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Old 08-18-2012, 01:29 AM   #1
Red Dust OP
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Suzuki DL650 vs XT1200Z

Been thinking about a ST before it was even released but meanwhile I have been happy (still am) with my wee strom since it can hang out with the big bikes (XTZ, GSA e.t.c) fairly well in the dirt but it comes to a stage when you think it might be time for a change.
Would I miss a lot of things from my DL or would everything be bliss on the bigger bike?
Personally I do not like turbulence from any bike which I solved on the DL by removing the screen and that could be a problem on the ST as well.
Seat has not been good on the DL but can manage a couple of hours, guess it is way better on the ST?
Just wonder if it is really worth spending that extra cash for something that might just be a tiny bit better.
Maybe one day sooner or later I go and get myself the big Yammie.
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Old 08-18-2012, 01:59 AM   #2
GrahamD
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Previous DL1000 owner.

The S10 is more than a tiny bit better, I don't know where you got the idea about tiny. BUT here are a list of improvements as far as I am concerned.

1) Suspension. Adjustable. Good quality stuff, not quite Ohlins but pretty good assuming you are "average".
2) Motor. Depends on what you like I suppose, but the S10 just tends to be a twist of the wrist motor. It works well off road, on road at sane speeds. BUSA owners may miss the top end. Very linear (which some would call boring) after gear 3.
3) Brakes. ABS and UBS work on and off road, About 98% of riders / owners never bother disabling the ABS. The reviewers are the other 1%. They either think that the average punter is Ryan Dudeck or they never try it. They just have a big whinge. On road they are fairly powerful and progressive.
4) Off road capability. It is really an easy bike off road and very capable. You can carry big loads over lots of crap and feel confident the whole way. Just keep in the back of your head that you are on a big bike, occasionally that pops up and rears its head. Yes it has the occasional sleep but that usually requires mud or deep soft sand. (that's when it reminds you it's not a DRZ. Your main problem off road is going to be mental. You have to keep pushing and re adjusting yourself mentally. Many people find the bike intimidating at first but it's just a big Pussy Cat off road.

Both bikes are pretty tough and reliable. I wouldn't call 1 better than the other.
The S10 is easier to work on.

Where the S10 doesn't quite make it is in the twisties, It's biased toward off road and stability, similar geometry to a dirt bike so you have to put a bit more effort into changing direction. You will get used to that and not notice it too much after a while. The good part is the suspension and chassis allow you to just motor along without any thing much throwing you off line.

But as with all things, if a nuclear powered dirt bike is not your thing and you want to race, then it's not your bike.

Plenty of power all over the place but you are not going to win races on the tarmac with a mutlti or TEX. or off road chasing a KTM.

If you want to be king of the hill in one area it's not for you. If you want to do everything easily it's definitely for you.
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Old 08-18-2012, 02:45 AM   #3
Red Dust OP
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Cheers.
Maybe I should not have written tiny since I realize a lot of things must be better on the Yammie, I just meant when we go on dirt roads where I seem to be able to keep up with the DL.
My mate got one and he offered me to take it for a spin one day, a proper spin, I look forward to that.
When we go on tracks (worse than dirt roads) he seems to be able to go quite a bit faster, even faster than another mate on his GSA, that is a good plus in my book since I love to take my strom on dirt.
Really just need to justify that it will be up to AUD$15K better after trade in, will do the maths but by that time maybe a new ST has been released......
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Old 08-18-2012, 03:20 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Red Dust View Post
Cheers.
Maybe I should not have written tiny since I realize a lot of things must be better on the Yammie, I just meant when we go on dirt roads where I seem to be able to keep up with the DL.
My mate got one and he offered me to take it for a spin one day, a proper spin, I look forward to that.
When we go on tracks (worse than dirt roads) he seems to be able to go quite a bit faster, even faster than another mate on his GSA, that is a good plus in my book since I love to take my strom on dirt.
Really just need to justify that it will be up to AUD$15K better after trade in, will do the maths but by that time maybe a new ST has been released......
Buy a second hand S10 if you want to reduce the price differential. There's plenty of low km, farkled up and ready to be loved S10s out there on the second hand market.
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Old 08-18-2012, 03:31 AM   #5
Pecha72
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Originally Posted by GrahamD View Post
Yes it has the occasional sleep but that usually requires mud or deep soft sand.
Mud or soft sand is where a DL650 is a handful, too. But the S10 is even heavier.

Personally, though a lot of peoplee will disagree, I think their weight alone dictates that both of these bikes are quite street-biased.
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Old 08-18-2012, 04:40 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by Pecha72 View Post
Personally, though a lot of peoplee will disagree, I think their weight alone dictates that both of these bikes are quite street-biased.
The S10 is not "street Biased" it's heavy. The way the S10 is set up makes it easy off road until you have to physically hold it up. I can tell you from experience the Vee Strom feels a lot harder off road than an S10, and that's before you end up on the ground.

Look at the geometry of an S10 compared to the Explorer for instance.
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Old 08-18-2012, 03:31 PM   #7
Red Dust OP
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Both bikes might be street biases compared to a dirt bike but you be amazed where you can take these beasts!
I have taken the wee strom where people thought you can not go but suspension, ground clearance and myself have been taken a hammering, still going strong but can just imaging with the extra ground clearance, better suspension, ABS/TCC e.t.c. from the XTZ can do. Just if I ever fall the cost will be higher.
Can not wait until a dirt/fire trail test!
Cheers.
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Old 08-20-2012, 07:22 PM   #8
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Yes the 2nd hand market is tempting, seen a few around $16-$18K, but need to sell my wee strom.
Just been looking at one demo with the side panniers and sump guards from Yamaha, is that sump guard any good?
The benefit with a dealer is that finance, trade in e.t.c. is pretty smooth but of course you pay a bit extra.
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Old 08-20-2012, 07:54 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by Red Dust View Post
..., is that sump guard any good?
.
Not really. Think of it as a beefy stone guard and you won't be disappointed. Land the bike on it hard and you will be.

See this link that Jaumev put together for better options.
http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=804637
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Old 08-20-2012, 08:35 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GrahamD View Post
Previous DL1000 owner.

SNIP

If you want to be king of the hill in one area it's not for you. If you want to do everything easily it's definitely for you.
I'm a previous DL650 owner and GragamD hit the nail on the head. The only downside the Tenere has compared to the weestrom is fuel mileage. With the DL650 I got about 50mpg (21km/L) , with the Tenere I'm closer to 40mpg (17km/L).
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Old 08-29-2012, 07:44 AM   #11
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Yes that is one thing I really like about the DL (fuel consumption).

At most I got 520 km out of a tank but also had 320 km once so it can be thirsty in head wind 2-up full of gear.

Just hoping it is better than the DL regarding turbulence and hopefully does not have too many handle bar vibes.

Still not convinced to 100% that it is 2 X better price wise (in Australia the XT is roughly double the price) and that it can do so much less than a XT.

Have been shopping around and I`m getting closer but need that extra convincing.
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Old 08-29-2012, 11:08 AM   #12
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I've put 59k miles on my '07 DL650. I love that bike. It have mor eon road purformance than I can fully use, ( I ain't no peg dragger), and it has never failed to get me anywhere I needed get off pavement, (I'm not a dualsport rider, I don't seek out muddy single track).

But she's showing the miles. Front rim is dented, front header is dented, the exaust clamp under the oil pan rusted off, ect.

My Super T is now 2 weeks old. I wanted to up grade. I wanted ABS, traction control, shaft drive, and I wanted it on a bike that would give me the same confidents in the ruff. I am very pleased with myself for my choise. The S10 center of gravity realy does make it feel lighter than the Wee. I think it's low CG actually makes it feel more flickable it twisties,(though I'm still stragleing with proper gear selection). I haven't been off pavement much, (just did the 1st oil change this weekend), but it's giving me every indication it will do this even better than the Wee. Yes it is a BIG jump in price and WAY more bike than I can take full advantage of, IMHO it is "Best in Class" big bore ADV/Tourer.
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Old 08-29-2012, 02:25 PM   #13
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From a previous DL 1000 owner, if nothing more, the aerodynamics of the Tenere are far superior to the Vstrom. The Vstrom is hands down the scariest bike I ever rode in heavy winds/crosswinds. Way too many times was I almost blown off the road. I sold the Vstrom for that very reason, after trying every mod on the internet to try to correct the poor handling.
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Old 08-29-2012, 08:30 PM   #14
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There's no doubt the S10 is "better", but the new DL 650 has improved on the old one a LOT - and is also a lot lighter than the S10.
Most of the issues that have been mentioned (like aerodynamics) have been addressed in the 2012 DL, rear suspension is better (though not wonderful), and the front is actually good now.

Personally I'd rather toss a lighter cheaper bike down dirt roads than a heavier one costing twice as much - provided both were up to the job of course. That and the lower fuel use of the DL made it a clear winner for my riding.

I'm not bagging the S10 here - it's certainly better than a lot of the other contenders - but personally I didn't think it was enough better to justify the sticker price difference.

Pete
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Old 08-30-2012, 05:38 AM   #15
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Had the DL650A for 45,000 miles, and just Sold my Tenere with 15K. The Tenere was far more intuitive (to me) on hard dirt surfaces or rock...loved it, The DL really felt just as planted on groomed dirt, but on rocky or hard loose stuff the Tenere was just plain better (I say all that because there is ubiquitous sand here, aka kryptonite).

And bombing down the highway at 100+...that f'n Tenere was a time machine. Still, some reason, watching it pull away on Chip's trailer, I didn't care, had my fun with it, but it wasn't me.

So...picking up a 2012 DL650 tomorrow. Cannot wait. As mentioned, fuel economy, lighter...really happy with the plan.

My only beef is WTF with losing .5G of gas. Who thought that was a good idea. The only time you can have too much gas is when you're on fire.
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