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Old 01-04-2013, 12:11 PM   #15196
Rick West
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dallara View Post

And my local Yamaha dealer has had a nice, brand new 2012 Yamaha Super Tenere sitting on his floor for 9 months, heavily discounted.

Dallara



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It's even worse in Canada where the Tenere has not had much sales success. Most dealers up here are stuck with them sitting on the sales floor too and yet the GS continues to sell well at a much higher price.

I'm not sure if advertising will be much help.
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Old 01-04-2013, 12:23 PM   #15197
Dallara
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Eek Talk about a slow selling niche model...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick West View Post
It's even worse in Canada where the Tenere has not had much sales success. Most dealers up here are stuck with them sitting on the sales floor too and yet the GS continues to sell well at a much higher price.

I'm not sure if advertising will be much help.


Well, it's pretty safe to say that both of them - the G/S and the Super Tenere - both sell better than the KTM 990 and its brethren...

Of course, both are more reliable than the Katoom... even the BMW!

Dallara



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Old 01-04-2013, 12:34 PM   #15198
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dallara View Post
Well, it's pretty safe to say that both of them - the G/S and the Super Tenere - both sell better than the KTM 990 and its brethren... Of course, both are more reliable than the Katoom... even the BMW!
Dallara ~
Our local KTM/Yamaha dealer has sold out all his 990's & Tenere's. GS's are like arseholes, everybody has one. All my BMW's were garage whores. Always at the dealer for recalls or warranty work. My 3 KTM's never saw the dealer after I bought them. (two 950's & 990)
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Old 01-04-2013, 12:35 PM   #15199
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I have no idea what y'all are goin' back-and-forth about. However, from my skimming of the posts, it brought something to mind that has always stayed with me (in regard to the ST).

When the H-D execs pooled their cash, and bought H-D from AMF (thereby resurrecting The Motor Company), they focused (aggressively) on three major things...

-R&D,

-QA/QC, and

-Advertising

And, when I post "advertising", I'm not talkin' the run-of-the-mill stuff that we see on a daily basis. Their marketing folks set-out to sell the "lifestyle". Their main focus was to make you believe that your life was shit...and that an H-D was the only thing that could change all that.

No matter what you feel about H-D (Personally, I love 'em, and bleed Orange&Black.), their marketing was PURE FUKKIN' GENIUS.




Now, getting back to the ST...

I have travelled the world (maybe not as much as some, but quite a bit, nonetheless). And, if there's one thing I have noticed, it's that we Americans are (many times) looked at as the big, dumb jock: not very smart, but can lift heavy things.

So, bearing that view in mind, we miss a lot of the cool stuff/designs that are offered in many countries. In fact, when I heard about the ST coming to the States, I was quite surprised, and thought, "That shit will never sell, here: not because it's junk, but because most folks don't know what the hell it is, and don't realize that they want (need) one."

After having that epiphany, I saw the below commercial. In my very humble opinion, if Yamaha woulda' advertised like this in the States, and sold the "lifestyle" instead of just the bike, the dealers woulda' been in the same spot as all the gun dealers, right now: sold-out, cash-rich, and frustrated...


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Old 01-04-2013, 12:42 PM   #15200
Dallara
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Thumb Can I have a "Hallelujah"!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by WARRIORPRINCEJJ View Post
I have no idea what y'all are goin' back-and-forth about. However, from my skimming of the posts, it brought something to mind that has always stayed with me (in regard to the ST).

When the H-D execs pooled their cash, and bought H-D from AMF (thereby resurrecting The Motor Company), they focused (aggressively) on three major things...

-R&D,

-QA/QC, and

-Advertising

And, when I post "advertising", I'm not talkin' the run-of-the-mill stuff that we see on a daily basis. Their marketing folks set-out to sell the "lifestyle". Their main focus was to make you believe that your life was shit...and that an H-D was the only thing that could change all that.

No matter what you feel about H-D (Personally, I love 'em, and bleed Orange&Black.), their marketing was PURE FUKKIN' GENIUS.




Now, getting back to the ST...

I have travelled the world (maybe not as much as some, but quite a bit, nonetheless). And, if there's one thing I have noticed, it's that we American are (many times) looked at as the big, dumb jock: not very smart, but can lift heavy things.

So, bearing that view in mind, we miss a lot of the cool stuff/designs that are offered in many countries. In fact, when I heard about the ST coming to the States, I was quite surprised, and thought, "That shit will never sell, here: not because it's junk, but because most folks don't know what the hell it is, and don't realize that they want (need) one."

After having that epiphany, I saw the below commercial. In my very humble opinion, if Yamaha woulda' advertised like this in the States, and sold the "lifestyle" instead of just the bike, the dealers woulda' been in the same spot as all the gun dealers, right now: sold-out, cash-rich, and frustrated...




Amen to that, Bruddah! Amen!

One thing, though... Don't let Pluric see those shots of that Super Tenere in the sand. He'll crash his office chair just watchin' it!

Dallara



~
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Old 01-04-2013, 12:48 PM   #15201
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dallara View Post
Amen to that, Bruddah! Amen!

One thing, though... Don't let Pluric see those shots of that Super Tenere in the sand. He'll crash his office chair just watchin' it!

Dallara

~

"I've fallen, and I can't get-up..." pluric





.
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Old 01-04-2013, 01:02 PM   #15202
Dallara
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Question A question...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
Our local KTM/Yamaha dealer has sold out all his 990's & Tenere's. GS's are like arseholes, everybody has one. All my BMW's were garage whores. Always at the dealer for recalls or warranty work. My 3 KTM's never saw the dealer after I bought them. (two 950's & 990)

Just out of curiosity, if you don't mind my asking...

How many miles did you put on each of the KTM's?

Thanks1

Dallara



~
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Old 01-04-2013, 01:04 PM   #15203
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Forgive my ignorance here, but as I recall, Yamaha didn't release the S-10 in North American. We weren't on their radar as a market. They had no intention of taking on BMW here. We BEGGED Yamaha to bring it here, and they didn't. They treated the S-10 like the initial FJR sales in NA - you had to pre-order it. Then, finally, Yamaha began to ship inventory stock (of FJR's) to the US and Canada (after 3 or 4 years???).

So, the S-10 never had an advertising budget or marketing campaign in NA because they were just meeting the (by Yamaha standards) "small demand" without the added expense of marketing. They don't expect to sell large numbers of the bike here; they really aren't trying to challenge the BMW R1200GS in this market. So even when those of us who buy it really love it, Yamaha gets a self-fulfilling prophecy of not selling many units.

It is a matter of corporate expectations, or perhaps "corporate blinders". They don't see themselves as an ADV manufacturer in NA. We only get the WRR/X, not the 250 Tenere (made where? Brazil?), or the 660 Tenere (made in Italy, so the cost of production is relatively high if they were to ship the NA, but shipping is relatively low in the local target market of the EU). If all of the S-10 production capacity (world-wide) is already consumed, then Yamaha doesn't want higher demand in NA, and I'll bet that Yamaha is selling every unit that they can build in other markets - a lone 2012 sitting for 9 months in Texas notwithstanding (what is that dealer's phone number again?).

Just my $.02. I hope that Yamaha changes their attitude in NA, because they alone have all the pieces on the board to really change the game. And new triples on the way, on top of that! I believe that Yamaha needs a broader, but no less sharp, focus on sub-markets in NA. But maybe they are just too busy to care right now.
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Old 01-04-2013, 01:34 PM   #15204
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The 660 would be very cool here in the USA, but has to compete with the V-strom's in price... That's going to be tuff..
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Old 01-04-2013, 01:43 PM   #15205
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Dallara: Your post was longwinded, with a lot of content but I have no idea where you're going with any of it. If you don't see the difference between low volume specialty products and commoditiezed large volume products, then this is a very difficult discussion to have with you. The next time you can pick up a Tenere next to the bubble gum at your local convenience store check out, you let me know. This isn't about dance moves, although I admit, mine are pretty good.

Gryphon12: . What you say actually helps to make sense out of the way Yamaha introduced the S10 onto our market. It does seem like maybe Yamaha is quietly testing the waters in this niche bike segment. That's some interesting new information, you got me intriqued, I'll have to see if there's any additional info out about that.

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Old 01-04-2013, 01:51 PM   #15206
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WARRIORPRINCEJJ View Post
"I've fallen, and I can't get-up..." pluric





.
Here we go again. I don't know if you can get the lid back on this can of whoop ass.


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Old 01-04-2013, 02:12 PM   #15207
jaumev
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Originally Posted by MariusD View Post
You're not comparing apples to apples.

Advertising does come into play when you have a high volume product in a very highly competetive undustry (fast food, beer, banking, autos). But that doesn't apply to a market like the adv bikes.

It's possible that bmw produces many more bikes than yamaha in this class, so they have to make sure they move them all in a timely fashion, thus they advertise.

My point wasn't that if a product is being advertised it isn't a best seller. I'm just impressed that the tenere has not NEEDED advertising so far to be successful.
Are you sure is succesful?
In Spain if you ordered a GS you has to wait some months to have it. If you want a S10 you can ride it immediatelly. Lots of them siting in the dealers...
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Old 01-04-2013, 02:17 PM   #15208
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Rule #1 of advertising is that the money is spent on where a profit will bring the money back.

The profit in the North American market is in cruisers.
Which we are not.
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Old 01-04-2013, 02:30 PM   #15209
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The GS series also has a 20 year history of pretty much the only game in town.

People still call snowmobiles "Ski-doos" because of the early history of production.

How many times have you had to explain what a Tenere is even to bike owners?
As long as the aftermarket and parts suppliers cover ownership needs who cares
if it's a record setting sales bike? Just nice to have the options available. No one
motorcycle genre will ever fill the needs of riders. True enthusiasts will always keep
up on what is available in the market place. The rest can always ask the salesman
the quarter mile speed or can I get extra chrome with that?
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Old 01-04-2013, 02:39 PM   #15210
Deuce
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Originally Posted by Dallara View Post
Just out of curiosity, if you don't mind my asking...How many miles did you put on each of the KTM's? Thanks1
Dallara ~
The two 950's had 80k ('05) & 70k kms ('06) & the 990 ('11) only 3k kms. The only reason we sold 'em was to pay off some debt. We will be getting the new 1190 when it hits our shores in the next year or two. Personally I would rather have an S10 but the Missus loves her KTM's. We are going to share one bike for now. Later I will get an S10 and she can have the 1190.

I loved my BMW's but just got tired of the maintenance on them. I have owned over a dozen (Airheads & Oilheads) so my experience is not just from owning one lemon ( '04 1200GS).

The S10 suits my type of riding and maintenance requirements. Gas and go is what I am after. No chain to adjust etc. I fix shit all day at work so don't want to have to do it on my days off.
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