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Old 12-09-2012, 09:07 AM   #6481
Sutherngintelmen
around the bend
 
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Joined: Mar 2009
Location: ATL
Oddometer: 1,209
Quit the squabbles, if you guys are going to beat the keyboard, how about drumming up something for me trouble shoot on this ill 690.

It's illogical to me that injector cleaning will make the difference given how well the bike runs as long as it's not hot. But I did it anyway.

I am curious for opinions on fuel pressure. In the first vid you can see some gas hit the floor but I'm mostly able to contain it. My thumb's not been calibrated to 55 psi -> should this firehose on me or does it seem right that I can stop it?

And for you who've been thinking of an injector cleaning it is quick and easy even for FI noob like me. I do wish I had access to ultrasonic that some of you like but since I have acetone and compressed air on hand that's what I used.

I'll take it out for a spin this afternoon - see what happens but don't think I've done anything helpful, just fooling around.

Here is the pressure vid - seems good enough?



Injector is right under the air box - disconnect electrics then out with the phillips head (butter - careful.)



Once removed you need a power source to open it if you are going to blow compressed air through it. I used a 12v battery from a drill.



You can hear the injector activate when you close the circuit.



I put it in some acetone then blew compressed air out.

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All pics < 6/30/12 deleted by Apple Now with SmugMug supporting ADV
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Old 12-09-2012, 09:08 AM   #6482
robm-951
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I posted a separate thread, but it go no love so I thought I'd try in this one for some ideas.

OK guys, I've got a tough one and I'm looking for suggestions on what else to check or try.

Background: 08 690 SMC 18k miles. it's had an intermittent problem for a while. FI light would come on while riding and bike would go into a limp home mode and run like crap: exhaust would get super loud and bike would buck and jerk when applying throttle. Exhaust would also get really hot. Turn off the bike, restart and problem would go away. checked the blinking FI light code and it put out 9 blinks - manifold pressure sensor circuit out of range. checked sensor, connection everything looked fine, problem keeps occurring. Replace sensor and intermittent problem still occurs during rides and goes away after restart. realize 9 blinks can also be atmospheric pressure sensor value out of range. unplug, clean connection, everything looks ok, put it back. problem goes away for a few months. problem comes back. I recheck atmospheric pressure sensor again and such but problem keeps occurring randomly then seems to go away. Problem comes back in august before a big ride. I decide to just replace the Atmospheric pressure sensor. New sensor comes in the day before the ride. I replace it and try it out for a bit and problem seems gone. 1st day of big ride, bike does it again. restart the bike and problem doesn't show up again until this month. Trying to ride home from work problem repeatedly shows up and now does it immediately after starting. I figure probably a good thing if it's not intermittent anymore because I should be able to track it down. stop at a railroad crossing for a train, pull over turn bike off and wait till train and traffic clear up. start up bike and it runs fine all the way home. I go out to start it up later to check it out and the bike does it again, perfect.

here is what I have tried so far:
got out the laptop with tune-ecu on it and hook it up. it shows code P0108 which is either Manifold absolute pressure 1 sensor circuit high voltage (bank 1) or Ambient air pressure sensor circuit high voltage. I look at the reading in tune ecu and it shows the map sensor reporting back 5v. I check with a pin and a multimeter to the signal line coming from the map sensor going into the ecu plug and it reads just under 3v. I also check out the APS and it reads just under 4v. both are within spec of 1-4.2 volts for these sensors. I try unplugging each sensor one at a time and verify no voltage coming in on either sensor signal line and tune ecu always reads 5v for MAP sensor. I run continuity tests on all wires running from the ecu to each sensor and everything looks fine. I figure it must be an internal short inside the ecu. I take my ECU and try it out on another bike and the bike runs fine and doesn't have any issues. I plug the ECU back into my bike and the proble still exists. Now I'm stumped and don't know what else to check. Oh, and I also cleaned all the ground and positive terminals I could find, starter relay terminals, starter terminal, and 3 frame grounds.

Anybody got any ideas?
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Old 12-09-2012, 10:35 AM   #6483
LOZ
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Joined: Apr 2004
Location: dreamy spires of oxford UK
Oddometer: 1,207
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harty View Post
Are you getting the new Evo 2 kit then Loz and taking off your current RR fairing??

you know mine mate,nothing wrong with it after thee years of gentle use

loz
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Old 12-09-2012, 10:36 AM   #6484
ktmmitch
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Joined: Sep 2009
Location: uk
Oddometer: 692
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sutherngintelmen View Post
Quit the squabbles, if you guys are going to beat the keyboard, how about drumming up something for me trouble shoot on this ill 690.

It's illogical to me that injector cleaning will make the difference given how well the bike runs as long as it's not hot. But I did it anyway.

I am curious for opinions on fuel pressure. In the first vid you can see some gas hit the floor but I'm mostly able to contain it. My thumb's not been calibrated to 55 psi -> should this firehose on me or does it seem right that I can stop it?

And for you who've been thinking of an injector cleaning it is quick and easy even for FI noob like me. I do wish I had access to ultrasonic that some of you like but since I have acetone and compressed air on hand that's what I used.

I'll take it out for a spin this afternoon - see what happens but don't think I've done anything helpful, just fooling around.

Here is the pressure vid - seems good enough?



Injector is right under the air box - disconnect electrics then out with the phillips head (butter - careful.)



Once removed you need a power source to open it if you are going to blow compressed air through it. I used a 12v battery from a drill.



You can hear the injector activate when you close the circuit.



I put it in some acetone then blew compressed air out.

We have also had problems with the "butter headed phillips screws",and produced our own Hex Head replacements,works with KTM tool kit T handle 8mm socket.

Hex Screw Kit Link
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Old 12-09-2012, 10:41 AM   #6485
Harty
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Location: Devon, UK
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LOZ View Post
you know mine mate,nothing wrong with it after thee years of gentle use

loz
gentle use my arse! You can swoon at my evo 2 kit once fitted
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Old 12-09-2012, 11:16 AM   #6486
Sutherngintelmen
around the bend
 
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Location: ATL
Oddometer: 1,209
Yep, that made absolutely no difference at all.

Good news is the issue is predictable and repeatable. Now just to wonder why.

Ran 15 minute idle test - puuuurrrrfect. Cut it off, put on the helmet start and stall. When temps hit 3/4, choke and puke.

Here's what happens

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There is a pleasure in the pathed woods, There is a rapture in the smoking pipe, There is chaos, where none intrudes, in the deep dell, with its thrills roar; I love not nature less, but bikes the more. Byron riding.

All pics < 6/30/12 deleted by Apple Now with SmugMug supporting ADV
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Old 12-09-2012, 03:21 PM   #6487
Aaron from Texas
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Joined: May 2010
Location: Texas
Oddometer: 489
Quote:
Originally Posted by mickd View Post
HI ALL
well i had my first PITA on the 690 today,having a nice easy ride in mt mee,the 690 stalled with a loud "POP" and a PSHHHHHHH, the sound came from under the air box area,so i had a good look around only to find the rubber boot had came away (see pic) and also the airbox was pushed back towards the battery
bike is a 2012,with less than 2000ks with a akro slip on inc akro mapping.

1, so what would make this happen,
2, is there a fix for this,cos i dont want it to happen again (PITA)
3, has there been a recall for this
Photobucket
This never happened to me on my bike until I replaced the intake roller rocker, and shimmed the intake valves on the tight end of the spectrum (Like, right at .07mm). After this, it happened several times. I only thought of the intake because of the recent work done, so I reshimmed the valves on the loose end of the spectrum, and vuala...

My thought on this is that at temperature, the valve clearance is so minimal, that at certain circumstances, the combustion of the engine happens while there is still a slight opening in the intake valves, and the energy follows the path of least resistance and blows off the throttle body. Just my theory...

But, it might be worth a shot to take a measurement of your intake valves. Mine hasn't happened once since my "fix."
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Old 12-09-2012, 03:21 PM   #6488
Biped
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Location: Oregon, Wet Side
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robm-951 View Post
I posted a separate thread, but it go no love so I thought I'd try in this one for some ideas.

OK guys, I've got a tough one and I'm looking for suggestions on what else to check or try.

Anybody got any ideas?
I had a similar issue a few moths ago, except mine showed a TPS error. Turned out to be a bad regulator/rectifier. Check the voltage at the battery and monitor while the bike is running. If you see a voltage spike above 14.4 volts it could be the RR. What happends is that the high voltage spike from the RR confuses the ECU via one of the sensors. In my case it affected the crank position sensor which artificially advanced the ignition timing causing the ECU to move the throttle body stepper motor resulting the the TPS sensor error..
My voltage spikes were above 15V but only for less than a second. Cycling the ignition ket seems to reset the issue until it occured again. I switched to a MOSFET RR and runs great now.
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Old 12-09-2012, 05:15 PM   #6489
robm-951
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Joined: Sep 2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Biped View Post
I had a similar issue a few moths ago, except mine showed a TPS error. Turned out to be a bad regulator/rectifier. Check the voltage at the battery and monitor while the bike is running. If you see a voltage spike above 14.4 volts it could be the RR. What happends is that the high voltage spike from the RR confuses the ECU via one of the sensors. In my case it affected the crank position sensor which artificially advanced the ignition timing causing the ECU to move the throttle body stepper motor resulting the the TPS sensor error..
My voltage spikes were above 15V but only for less than a second. Cycling the ignition ket seems to reset the issue until it occured again. I switched to a MOSFET RR and runs great now.
Thanks for the reply! I think I found the issue. It appears to be a bad connection inside the wiring harness ECU connector. I can make the problem go away and re-occur by futzing with the wire right at the connector. Anybody knows who manufactures these plugs for KTM?
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Old 12-09-2012, 05:24 PM   #6490
TheMuffinMan
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Location: Denver, USA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RoninMoto View Post
I realize they have their issues.. but really, what bike doesn't?
V-strom 650's












I my 690.
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Old 12-09-2012, 09:05 PM   #6491
Roadracer_Al
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Ha. Yeah. I bought a V-Strom 1000, and it has a ridiculous lean surge (EPA mandated, have to add a PowerCommander to make it run right), and an un-believable clutch chudder at low-to-mid RPM. Makes me wish I'd bought a Wee.
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Old 12-09-2012, 09:31 PM   #6492
tattewell
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Joined: Mar 2009
Location: Petawawa Ontario
Oddometer: 785
Quote:
Originally Posted by RoninMoto View Post
You might be right. On the other hand, there are quite a few people here who LOVE their 690. I realize they have their issues.. but really, what bike doesn't?

It might be wrong, but like others I take comments like this personally.
"Excellent attempt KTM, but you shit the bed on waaaaaay too many issues to attempt to fix"
It does not add to the conversation because it is broad statement/opinion of a problem with the only solution getting a different bike. For many in the US, 660 tenere, African twin, ect are not an option so we make due. When KTM stopped the 640adv, this became the next best thing. (better in my opinion)

This thread helped me quite a lot when prepping my RTW bike. I would hope that others can pull the GOOD information out and not be turned off to the 690 by the negative comments like yours. So if you want help with your specific 690 issues .. just ask

If not, I hope you have fun with your African Twin. You will never see me post in the AT forum my opinion about if its any good or not. Cheers. ride safe.
You're mostly right, however I didn't come her to "slag" the bike, I loved my 690 when I got it in 2009.

My opinion is given after 4 years of ownership. feel free to cut down any bike you've owned, I wont say anything about your opinion, provided you do it in the correct forum.

I sincerely hope your bike holds up, but after 6 years in production and a lot of the core issues with this bike have not been fixed by the factory, I call that shitting the bed for sure.

It can be a sweet bike, I was just voicing my frustration of another part fixed to have something else die.

I wish I could say with proper maintenance that there are no issues, but I change my oil religiously and my valves had just been checked when I went on a 5400km trip this summer to have the top end blow and leave me stranded on the side of the highway.

Who knows, maybe I got a Monday morning special.
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Old 12-10-2012, 12:43 AM   #6493
LOZ
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Joined: Apr 2004
Location: dreamy spires of oxford UK
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Harty View Post
gentle use my arse! You can swoon at my evo 2 kit once fitted
look forward to it mate

loz
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Old 12-10-2012, 01:18 AM   #6494
RoninMoto
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Location: In the mountains?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robm-951 View Post
Thanks for the reply! I think I found the issue. It appears to be a bad connection inside the wiring harness ECU connector. I can make the problem go away and re-occur by futzing with the wire right at the connector. Anybody knows who manufactures these plugs for KTM?
Let me send some emails. I think i'll have an answer for you this afternoon.
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RTW Ride Report --> http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=781893
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Old 12-10-2012, 02:13 AM   #6495
robm-951
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RoninMoto View Post
Let me send some emails. I think i'll have an answer for you this afternoon.
Awesome! Thanks!
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