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Old 09-23-2012, 01:09 PM   #211
EvilGenius
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RedRocker View Post
Saw these in Yellowstone, only shot them with a G11.
Is that the ceramic one that goes through metal detectors?
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Old 09-23-2012, 01:53 PM   #212
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Originally Posted by MillCreek View Post
^^^ _cy_, that is a very interesting jacket configuration on the JHP rounds. I don't recognize the load. Can you please share the ammunition specifics?
Box it came in said, Federal 158gr lead semi-wadcutter 357C. have not been able to find any more. very close to Gold Dot .357 158gr.

have only practiced enough with this round to establish point of impact is close enough to practice rounds. needless to say, recoil is fierce shooting out of an 11oz revolver. while not fierce as some folks rant with bleeding hands, etc. if you don't put in range time on a regular basis. you will have trouble with control.

would not want to hunt bear with .357. but would be confident using a .357 for self defense against a bear or other predator.


_cy_ screwed with this post 09-23-2012 at 02:16 PM
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Old 09-23-2012, 01:55 PM   #213
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Originally Posted by EvilGenius View Post
Is that the ceramic one that goes through metal detectors?
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Old 09-24-2012, 11:50 PM   #214
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B.C. man kills grizzly that attacked him

Hunter set upon by bear that knocked him down and crushed his jaw

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/britis...rt-nelson.html

Posted: Sep 24, 2012 4:41 PM PT

Last Updated: Sep 24, 2012 7:00 PM PT



Conrad Boyes is recovering at home from a broken jaw and hand and arm injuries after he was attacked by a grizzly bear. (Submitted by Paul Alberts)


...what a bunch of posers, all jackin' off over your pistolas.

You wanna know what it feels like?
You gonna be safe with your little hand cannons?

Run the video in the article, and listen to what it took, and then maybe put down the vaseline and stop pullin yourselves off over your 'hot hand-loads'.

Two rounds from a 12 gauge at point blank, and the bear still had time to chew on him.

Pistols!,....for fuck sakes, give your heads a shake boys.
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Old 09-25-2012, 10:00 AM   #215
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I'd still rather have a shotgun, but pistols/revolvers will absolutely get the job done.

As with any firearm shot placement is most important (followed closely by penetration IMO).

Any round that will fully penetrate through the torso of a bear will work, it's where it penetrates that really matters.

The only way to reliably stop any mammal instantly is the brain stem, but that's small and may be relatively well armored on a bear so your best bet really is to make as many holes in the heart/vascular system as possible. Even then you're still talking seconds to minutes before the animal loses consciousness from low blood pressure.
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Old 09-25-2012, 11:42 AM   #216
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Old 09-25-2012, 12:16 PM   #217
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In fall a bear will have 6 inches of fat on him and in extreme cases up to a foot on certain parts of his body. At best a shot gun slug will penetrate and do damage. A hand gun cartridge at best will penetrate the fur and hide and get lodged in the fat. All you have done now is piss him of.
When I shot a bear in my tent years ago it took 15 plus rounds of a mine carbine round out of a rifle before he expired.
The trophy black bear I shoot took 4 rounds of 30-6. One heart , one lung, a back and a neck shot. Till he expired. It was the neck shot that took him down.
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Old 09-25-2012, 12:46 PM   #218
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In fall a bear will have 6 inches of fat on him and in extreme cases up to a foot on certain parts of his body. At best a shot gun slug will penetrate and do damage. A hand gun cartridge at best will penetrate the fur and hide and get lodged in the fat. All you have done now is piss him of.
When I shot a bear in my tent years ago it took 15 plus rounds of a mine carbine round out of a rifle before he expired.
The trophy black bear I shoot took 4 rounds of 30-6. One heart , one lung, a back and a neck shot. Till he expired. It was the neck shot that took him down.
Yeah, for such a large animal that you're most likely going to be shooting in a rural setting I'd be banking more towards +P+ fmj type stuff in a large caliber.

Rifle & shotgun always beat handgun, but it's not always practical to carry one of those.
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Old 09-26-2012, 09:19 AM   #219
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Originally Posted by morerpmfred View Post
In fall a bear will have 6 inches of fat on him and in extreme cases up to a foot on certain parts of his body. At best a shot gun slug will penetrate and do damage. A hand gun cartridge at best will penetrate the fur and hide and get lodged in the fat. All you have done now is piss him of.
When I shot a bear in my tent years ago it took 15 plus rounds of a mine carbine round out of a rifle before he expired.
The trophy black bear I shoot took 4 rounds of 30-6. One heart , one lung, a back and a neck shot. Till he expired. It was the neck shot that took him down.
I watched a guy at a fish camp in Alaska skinning out the skull of a black bear that he shot nine times in the head with a .45 pistol. You could see where most of the bullets made a little red/black dent in the skull, but it was the last which went through an eye socket that apparently put him down. If a 250 lb black bear is that stubborn, I can imagine that a big griz would just laugh at a head shot with a pistol.
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Old 09-26-2012, 02:32 PM   #220
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Originally Posted by EvilGenius View Post
I'd still rather have a shotgun, but pistols/revolvers will absolutely get the job done.

As with any firearm shot placement is most important (followed closely by penetration IMO).

Any round that will fully penetrate through the torso of a bear will work, it's where it penetrates that really matters.

The only way to reliably stop any mammal instantly is the brain stem, but that's small and may be relatively well armored on a bear so your best bet really is to make as many holes in the heart/vascular system as possible. Even then you're still talking seconds to minutes before the animal loses consciousness from low blood pressure.
I listened to the video and it sounds like he probably had a sawed off shotgun, most likely semi-auto. It would have been hard to handle a pump with one arm and your chin in the bear's mouth, and forget a bolt gun. More recommendation for an auto 12 gauge or auto .300/.375.
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Old 09-27-2012, 07:58 AM   #221
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Not that I have any experience with this subject but I would want a easy to carry (low weight) and something that has penetration such as .44 Mag. My personal short list is the S&W 329PD.
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Old 09-27-2012, 08:16 AM   #222
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Ok, I know handguns aren't legal (for the most part) in Canada.

But what about RPG's?
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Old 09-27-2012, 07:13 PM   #223
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Originally Posted by doc_ricketts View Post
I watched a guy at a fish camp in Alaska skinning out the skull of a black bear that he shot nine times in the head with a .45 pistol. You could see where most of the bullets made a little red/black dent in the skull, but it was the last which went through an eye socket that apparently put him down. If a 250 lb black bear is that stubborn, I can imagine that a big griz would just laugh at a head shot with a pistol.
There was a guy in Alaska who shot a brown bear six times in the back of the head with full .44 mag loads (240 grain at the time) while it was attacking his fishing buddy, and every shot essentially bounced off the skull. The last place you want to shoot a large animal is in the head if all you had is a handgun.

The place to shoot a brown bear that is charging is the front shoulders then the rear hips. If your shot penetrates well enough it may break the bones in the shoulder and hips, thereby making it hard for the bear to move forward. Then you go for a kill shot with the lungs/heart. If you go for the kill shot first then the bear may live long enough to kill you.

That said, I spent some time in Alaska and Montana in areas where brown bears frequent (Kenai peninsula and GNP), and I never saw a single bear, much less had trouble with one. I saw plenty of sign, but no actual bears. On the Kenai I ran into a park service guy (and gal) and he was carrying a .458 Mag rifle. I was just carrying a .44 Mag handgun with 300 grain Barnes "bear loads" (1300 fps, heavy jacket JSP).

More people are killed or injured by moose in Alaska than bear. A lot of people who live there have large dogs, many of them partially intended as protection from bears. So they go walking the dog in the bush and moose stomp on the dogs think they are wolves, and sometimes also stomp on the owners too.

I doubt I will ever need a handgun for bear. I don't hunt predators, and the case where a bear attacks a human is just plain rare. Feral dogs yeah. Feral pigs - maybe (I would like to hunt feral pigs someday).
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Old 09-27-2012, 07:14 PM   #224
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Not that I have any experience with this subject but I would want a easy to carry (low weight) and something that has penetration such as .44 Mag. My personal short list is the S&W 329PD.
Good gun - I own one. I suggest you try one first - and without the wood grips (they come with rubber grips).
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Old 09-27-2012, 08:42 PM   #225
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After a bear attack no one has ever wished they had a smaller gun.

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