooTall, on Flickr



New to me, so much more fun that the street bike I use to have.

TonyTooTall screwed with this post 04-08-2012 at 07:27 PM
TonyTooTall is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2012, 02:07 PM   #62606
ER70S-2
Beastly Adventurer
 
ER70S-2's Avatar
 
Joined: Sep 2009
Location: SE Denver-ish
Oddometer: 5,917
shaddix:
Good pics, well lit, sharp focus, good macro.
But we want to see the porcelin coloring, please. Smaller would be good, for the guys still on dial-up. I think this is one of my original DR plugs, still lying on my desk.

__________________
2004 DR650: 62,400 miles
2013 WR250R

SUZUKI DR650SE INFORMATION INDEX
Quote:
Originally Posted by Threewheelbonnie View Post
"BTW, I don't do style. It's a dirt bike, not some girlie dress-up thing." -
ER70S-2 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2012, 02:22 PM   #62607
jon_l
Beastly Adventurer
 
jon_l's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2008
Location: Collingwood, Ontario
Oddometer: 2,974
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aerocycle View Post
I could be wrong here, but doesn't the axle shaft go through the other direction? Just something I noticed. Guess it wont make a difference if the spacers are placed correctly. But my Axle shaft is running through from the other direction. Maybe I screwed up....
You're right, the castle nut is on the right side.
__________________
'09 Honda CBF1000
jon_l is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2012, 02:29 PM   #62608
AST236
Beastly Adventurer
 
AST236's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2009
Location: Lower Alabama
Oddometer: 1,999
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aerocycle View Post
I could be wrong here, but doesn't the axle shaft go through the other direction? Just something I noticed. Guess it wont make a difference if the spacers are placed correctly. But my Axle shaft is running through from the other direction. Maybe I screwed up....
I put it back like it was when I got it.

Everything slid in place w/ no issues so I'm not sure if it makes much difference or not since the axle is just riding fore/aft in the slot in the swingarm.

Smarter people than me please jump in and tell me if I need to turn it around to avoid damage or falling on my arse....
__________________
I usually run out of talent before I run out of horsepower.

I don't like sand.
AST236 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2012, 02:32 PM   #62609
Adv Grifter
on the road o'dreams
 
Adv Grifter's Avatar
 
Joined: Jan 2010
Location: Passing ADV Stalkers in California
Oddometer: 6,128
Quote:
Originally Posted by shaddix View Post
I may be wrong about them being black, so I took some photos!
idle:
half throttle:
full throttle:
The other plug is like grey on one side and black on the other..
The bike is an 09 with 11k miles. I get about 38mpg city, 46 highway ~70mph, moderate hills. I've only had the bike for three weeks. The previous owner rejetted it, I am not very familiar with carb construction and function even though i've read many articles. When I take it apart I'm sure the rest of your post will make sense to me!
They might be grey, but they looked black to me

The current jetting is unknown to me. The previous owner told me the previous previous owner had rejetted it and cut the airbox(the whole top of the airbox under the seat is gone, k&n filter). And after this the first previous owner(guy I bought it from) told me he put the next biggest main jet in. So I really have no idea how it's setup currently, and no way to find out unless I'm lucky enough that the parts are labeled what they are.

I'm probably 500 feet over sea level, central alabama.
Stock exhaust

I will give a shot at taking the whole thing apart today and maybe I won't tear it up
Those plugs aren't too bad at all Maybe a tad rich? but far from BLACK. You could go down ONE main jet size (leaner) ... or go UP on the needle clip position to lean out a bit. But you don't need much. You are fairly close, IMHO.

If your air box is stock (top not cut open) then you could open it up and leave jetting as is. Doing this will also lean things out a bit. This may put you spot on jetting wise and MPG may improve too. Lots of back and forth, give and take balancing air / fuel mix.
Have fun.
Adv Grifter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2012, 02:42 PM   #62610
shaddix
Banned
 
Joined: Mar 2012
Location: Central AL
Oddometer: 647
Quote:
Originally Posted by ER70S-2 View Post
shaddix:
Good pics, well lit, sharp focus, good macro.
But we want to see the porcelin coloring, please. Smaller would be good, for the guys still on dial-up. I think this is one of my original DR plugs, still lying on my desk.

Oops. I didn't realize the porcelain was what we were looking for. I am probably in good shape then because they'r epretty damn white:



I was able to get the carb out.. I'm gonna take some pictures of it and post them and perhaps someone can tell me what's been done to it.....
shaddix is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Share

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

.
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


Times are GMT -7.   It's 09:46 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ADVrider 2011-2014