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View Results: Which 4x4 SUV?
Nissan Xterra S 78 50.98%
Jeep Sahara Unlimited 75 49.02%
Voters: 153. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 11-14-2012, 07:36 AM   #31
longtallsally
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GP640 View Post
...It won't be too happy doing that very often either. The handling with 2000lbs behind it
isn't stellar.
Noisy too. I know "it's a jeep" but for what they ask for them, they could insulate the hard top.
WRONG! I've towed our ~2500 lb (empty), 3500 lb GVWR pop up for around 1k miles thus far. I don't even know it's there. I get up to 70 darn quick and with the trailer brakes, stop the same as unloaded. I drove up Monitor pass like total juvenile and was dumbfounded how everything cornered. AND for last weeks' camping trip, we got 18 mpg (admittedly going around 55 as per the limit in CA). AND did the Rubicon a few weeks prior with only minor modifications.

We paid $35k for ours and have another $3k in modifications (winch, armor, and VERY mild lift with stock tires). Shop around, and that is a darn competitive price for an SUV that will annihilate any other machine off road (save an H1).





I can't speak to reliability as I've only got 13k on it thus far, but I'm pretty ecstatic with it.

I also disagree with resale value stuff. Jeeps have high resale because of the name and as off roaders. Also, I think modified Jeeps are worth LESS as it means the vehicle was used as it was designed: beat up.

But the real conversation IMO is on how this is an apples to oranges comparison. The JK has no real peer any longer with the exception of a G Wagen in that no one offers solid front and rear axles. That makes a huge difference in drivability.

However, I think the Jeep makes a darn nice car. It has all the creature comforts like AC and power everything and remote entry and GPS and bluetooth and cruise and such. I actually think it's quite quiet as well. But I'm a bad example as I came from a heavily modifed YJ and was 2 wheels only for a few years, so any cage is going to be comfy and quiet to me.

Now I love my Jeep and will probably keep it for many years regardless of reliability, but if it was my wife and we already had a hard core off road machine, I'd get the more comfy and easier to drive SUV.
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Old 11-14-2012, 09:24 AM   #32
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Originally Posted by longtallsally View Post
The JK has no real peer any longer with the exception of a G Wagen in that no one offers solid front and rear axles. That makes a huge difference in drivability.
You should add -in the US.

There are the HD Landcruiser 105, the Landcruiser 70 series, the Nissan Patrol, The G Professional, Landrover Defender, Santana / Iveco PS10, .................................................. ...... and a few more.

All with solid axles and very capable Offroad.


Oh... and they're all available as Diesels :-D

Ok, enough with the trolling... Just had to. Sorry.
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Old 11-14-2012, 09:39 AM   #33
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You should add -in the US.

There are the HD Landcruiser 105, the Landcruiser 70 series, the Nissan Patrol, The G Professional, Landrover Defender, Santana / Iveco PS10, .................................................. ...... and a few more.

All with solid axles and very capable Offroad.


Oh... and they're all available as Diesels :-D

Ok, enough with the trolling... Just had to. Sorry.
Touché. We've got an '85 300GD we brought back from Germany, so I know what you mean. However, none of those diesels are sold here mostly due to emissions. Plus, the JK is sold in a diesel in Europe.
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Old 11-14-2012, 10:03 AM   #34
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Maybe you discussed this with the dealer, but I thought that the IPDM on most all Nissan trucks and SUVs was covered under some TSB. They are prone to failing. I have heard of several people on the Nissan forums who have had their trucks just shut off and lock wheels at 70 MPH

That said, I have owned two Titans and a Pathfinder, and had no issues with any of them. I would buy again. Well, maybe not the new 2013 Pathfinder. I know why they built it, but I do not like it.

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Originally Posted by rifflebox View Post
I own a 2005 Xterra S (4WD) and a 2011 Jeep Wrangler Rubicon - 2D. Both are 6-speed manuals. For everyday driving I'd take the Xterra. We have a rough access road to the house (lots of rocks and washboarding) and the Xterra has gone 125,000 miles without a rattle. We have had the front-end rebuilt once, but then we had the Dodge 2500 RAM front end rebuilt too because the road really beats them up. The V6 in the Xterra is way more powerful than the Jeep and it handles OK. I don't know if this is a common problem but we are having timing chains replaced on the Xterra ($1700) and the Integrated Power Distribution Module failed about a month ago ($750), but I think it is worth keeping since it has been paid off for years.

The Jeep is more fun for zipping around town and for serious off-roading. I haven't looked into what it would take to make the Xterra more off-road worthy but it is a good, well built, body-on-frame SUV and I'd buy another one. One more thing is that the Nissan dealer network has shrunk in the past couple of years and it is an hour to the closest dealer.

Either vehicle is good, but we have had good service from Nissan trucks and the Xterra.
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Old 11-14-2012, 10:18 AM   #35
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Touché. We've got an '85 300GD we brought back from Germany, so I know what you mean. However, none of those diesels are sold here mostly due to emissions. Plus, the JK is sold in a diesel in Europe.

I know. Wish I could have brought my Defender 110 tdi when I moved to the US a few years ago... :-(
Broke my heart but I had to sell it... Grrr.
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Old 11-14-2012, 12:34 PM   #36
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I have owned jeeps for 15+ years. I have wheeled and beat on them, build them and bled on them. They can be great offroad. They can be a giant pain in the ass as well.

The new pentastars have head issues and there is still QC issues on the rest of the vehicle. The 12-13 wranglers do feel better built than the previous chrysler turds.

I am a jeep guy, will probably always wheel a jeep of some sort.

That being said. Buy a ProX4 Xterra and forget about a jeep. Factory rear locker, all kinds of power, you can run 33's with a super cheap shackle/spacer lift. I have a close friend that has sworn by jeeps for longer than me, he ended up with an Xterra and beats the absolute crap out of it and has had ZERO issues with it. They will tow fine, especially with the 6spd. Very quiet inside, strong frames and very well built. You can pick up a 2012 pro4x right now for well under $30k. You will be very very hard pressed to find an Unlimited wrangler for under 40k.
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Old 11-14-2012, 05:27 PM   #37
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Hmm . . . my last Jeep had 285k miles on it when I sold it. Still ran just fine. My current Jeep has over 230k miles on it and still rides and drives as well as it did the day I drove it off the lot with 0 miles on it. The motor and tranny have never been apart. A couple wheel bearings, radiator hoses, and a thermostat is about it other than tires/oil/brakes. I don't know what this "dead" Jeep thing is you're talking about.

That said, my next vehicle will be yet another Jeep.
Hey OP! Buy a Jeep then. Good luck with it.
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Old 11-16-2012, 07:07 AM   #38
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I've owned a Sahara (shorty) and was happy with it (TJ). When the second baby came along, I needed something where I could fit two large dogs, two kids, and all the crap that comes with carrying all that. I looked in to the Unlimited Jeeps and came back less than impressed. Unless you go for the over the top, top of the line MOAB, the long wheel base makes them questionable in the dirt.

So, I ended up with an 05 Xterra (I think SE) that had a bunch of extras installed by the PO. Running boards, side step bumper, class III hitch, VDC, tint...A nice rig. I outfitted it with a set of General Grabber ATs and been happy ever since.

More civilized on road, certainly quieter than the Jeep. The only think I dislike is the shift on the fly for the 4H and 4L, and the VDC system. It applies brakes when slipping, when traction is lost, et cetera. I shut it off when I need to - I feel safer that way. because it makes the vehicle less predictable when sliding and such.

There is enough room for everyone, all the stuff we carry, and the gas mileage is decent 17-20mpg. Mine is a 6 speed stick, and the V6 has more oomph than I need. It will comfortably cruise at 40 in 6th gear (gas saver) or pass a car at 85 in 4th gear (quick passing to avoid danger).

Every winter, I get lazy with groceries and drive the rig up to my deck over a decent hill. The Jeep would push through 3ft of unpacked snow. The Xterra starts slipping at 2.5ft of unpacked snow. But, it will clear two feet without any problems. The hill shape/angle has a lot to do with it though.

Mine now has 90k miles on it and the only thing the truck needed was a new serpentine belt, belt tensioner, and a little electronic fan speed modulator. All in all, aside from gas and oil changes, it needed about $200 worth of maintenance in the past three years I owned it.

There are not many SUVs with a stick shift these days, and I will never buy a CVT vehicle.
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Old 11-17-2012, 12:20 PM   #39
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Lots of good perspective here.

When the time comes, we'll test drive both. I suspect that barring some unforeseen amazing deal she'll end up with the Xterra (especially once she drives a Jeep). Eventually I'd like to find an older CJ as a resto project...
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Old 11-17-2012, 12:35 PM   #40
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My brother in law has a diesel Pathfinder with 5speed manual transmission, and 4x4.
Shame it's not imported to the U.S.
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Old 11-17-2012, 12:55 PM   #41
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You will be very very hard pressed to find an Unlimited wrangler for under 40k.


I bought my new 2012 Wrangler Unlimited Sport for $25,257 out the door. To get an Unlimited up over $40k you would have to add every option, leather, nav, uprated stereo, dual tops, etc.


BTW, I love my new Jeep. It rides smoother, and is quieter inside than my other cage. (1990 Miata.) The 3.6 has plenty of power, even with the larger tires (33") I put on. You would want the optional 3.73 gears for towing, especially if you get the manual transmission. As for the tow rating, the Unlimited is rated to pull up to 4400-5000 lbs in just about every other country that it's sold in. IMHO, the 3500 lb tow rating came from the lawyers, not the engineers.
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Old 11-17-2012, 04:58 PM   #42
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I bought my new 2012 Wrangler Unlimited Sport for $25,257 out the door. To get an Unlimited up over $40k you would have to add every option, leather, nav, uprated stereo, dual tops, etc.


BTW, I love my new Jeep. It rides smoother, and is quieter inside than my other cage. (1990 Miata.) The 3.6 has plenty of power, even with the larger tires (33") I put on. You would want the optional 3.73 gears for towing, especially if you get the manual transmission. As for the tow rating, the Unlimited is rated to pull up to 4400-5000 lbs in just about every other country that it's sold in. IMHO, the 3500 lb tow rating came from the lawyers, not the engineers.
There isn't a new 4 door on a lot around here for under 40k. Totally loaded rubicon is over $46, shit the 2 door rubi was $38, neither had leather. There wasn't a door on the lot under $32. Might be the fact they are the only jeep dealer that survived in a 100 mile radius.
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Old 11-17-2012, 05:57 PM   #43
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There isn't a new 4 door on a lot around here for under 40k. Totally loaded rubicon is over $46, shit the 2 door rubi was $38, neither had leather. There wasn't a door on the lot under $32. Might be the fact they are the only jeep dealer that survived in a 100 mile radius.
You fail. I paid $35k for my Unlimited Rubicon and the ONLY options I didn't get were Leather, the top of the line stereo (I got the "middle of the road" one), and auto climate control. Now I did it correctly in getting some really good rebates, but the MSRP on the 2 door Rubicon "base" model, is $33k on the Jeep website, so I dunno, it sounds like that dealer is making the most of having a cornered market on a very hot vehicle.

Getting back on topic, I personally think the 3.73 gears aren't enough and am very glad for the 4.10s in the Rubicon. On the Rubicon trail I actually could hold the brakes in first gear climbing in 4 low- now the 4 to 1 T case also fixes that.
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Old 11-18-2012, 04:20 PM   #44
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You fail. I paid $35k for my Unlimited Rubicon and the ONLY options I didn't get were Leather, the top of the line stereo (I got the "middle of the road" one), and auto climate control. Now I did it correctly in getting some really good rebates, but the MSRP on the 2 door Rubicon "base" model, is $33k on the Jeep website, so I dunno, it sounds like that dealer is making the most of having a cornered market on a very hot vehicle.

Getting back on topic, I personally think the 3.73 gears aren't enough and am very glad for the 4.10s in the Rubicon. On the Rubicon trail I actually could hold the brakes in first gear climbing in 4 low- now the 4 to 1 T case also fixes that.

How the fuck do I fail, I didn't pay those stupid ass prices for a damn jeep. I am just posting what the dealer around here is asking. The xterra is a better vehicle for less money unless you really want wheel. 95% of people will never use a rubicon to its full potential.
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Old 11-18-2012, 06:18 PM   #45
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How the fuck do I fail, I didn't pay those stupid ass prices for a damn jeep. I am just posting what the dealer around here is asking. The xterra is a better vehicle for less money unless you really want wheel. 95% of people will never use a rubicon to its full potential.
Who gives a shit what a single dealer is asking for a vehicle. When's the last time you paid asking price?

I bought my 2009 Wrangler Rubicon brand new, nicely equipped with a hard top and a soft top, power equipment group, satellite radio, blah, blah blah. Sticker was about $32,000. I paid $23,000 after all rebates and discounts, and I got 0% financing for 4 years. Couple good negotiating skills, a friend in the business, and the best resale value of nearly any commonly produced car or truck, and knocking on the door of it's 4th birthday with 36,000 miles it's still worth more than I paid for it.

So um, yes. You fail.
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