What Dual Sport should Honda build next

[Harvey Krumpet]

I would like to see a 21st century one of these. XLV 750R on a Jenny Craig plan.

Never knew they existed until this morning.

[RebelYell]

Thats a cool looking cycle that xrl 750.My take w honda going back to affordable wide world units for emrging markets like one other person stated here.I think the efi 650l or LC efi 650/700 xr since they already have the tooling,engines it wouldnt take too much work to dualsport one and if necessary could remap it to be lean for emissions to get it thru epa and DOT etc.

[WVa Dualsport]

When any of the big four build a 250 lb., 40+ HP dual sport with real, usable suspension I'll buy one. Until then I'll keep riding the KTM.

[blitchfield]

Just so I understand. We are talking about a bike that is a dual sport, fully capable offroad ( I think singletrack) while being able to hit the street? Not a big adventure bike meant for long hauls down endless mantained dirt roads, that are so heavy you need to ride in groups so you always have a buddy to help lift "her" back up?
I got my 99 xr400r plated. It is great, maybe the greatest.
I've owned an xl185s and an xr200r so I am a Honda guy
My wishes or areas to improve are
-gearing- needs a sixth to ride the slab ( I don't want to change sprockets)
-needs a bigger tank to go a bit further
-better lighting
-and the easy button cause kickin it after a day of trail riding does start to hurt
-possibly a few more cc's(450-500) if it could stay as reliable (one or two kicks cold, really)
-better brakes/ suspension (that many # are tough to slow down)
-less vibration at high speed on pavement ( but maybe thats just the choice in tires)

I like air cooled, I never had to push my bike after it started puking fluid when the going got tough and the ride slowed down.
I like a carb, it's tried and true, can be adjusted quickly and has never been a problem for me

If Honda could give me that bike at the dealer, ready to be plated I would be in a for a second round after my current ride
BTW The 450 rally is cool but I'm pretty sure those aren't a street legal dualsport (and arent they a kit??)

[WVa Dualsport]

Stuff the 400 EX air cooled mill in a 2013 CRF450 chassis, turn signals, lights, horn. Dead reliable, good suspension, lightweight. You'd sell he shit out of them.

[Sparrowhawk]

A street legal version of their Dakar bike of course.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2

[Grreatdog]

Originally Posted by WVa Dualsport

Stuff the 400 EX air cooled mill in a 2013 CRF450 chassis, turn signals, lights, horn. Dead reliable, good suspension, lightweight. You'd sell he shit out of them.

I would rather have a sixth gear than reverse. Otherwise I agree with you.

We are, however, talking about Honda. Therefore you can figure that engine in a dual sport motorcycle would weigh as much as the ATV by the time they got finished over engineering it.

[ADVNCW]

Originally Posted by itrack

Holy crap this thread has turned a 180 from the topic. I was away from the computer all day RIDING my bike. ADVNCW please go troll another thread, we now have 4 extra pages of crap that has nothing to do with the topic. If I hear you post one more bashing KTM post or another 5 page essay on a CRF230L then your going on ignore bud.

Was away after tiring of bs from punk immature insecure uneducated morons. Really, some here sound like the only thing in their life is a motorcycle and they think since they ride something and assume personal expertise then, they are special. Yea, but not like you think.

Some responses indicate that posts are not read and understood, obviously. And it is a lot of the same crew posting all over here who apparently have not much else in their life

The unrequited moto-toy parochialism shown by some here certainly prevents conversation by intelligent persons who ride for recreation.No worries, while many here seem to be mature and intelligent, too many are not worthy of engaging.

[xr400r]

Originally Posted by WVa Dualsport

Stuff the 400 EX air cooled mill in a 2013 CRF450 chassis, turn signals, lights, horn. Dead reliable, good suspension, lightweight. You'd sell he shit out of them.

Just a street legal xr400 would be great! I really don't understand Honda. They did it with the xr600 and made it a 650L. They still make the motor and it could have electric start. I do agree they should put it in the aluminum frame with updated suspension but damn.

I just don't know how you can make a crf230L and make a xr650L same bike for 20 years and not just make some minor changes to to the xr400 and make it street legal.....

They still make the motor!!!!!!! for 2013! I DON'T GET IT!

[Grreatdog]

Originally Posted by WVa Dualsport

When any of the big four build a 250 lb., 40+ HP dual sport with real, usable suspension I'll buy one. Until then I'll keep riding the KTM.

You mean like the one they sell in Australia? It is listed as 268 pounds ready to rock. I don't know if Hondas gain weight being shipped there like they do here. But Honda does make a bike ready to go head to head with KTM. But I guess they can't sneak it past our EPA and DOT.

Weight for the pic - tha AU site is SSSSSLLLLLLOOOOOWWWWW......

[Carter Pewterschmidt]

Originally Posted by davesupreme

some of these dorks get into their happy place, thinking that their 'super-simple' yama-hon-saki' will run forever w/no maintenance, since they bought it new at the dealer, and mama 'yama-hon-saki' knows all and will take care of them. and since these dorks need instructions on a crescent wrench, those KTM's, YZ's, KX's, etc. are inherently evil cause' it takes a few moves to change the oil, and you gotta do it a little more frequently.

It's not about the extra maintenance of a KTM, it's this...

http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=829642

http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=833552

http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=833998

http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=112127

http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=824174

http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=641042

http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=286283

http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=790639

http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=771480

http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=775015

http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=828931

http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=222515

http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=830017

When I worked at a shop we had a tech that used to work on KTMs and told me they were unreliable, but since I was on this forum before working there and reading these countless KTM problem threads I had already made that assumption. These are all threads updated within the last 2 weeks and most of these threads are relating to bikes within 5 years old. You don't see another make of single cylinder bike on this forum that have as many collective problem threads as KTM.

I ride a bike that's almost 30 years old so I know all about up keep. I keep my oil changed my chain clean, change fork oil, change brake fluid, adjust valves, etc, but these KTM problems are more than just low interval valve adjustments and difficult oil changes.

The KTM may be a more hi tech bike with a lot more good parts and loads more character than any Jap bike, but they're like a race bike, they need too much attention. The performance edge you loose when riding a jap bike you make up for when not spending thousands of dollars fixing or countless hours working on it. Not everyone has the time or money for that, or do they want to. It's not about knowing how to work on a bike, or being afraid of it, it's that some people don't want to spend valuable time doing it. Maybe if you have no other hobbies, or work 30 hours a week, or hate your wife and want to spend every weekend in the garage away from her, but that's not the case with everybody.

[joec63]

Originally Posted by Carter Pewterschmidt

The KTM may be a more hi tech bike with a lot more good parts and loads more character than any Jap bike, but they're like a race bike, they need too much attention. The performance edge you loose when riding a jap bike you make up for when not spending thousands of dollars fixing or countless hours working on it. Not everyone has the time or money for that, or do they want to. It's not about knowing how to work on a bike, or being afraid of it, it's that some people don't want to spend valuable time doing it. Maybe if you have no other hobbies, or work 30 hours a week, or hate your wife and want to spend every weekend in the garage away from her, but that's not the case with everybody.

That sums it up pretty good. I have no certain affinity for Japanese motorcycles it's just I've been down that road with high performance vehicles. And the word is temperamental, ie; moody and sensitive. Anyone that has had a built up hot rod knows all about it. While that may be part of the appeal at this point I'm not looking to constantly tinker with my motorcycle.

[Grreatdog]

Odd that my two KTM's have been the most reliable dual sports I have ever owned. But then I am posting from personal experience of having actually owned Kawasaki, Honda, Yamaha and KTM dual sports rather than hunting up other people's experience on the Internet.

That said I would buy any one of the Japanese makes again in a heartbeat if they ever figure out how to lose the pork and pull the plug out of the engine. I would also buy a Husky, GasGas or Beta if anybody sold them around here. You see, I am not brand sensitive at all. I am performance sensitive.

BTW our last ride was a UN of brands since we had all four Japanese brands plus my KTM:

[blake716]

Originally Posted by trailrider383

CRF500L with a six speed, 200 mile range and enough subframe to support some camping gear.

Originally Posted by Bullwinkle58

All they have to do is make the 450x fuel injected & street legal in CA. If they really wanted to make me happy, it would come with a transparent 3 gallon tank, 14t front sprocket, and a price under $8k. I'd have to do nothing to it. That's realistic, no?

Combine these 2 posts.

And they would hit the nail right on the head.

[ADVNCW]

Originally Posted by Grreatdog

You mean like the one they sell in Australia? It is listed as 268 pounds ready to rock. I don't know if Hondas gain weight being shipped there like they do here. But Honda does make a bike ready to go head to head with KTM. But I guess they can't sneak it past our EPA and DOT.

Weight for the pic - tha AU site is SSSSSLLLLLLOOOOOWWWWW......

That is nice. Thank you for posting that. I would buy that right now if I could if it would compare to say the WR250R for reliability, smooth, maintenance intervals etc.When I rode the WRR x 2 I just decided at least on dirt where I ride there was not enough difference with my 230L and not as good a powerband for steep tight and gnarly compared to my 230L.

Lots of talk about why can't the Japanese make bikes like KTMs...I think they already do that CRF-R/X etc. with a dual sport kit. I have studied online and looked at, discussed these options at the shops. No thanks, not a real dual sport.

As far as I see, hear, and read there is not a KTM as reliable as the much-maligned Honda etc dualsport. Someone on this Forum who has a lot of credibility posts of unresolved problems with a new KTM, as does my riding buddy with his KTM. I studied and shopped for a 690R, but cannot get past all of the problems posted and related to me by my friend, so I would rather ride a reliable bulletproof dog 230L. I do what I want on trails and dirt roads, 7000 miles since May unloaded and loaded- a little larger and 270 lbs would be nice.