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Old 12-18-2012, 06:58 PM   #301
danedg
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Joined: May 2008
Location: U-puku-ipi-sing
Oddometer: 6,225
Moto Patina

Crusty
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Old 12-20-2012, 12:37 PM   #302
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Chain Indeed



Everything came apart with no fuss, and upon initial inspection looks amazingly clean and in good order. The chain tensioner is certainly a lump though... It does nothing at this stage. It looks like it could be adjusted towards the chain for some tension, but I doubt it would last long. It looks like a rubber block (cracked) . Lord knows how long it was run without providing tension.

What should I be on the lookout for?
Chain stretch?
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Old 12-20-2012, 01:28 PM   #303
JonnyCash
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Joined: Jan 2011
Location: Midcoast, Maine
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I can't tell if things are good in there, but they certainly are a lot better than what I found on mine. The chain on mine was so stretched that you could almost make it touch the crank gear if you pushed it away from the tensioner. It must have been making a hell of a racket. Brace yourself for sludge nightmares when you pull the pan off. Mine was beyond belief.
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Old 12-20-2012, 05:24 PM   #304
danedg
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68 R60US, 74 MG Eldorado,
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Old 12-20-2012, 06:51 PM   #305
MZRider
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Joined: Oct 2007
Location: Western MD
Oddometer: 618
Quote:
Originally Posted by danedg View Post

Everything came apart with no fuss, and upon initial inspection looks amazingly clean and in good order. The chain tensioner is certainly a lump though... It does nothing at this stage. It looks like it could be adjusted towards the chain for some tension, but I doubt it would last long. It looks like a rubber block (cracked) . Lord knows how long it was run without providing tension.

What should I be on the lookout for?
Chain stretch?
For $83 you can replace both the chain and tensioner with better quality parts.
http://www.mgcycle.com/product_info.php?products_id=978
http://www.mgcycle.com/product_info.php?products_id=347
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'69 Guzzi Ambassador,'77 Yamaha XT500,
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Old 12-21-2012, 08:40 AM   #306
bk brkr baker
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I had this one for a short while. I traded another bike for it. It had been stored in a barn and kids or someone took a lot of parts off. This was in pre-Ebay days so finding parts was hard and expensive.



I was vintage racing and that soaked up most of my money so the Guzzi went to Steve Bennett seen here towing it away. One of the bikes I raced was Steve's 750 Ducati so it was O.K. that he got it.
But , I wonder, What if ?
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Old 12-22-2012, 03:14 AM   #307
England-Kev
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Originally Posted by bk brkr baker View Post

So that is what a sunny winters day looks like! it has been so long since we saw one, I had forgotton.
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Old 12-22-2012, 08:57 AM   #308
sjc56
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Oddometer: 1,171
Guzzi and a classic Saab. I have a 91 Vert.
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Old 01-01-2013, 01:23 PM   #309
danedg
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Happy New Year

May your sprockets mesh well, and your timing be perfect in the coming year!



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Old 01-02-2013, 01:47 PM   #310
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Old 01-02-2013, 04:41 PM   #311
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Timing chest w/o chain

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Old 01-05-2013, 06:07 PM   #312
danedg
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Lower End Dismantle 850 Big block

When I rebuilt the /2, I took a lot of fotos but never put them into any kind of rational order.
I'm gonna try and post the photos, captions, notes in the order the 1974 850 Eldorado cam chain motor comes apart.
It's certainly my first time, and I'm pretty sure it was hers too...
...At least that's what she TOLD me!?

This is a loose interpretation of Pete Roper's blog of the same subject on Guzzitech hosted by Greg Bender, Thanks Pete and Greg!


So the heads, cylinders, pistons, starter, generator, tranny have been stripped.
No excitement there. The genny bracket was repaired way back when.
New Gilardoni cylinder/piston kits going back in.
Heads have been reworked by Aldo Santini. APM Automotive Machine, Highland , NY
Rear drive is at Zydeco Racing on Long Island, and Charlie will be waving his magic wand of THAT puppy soon.

Now it's time for the block!





I need an crank stopper...?
Hmmmm, I needed one just like that for the R60....
One more hole and it now works for the Guzzi


Thinking, but not knowing, how difficult the crank pulley hub was going to be I built the crankpullyhubnut tool from some plumbing bits with washers and it popped it right off... probably overdone.




That allowed the timing chest cover to be removed. She was a bit bashful exposing her chest like that for the first time and I had to heat her up around the edges and smack her around a bit with a rubber mallet before she showed me her sprockets....



I took many shots and noted the specific alignments of the planets and pulled the timing assembly



The original chain is one piece and all 3 sprockets need to move as one...
Remove the big (27m) nut on the cam nose and the 13mm 1.50 nut on the oil pump and with a few gentle tugs with a 2 jaw puller on the crank sprocket everybody piled in the bus and came along for the ride!

You can then see the 3 10mm bolt retainer for the cam, the 6 6mm bolt retainer for the crank, and the 5 6mm Allen head bolts for the oil pump assembly. Also visible is the horrid "chain tensioner" thingamabob held on by two extra bolts and spacers which was immediately and henceforth banished to the nearest rubbish...




What becomes obvious quickly is that I'm screwing this up!
After pulling the oilpan off I can't really stand the motor upright because of all that STUFF hanging off the bottom.
Oil pickup assembly, passage tubes and that pesky breather tube in the rear bell...


And you can't get the breather tube out without pulling the flywheel.
I've been approaching this bass ackwards all along!


The flywheel came off with the 6 retainers and exposed the lower breather tube that screws into the bell




And the upper breather tube. Both of which exit the top of the case on their way to the oil breather assembly...




With the oil pumper and the ventilator tubes removed , I can finally set the case upright for crank removal..


The motor actually sat quite well on it's side, but it was dicy to work on and a mistep could have damaged a head bolt. If I'd pulled the flywheel first it would have been easier all around.




Back to the front chest.



The oil pump is gone. The cam retainer bolts and cam are removed and the 6 front crank retainer bolts are out.
The front retainer moves straight out. The crank can now move only backward.



But the connecting rods have to come out. The crank is all ready to move...

But what's all this hemming and hawing about pulling the rear bearing retainer?
Being subjected to BMW /2 crankshafts, I've an aversion to beating on, tweaking, pressing, or otherwise abusing in any way ANY crankshaft...
Those 2 8mm threads at 1 and 7 o'clock sure are one shitty way to extract that bearing block and associated bits.. hmmmmm
The trick is applying even pressure across the available points to extract the bearing retainer. The 2 on the outside and something in the middle might work...
Oh look! There is a M12 - 1.50 threaded hole in the crank nose!!



If I just grabbed a chunk of bar across the bell housing face, and picked up the 2 8mm points and the crank nose itself, with some judicious tightening across the three nuts the whole crank and retainer just flooped right out!





No muss, no fuss.
The crank worked as part of the puller without exerting any odd forces on the crank itself.

A handy zip tie held up the crank nose as the whole shootin' match got pulled out the ass.



And Voila!
Ze naked chest!



So now everybody's been ID'd, bagged and tagged and we're off to to Aldo's shop for initial measuring to specs...

After 46,333 miles, I'll be most interested to see how it's all worn out. To the eyeball, it looks great. There's no visible damage or wear. We'll see what the micrometer says!








danedg screwed with this post 01-06-2013 at 12:01 PM
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Old 01-05-2013, 07:47 PM   #313
JonnyCash
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Dude, just sit it up on wooden blocks high enough that the oil pickup clears the bench.
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Old 01-07-2013, 09:04 AM   #314
danedg
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Joined: May 2008
Location: U-puku-ipi-sing
Oddometer: 6,225
Bump

Quote:
Originally Posted by danedg View Post
When I rebuilt the /2, I took a lot of fotos but never put them into any kind of rational order.
I'm gonna try and post the photos, captions, notes in the order the 1974 850 Eldorado cam chain motor comes apart.
It's certainly my first time, and I'm pretty sure it was hers too...
...At least that's what she TOLD me!?

This is a loose interpretation of Pete Roper's blog of the same subject on Guzzitech hosted by Greg Bender, Thanks Pete and Greg!


So the heads, cylinders, pistons, starter, generator, tranny have been stripped.
No excitement there. The genny bracket was repaired way back when.
New Gilardoni cylinder/piston kits going back in.
Heads have been reworked by Aldo Santini. APM Automotive Machine, Highland , NY
Rear drive is at Zydeco Racing on Long Island, and Charlie will be waving his magic wand of THAT puppy soon.

Now it's time for the block!





I need an crank stopper...?
Hmmmm, I needed one just like that for the R60....
One more hole and it now works for the Guzzi


Thinking, but not knowing, how difficult the crank pulley hub was going to be I built the crankpullyhubnut tool from some plumbing bits with washers and it popped it right off... probably overdone.




That allowed the timing chest cover to be removed. She was a bit bashful exposing her chest like that for the first time and I had to heat her up around the edges and smack her around a bit with a rubber mallet before she showed me her sprockets....



I took many shots and noted the specific alignments of the planets and pulled the timing assembly



The original chain is one piece and all 3 sprockets need to move as one...
Remove the big (27m) nut on the cam nose and the 13mm 1.50 nut on the oil pump and with a few gentle tugs with a 2 jaw puller on the crank sprocket everybody piled in the bus and came along for the ride!

You can then see the 3 10mm bolt retainer for the cam, the 6 6mm bolt retainer for the crank, and the 5 6mm Allen head bolts for the oil pump assembly. Also visible is the horrid "chain tensioner" thingamabob held on by two extra bolts and spacers which was immediately and henceforth banished to the nearest rubbish...




What becomes obvious quickly is that I'm screwing this up!
After pulling the oilpan off I can't really stand the motor upright because of all that STUFF hanging off the bottom.
Oil pickup assembly, passage tubes and that pesky breather tube in the rear bell...


And you can't get the breather tube out without pulling the flywheel.
I've been approaching this bass ackwards all along!


The flywheel came off with the 6 retainers and exposed the lower breather tube that screws into the bell




And the upper breather tube. Both of which exit the top of the case on their way to the oil breather assembly...




With the oil pumper and the ventilator tubes removed , I can finally set the case upright for crank removal..


The motor actually sat quite well on it's side, but it was dicy to work on and a mistep could have damaged a head bolt. If I'd pulled the flywheel first it would have been easier all around.




Back to the front chest.



The oil pump is gone. The cam retainer bolts and cam are removed and the 6 front crank retainer bolts are out.
The front retainer moves straight out. The crank can now move only backward.



But the connecting rods have to come out. The crank is all ready to move...

But what's all this hemming and hawing about pulling the rear bearing retainer?
Being subjected to BMW /2 crankshafts, I've an aversion to beating on, tweaking, pressing, or otherwise abusing in any way ANY crankshaft...
Those 2 8mm threads at 1 and 7 o'clock sure are one shitty way to extract that bearing block and associated bits.. hmmmmm
The trick is applying even pressure across the available points to extract the bearing retainer. The 2 on the outside and something in the middle might work...
Oh look! There is a M12 - 1.50 threaded hole in the crank nose!!



If I just grabbed a chunk of bar across the bell housing face, and picked up the 2 8mm points and the crank nose itself, with some judicious tightening across the three nuts the whole crank and retainer just flooped right out!





No muss, no fuss.
The crank worked as part of the puller without exerting any odd forces on the crank itself.

A handy zip tie held up the crank nose as the whole shootin' match got pulled out the ass.



And Voila!
Ze naked chest!



So now everybody's been ID'd, bagged and tagged and we're off to to Aldo's shop for initial measuring to specs...

After 46,333 miles, I'll be most interested to see how it's all worn out. To the eyeball, it looks great. There's no visible damage or wear. We'll see what the micrometer says!







!
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Old 01-16-2013, 11:53 AM   #315
danedg
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Joined: May 2008
Location: U-puku-ipi-sing
Oddometer: 6,225
Siren Bracket?

I got the rear swingarm off today. The swingarm bolts were frozen and there was a 1/4" layer of greasy roadmung over everything, but with the proper amount of carefully chosen profanity it finally let loose. I of course had to remove all the levers and rods for the rear brake as well.
Without all the crap in place I can now see on the left rear "loop" the remains of a sawed off bracket...



Would that be the remains of a siren bracket?
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54 R51/3, 65 R60/2,
68 R60US, 74 MG Eldorado,
95 R100 Mystic
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