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Old 10-16-2012, 07:26 AM   #1426
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Originally Posted by wxwax View Post
A pretty discouraging race and if I'm right, it will be a pretty discouraging, and indeed boring, ending to what had been a fascinating and unpredictable season.
very boring..

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Originally Posted by wxwax View Post
I'll miss Bob Varsha, and David Hobbs I can easily tolerate. I won't miss Steve Matchett's filibusters, but he does provide great technical insight. Having watched NBC's Indycar coverage, I'm not optimistic that we'll get as good a commentary crew as we've had from Speed.
that's a shame... I figured you'd know
Maybe NBC will just pick up the BBC coverage & rebroadcast it like TSN does in Canada...
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Old 10-16-2012, 07:42 AM   #1427
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Originally Posted by g容g View Post


that's a shame... I figured you'd know
Maybe NBC will just pick up the BBC coverage & rebroadcast it like TSN does in Canada...



We wish. Not bloody likely if you ask me, they'll want to fuck it up all by themselves.
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Old 10-16-2012, 08:56 AM   #1428
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If the rule writers write rules that they can't enforce, why does a team that exploits that loophole get labelled a cheater?

ie: if the rule people can't prove something is illegal ... say a wing ... why can't a team use it?

Isn't it the responsibility of the rule writers to know how they'll enforce a rule when they write that specific rule?
good point...

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Seems like lots of angst is directed at certain teams when it should be directed against the rule writers / rule enforcers.

Isn't F1 supposed to be the place where cutting edge technology is applauded and praised?

Or does that only happen when the red team from Italy develops the cutting edge?
I think if it was Webber winning some of those races, personally i'd be more "OK" with it.. Vettel is just so..... Vettel



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With only a few races left, and with only a few points separating the top drivers, how is this season boring?

no more Tilke tracks in the middle of a swamp for the love of pete.... oh wait we have India, almost the same as Korea.\

hopefully it stays close until the end.
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g容g screwed with this post 10-16-2012 at 11:39 AM
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Old 10-16-2012, 10:23 AM   #1429
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Quote:
Originally Posted by geode View Post
If the rule writers write rules that they can't enforce, why does a team that exploits that loophole get labelled a cheater?

ie: if the rule people can't prove something is illegal ... say a wing ... why can't a team use it?

Isn't it the responsibility of the rule writers to know how they'll enforce a rule when they write that specific rule?

Seems like lots of angst is directed at certain teams when it should be directed against the rule writers / rule enforcers.

Isn't F1 supposed to be the place where cutting edge technology is applauded and praised?

Or does that only happen when the red team from Italy develops the cutting edge?

With only a few races left, and with only a few points separating the top drivers, how is this season boring?


So.. Human Growth Hormone... Steroids.. in sports.
If the licensing body can't find a good test for them, are they legal? If a baseball player has recently developed a load of facial zits and is hitting home runs out of the park where before he was a mid-level player, is nothing wrong if they can't detect what drug he's taking?
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Old 10-16-2012, 12:34 PM   #1430
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Quote:
Originally Posted by geode View Post
If the rule writers write rules that they can't enforce, why does a team that exploits that loophole get labelled a cheater?

ie: if the rule people can't prove something is illegal ... say a wing ... why can't a team use it?

Isn't it the responsibility of the rule writers to know how they'll enforce a rule when they write that specific rule?

Seems like lots of angst is directed at certain teams when it should be directed against the rule writers / rule enforcers.

Isn't F1 supposed to be the place where cutting edge technology is applauded and praised?

Or does that only happen when the red team from Italy develops the cutting edge?

With only a few races left, and with only a few points separating the top drivers, how is this season boring?

There's a subtle yet crucial difference between finding an unplugged loophole and breaking the rules.

The rule is that a wing must not deflect beyond certain parameters. The only way that it can be tested is in a static test. So any team that finds a way to construct a wing that passes the static test and yet flexes in conditions that cannot be tested is breaking the rules. It isn't the test conditions that create the rule, they are merely a means of enforcement.

There is a precedent. When Gordon Murray was working at McLaren he introduced a "cheat" whereby the car rose to meet minimum ride height at slow speeds and when stationary. The system allowed it to gain an advantage out on track. Murray was bearded about this and argued that the FIA was welcome to take measurements when the car was travelling at 180 mph. The FIA had to drop the rule because it was unenforceable. McLaren's advantage was reduced within a short time as the others adopted similar systems.

It was cheating by breaking the rules. That fact that the rule wasn't enforceable is not the issue, the same goes for the flexible wings. If teams are gaining an advantage by breaking the rules, that's cheating. If the FIA cannot enforce the rule, they need to drop it and allow all to develop flexible wings.
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Old 10-17-2012, 07:24 AM   #1431
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a little bit more Red Bull magic (trickery?)

LINK

love 'em or hate 'em you have to credit them for not resting on their laurels....
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Old 10-18-2012, 05:50 AM   #1432
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exploring the underside of an F1 car
nicely detailed


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Old 10-18-2012, 12:35 PM   #1433
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sounds like the Speed trio won't even be in Texas for the race....
that seems pretty lame...

I guess the studio in NC is a better place to call a race from?
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Old 10-18-2012, 12:58 PM   #1434
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hope for Ferrari after-all?

I sure hope so...
Quote:
F1 : This May Explain Alonsos Optimism

by Ernie Black - F1 GOGGLES on October 18, 2012
Alonso and Ferrari have been somewhat bullish lately, and for me, it has been difficult to understand why. It was clear in the last few races that Ferrari simply lacked the pace to keep up, let alone challenge Red Bull.
Why then, I kept asking myself, does Ferrari seem to be so optimistic? Why has Alonso stated that he will be in contention and will give Vettel a run for his money?
Have I miss something? It wouldnt be the first time Was I watching a different race from one which saw Fernando Alonso finish 13.9 seconds behind the leader in Korea? A leader, I might add, that had probably been taking it somewhat easy to preserve his tyres to ensure he finished the race.
Most of us might have noticed in the Korean GP, that Felipe Massa seemed to have a bit more pace than his team-mate. After speaking with a few friends in Pit Lane, I now know why. It is all clearer to me why there seems to be a sense of hope emanating from the prancing horses stable.
Felipes pace can be attributed to the fact that Ferrari were running a Red Bull style exhaust on his car. The team conducted this test in Korea and essentially used Massa as the proverbial guinea pig. Results were along expectations so they will be fitting the solution to Alonsos F2012 in India.
This alone may not be enough for optimism. We dont know exactly how many fractions of a second the new exhaust may be worth, or whether it is enough to challenge the charging Bulls. However, there have been reports that Ferrari has been using Toyotas wind tunnel in Cologne (in place of Ferraris own). The rumor is that tests being conducted there, are on Ferraris own version of DDRS.
It should come to us as no surprise that the Maranello team is developing this double drag reduction system. Although a little late in the game, the Italian outfit had been working on a similar solution since before the start of the season. Im wondering however, if the reason they never really adopted it, was because of the problems and inaccurate readings they were getting from the data recorded in their own wind tunnel.
Yet again, somehow, someone has dropped the ball in terms of quality control at Ferrari. How a team that competes at this level can have an ill-configured wind tunnel, for the second time (arguably 2008-2009) is beyond my comprehension.
Be that as it may, I am really hoping that these changes give Alonso the tools to challenge Vettel and Red Bull. I have no favorites in the title race, but I am a fan of racing. I dont want to watch Vettel just walk away with it. I want to see a fight for the crown.
Author: Ernie Black
Twitter: Goggs_on_F1
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Old 10-18-2012, 11:45 PM   #1435
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sounds like the Speed trio won't even be in Texas for the race....
that seems pretty lame...

I guess the studio in NC is a better place to call a race from?
Has the "Speed trio" been on-site for any races (including Indy from a few years back)? I don't recall it. They call the race from Charlotte studios and have Buxton on site, just like always, no matter where the race is. I don't think there is anything more (or less) "lame" about them doing the same for Austin.

- Mark
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Old 10-19-2012, 04:09 AM   #1436
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Has the "Speed trio" been on-site for any races (including Indy from a few years back)? I don't recall it. They call the race from Charlotte studios and have Buxton on site, just like always, no matter where the race is. I don't think there is anything more (or less) "lame" about them doing the same for Austin.

- Mark
well since it's "welcome F1 back to America" and their swan song calling races.. you'd think FOX might spring for a trio of plane tickets. The fact they call the race, looking at a TV, just like the rest of us, to me, seems pretty lame. YMMV
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Old 10-19-2012, 11:46 AM   #1437
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The fact they call the race, looking at a TV, just like the rest of us, to me, seems pretty lame.
They have one reporter on site to handle interviews, pit reporting, etc. Given how the TV feed provides a much better view of the race than any single position on the track, I don't think being on site adds anything to the actual race coverage, although it might encourage some pre-race interviews, round tables, color pieces about the track, etc. If they were on site, they'd be sitting in a studio commentating on the TV feed just like they do from Charlotte, not sitting by the edge of the track.

I couldn't care less whether they're on site. As you say, YMMV.

- Mark
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Old 10-19-2012, 11:58 AM   #1438
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Pretty sure they would rather be at the track versus calling the race from Charlotte.

For the first F1 race at Indy. I went with the KLR priced Grand Prix Tour that had us staying in Cincy and busing in for the qualy and race. The speaker for the Friday night meet and greet was Bob Varsha. So he was at least in the neighborhood for the first F1 race at Indy.
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Old 10-19-2012, 12:01 PM   #1439
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Originally Posted by markjenn View Post
They have one reporter on site to handle interviews, pit reporting, etc. Given how the TV feed provides a much better view of the race than any single position on the track, I don't think being on site adds anything to the actual race coverage, although it might encourage some pre-race interviews, round tables, color pieces about the track, etc. If they were on site, they'd be sitting in a studio commentating on the TV feed just like they do from Charlotte, not sitting by the edge of the track.

I couldn't care less whether they're on site. As you say, YMMV.

- Mark
yup... I guess we can agree to disagree.
I bet they'd rather be in Austin too.

I guess football & baseball, and moto GP guys should take a page from this and just stay at home & watch...

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Old 10-19-2012, 12:03 PM   #1440
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yup... I guess we can agree to disagree.
I bet they'd rather be in Austin too.

I guess football & baseball, and moto GP guys should take a page from this and just stay at home & watch...

I always suspected the MNF guys were just sitting on front of a green screen.
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