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Old 01-19-2013, 03:35 AM   #16621
htono
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Joined: Apr 2012
Location: Colombia
Oddometer: 3
2013 Scrambler woes. Please help.

Hi and please help me,

My new Scrambler starts at idle, but when cold dies a sudden death whenever 1800 RPM is reached. After it starts warming up the rev limit starts to rise, until at some undetermined point it runs well.
After I stop and the bike cools down for a few minutes it goes through the cycle again. When I use the choke at mid position it will run well for a few seconds near 2000 RPM and then die. If I start it again with the choke at half position it will start and climb revs until it hits 2000 and then dies again. At that point I need to warm it at idle for a sustained period of time.

It started doing it brand new. I bought the bike with an Arrow 2-1 and remapped by dealer. My dealer couldn't replicate the problem, simply re-installed the map and gave it back stating that the bike runs properly.

During the holidays, with the dealership closed for the holidays, the issue started worsening and doing it more and more often. Still, I forged ahead and did multiple mods:

AI, O2, Pod filters, TTP Tune 4 (through TuneECU), Eatern Beaver relay cables, 7" headlight, LED turn signals, Ignition relocation, Hammarhead handlebar, etc.

The bike ran well through the holidays and mods, albeit with the starting issue always present, and gradually worsening.

Today it simply will not get out of the rev limited mode and simply cannot ride the bike.

The dealership is still closed for the holidays.

Tune ECU reports no errors. I've tried (with no success):

1. Remapping
2. Checked MAP hoses
3. Removed gas cap
4. Removed gas tank relief hose
5. Checked fuses

What could it possibly be?

Thanks a lot.

Henrique, the desperate one.
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Old 01-19-2013, 09:56 AM   #16622
tvscum
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Joined: Jan 2012
Location: San Diego, CA
Oddometer: 136
Quote:
Originally Posted by htono View Post
Hi and please help me,

My new Scrambler starts at idle, but when cold dies a sudden death whenever 1800 RPM is reached. After it starts warming up the rev limit starts to rise, until at some undetermined point it runs well.
After I stop and the bike cools down for a few minutes it goes through the cycle again. When I use the choke at mid position it will run well for a few seconds near 2000 RPM and then die. If I start it again with the choke at half position it will start and climb revs until it hits 2000 and then dies again. At that point I need to warm it at idle for a sustained period of time.

It started doing it brand new. I bought the bike with an Arrow 2-1 and remapped by dealer. My dealer couldn't replicate the problem, simply re-installed the map and gave it back stating that the bike runs properly.

During the holidays, with the dealership closed for the holidays, the issue started worsening and doing it more and more often. Still, I forged ahead and did multiple mods:

AI, O2, Pod filters, TTP Tune 4 (through TuneECU), Eatern Beaver relay cables, 7" headlight, LED turn signals, Ignition relocation, Hammarhead handlebar, etc.

The bike ran well through the holidays and mods, albeit with the starting issue always present, and gradually worsening.

Today it simply will not get out of the rev limited mode and simply cannot ride the bike.

The dealership is still closed for the holidays.

Tune ECU reports no errors. I've tried (with no success):

1. Remapping
2. Checked MAP hoses
3. Removed gas cap
4. Removed gas tank relief hose
5. Checked fuses

What could it possibly be?

Thanks a lot.

Henrique, the desperate one.
Have you checked the the TPS (Throttle Position Sensor) voltage? You can do this in TuneECU. The voltage should be at 0.60 with an acceptable range of 0.58 to 0.62 (though some people on Triumphrat have set it higher).

Some info is here:
http://www.triumphrat.net/twins-tech...-dfco-mod.html

Adjust the TPS to 0.60. Then, do an "adaption reset" in TuneECU. Then, perform the adaption procedure with the bike cold (idle the bike for 10 to 15 minutes) until the TPS light in TuneECU turns green.
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Past: '83 Honda XR500; '84 Honda XL600;
'86 Yamaha XT350
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Old 01-19-2013, 12:55 PM   #16623
Boola-Boola
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Joined: Nov 2008
Location: Dorset County, Original England
Oddometer: 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by htono View Post
...
...
It started doing it brand new. I bought the bike with an Arrow 2-1 and remapped by dealer. My dealer couldn't replicate the problem, simply re-installed the map and gave it back stating that the bike runs properly.

During the holidays, with the dealership closed for the holidays, the issue started worsening and doing it more and more often. Still, I forged ahead and did multiple mods:

AI, O2, Pod filters, TTP Tune 4 (through TuneECU), Eatern Beaver relay cables, 7" headlight, LED turn signals, Ignition relocation, Hammarhead handlebar, etc.

...
...
...
Henrique, the desperate one.
So... it had a problem from new, which wasn't resolved to your satisfaction and is getting worse, and you STILL pressed ahead with a shedload of mods!!?? What were you thinking??

Not meaning to sound harsh here, but I wouldn't have gone ahead and done all those mods until I was satisfied that the machine was 'right'. You say yours had an issue from day one, pretty much, but you still couldn't wait to quite possibly void your warranty with mods anyway. With it left as supplied you would have had warranty rights to get it sorted - maybe even extending as far as getting a complete replacement under warranty if the dealer couldn't figure the problem.

If I were in your shoes, I'd now be putting it back to factory stock condition in time for the dealer reopening (do they always have such long winter holidays?) and hoping that Triumph's warranty could get it sorted properly or else replaced.

We can surely eliminate the original tune, airbox/filter, AI or O2 causing this. The cold start is still there, and whatever it interacts with (TPS perhaps?), so could they have an involvement in the problem? I don't know if the cold start actuator just advances the throttle position slightly when pulled - if it does then maybe it could take an incorrectly set TPS (as tvscum suggests checking) outside of limits that the ECU could cope with on a cold engine? Interesting problem to try and get to the bottom of - but I'd still get busy refacilitating the dealer/warranty route ASAP.

Hope you get it sorted anyway, dude - either from some wisdom on the forums or by the dealer under warranty.
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-Triumph Scrambler EFI-

'You gotta deep-six your wristwatch, you gotta try an' understand, the time it seems to capture is just the movement of its hands.' (Walk in the Sunshine : Bob Weir)

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Old 01-19-2013, 06:49 PM   #16624
vonfink13
2013 Scrambler
 
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Joined: Jan 2013
Location: Snyder, NY
Oddometer: 13
pulled the heatshields and mufflers today...tmrw the whole lot gets a nice flat black powder coating...but first...a bafflectomy..!!!

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Old 01-19-2013, 06:50 PM   #16625
B02S4
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Joined: Mar 2009
Oddometer: 1,013
Quote:
Originally Posted by rous44 View Post
...It's not your battery !!!!....Several people have achieved a fix (maybe not permanent) by replacing the cdi box...Some claim it's the crank position pick up. ( Inside right engine cover) Replacing the regulator/rectifier is another solution thats been tried...

Maybe, maybe not. Until the battery is load tested neither you nor the OP can rule that out.

EFI bikes don't have a CDI.

If it is an EFI bike & the battery load tests OK then I would check each and every electrical connection related to ignition, including safety/interlock switches.

The bike is not posessed. There is a reason.
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Old 01-20-2013, 05:53 AM   #16626
Jholmes105
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Joined: Aug 2008
Location: Galena, Ohio
Oddometer: 72
Arrow Install

OK, finally scored a good deal on a new Arrow 2-1 for my 2006 Scram! I plan to install and want to do the AI removal all at same time. Will I need to rejet the carb? Any suggestions for what else to do during this install of the Arrow? Any tricks to install?

Scrambler before the install!



Thanks
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Old 01-20-2013, 03:33 PM   #16627
vonfink13
2013 Scrambler
 
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Joined: Jan 2013
Location: Snyder, NY
Oddometer: 13
the baffles came out today...the bike sounds way better...
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Old 01-20-2013, 03:46 PM   #16628
Mastodon
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Joined: Mar 2010
Location: The District of Concrete
Oddometer: 660
Alright, came home from my trip on friday, and my battery had barely dropped from where it was when I left it on Monday. 13.22V down to 12.95V. Plugged it back in, did some testing to look for current draws, and couldn't find anything. But while I was gone, I ordered a new regulator, one of the efficient MOSFET types. After all, if I spend a good portion of my time stopped at traffic lights, and my stock r/r is only putting out 12.5V, then my battery is draining itself while I'm stopped to a point below the 12.6 ECU cutoff. Spent this morning swapping out the parts, and went out for a test. (It was also a chance to break in the Tourances I had mounted yesterday too.) I left home with my battery at 12.78V, came home about 50 miles and just shy of two hours later, and my battery was sitting at 13.32V. This is the first time I can remember seeing my battery higher after shutting off the bike. Hopefully this means I wont have to precharge the battery before each ride, or short out the starter solenoid for a start anymore.

With this problem fixed, time to think about farkles. Up next is a baffelectomy and blackened heat shields. Then maybe a Metal Mule rack system and Kriega panniers. At the very least, I just plan on riding more. 6000 miles in 3 years is too few. I'm want at least that many miles this year alone
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Old 01-20-2013, 06:46 PM   #16629
B02S4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TStorm View Post
...ordered a new regulator, one of the efficient MOSFET types...

Great, which one?
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Old 01-20-2013, 07:13 PM   #16630
Rockman
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Joined: Jan 2007
Location: Inverell, NSW Australia
Oddometer: 297
Quote:
Originally Posted by TStorm View Post
Ok, so...came home from work at about 3, and tried to start the bike again. Nothing. Hooked up the multi-meter and here's the readings:

Off: 12.54V
Lights: 12.48V
Fuel Pump: 12.11V
Attempt to start: flickered down to 11.37V

The battery lost almost .5 volts in 6 hours of sitting.

Went through the process again a few moments ago:
Off: 12.48V
Lights: 12.21V
Fuel Pump: 11.96V

Saw this thread on TriumphRat, which pretty much describes my issue exactly, and I'm curious if anyone else has had similar problem.
http://www.triumphrat.net/twins-tech...y-problem.html
My Scram has had this problem since new (2010). It seems to be temperature related. The battery will hold its charge for weeks without use in warm weather (say +20 deg c) but loses it over night in cold weather. I havent found a practical solution yet other than putting it in a shed overnight in winter, or putting a trickle charger on it.
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Old 01-20-2013, 07:32 PM   #16631
Graniteone
3,2,1...Beer me!
 
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Joined: Jul 2011
Location: Golden, Colorado
Oddometer: 421
A pic from my ride yesterday and a pic from blacking out the chrome front turn stems. Need to ditch the front brake reservoir. Looks like a urine sample on my handle bars. Thinking one of the Rizoma would look good.


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Old 01-20-2013, 07:40 PM   #16632
b0rderman
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Joined: Aug 2010
Location: Denver, CO
Oddometer: 128
next time i go riding in january i'll be sure to make it back before nightfall...burrrrrrr

(by the way: that damn BC LED taillight is already more than half burned-out, only ~3k miles on it)
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Old 01-20-2013, 07:48 PM   #16633
O-Man
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Location: So Oregon
Oddometer: 56
Sorry Grani---, but the dual headlite setup does nothing for the Scramblers looks.u
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Old 01-20-2013, 07:57 PM   #16634
tvscum
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Joined: Jan 2012
Location: San Diego, CA
Oddometer: 136
Quote:
Originally Posted by Graniteone View Post
Need to ditch the front brake reservoir. Looks like a urine sample on my handle bars. Thinking one of the Rizoma would look good.
There's a Triumph OEM replacement for the urine sample cup. The writing in the center of the cap is a sticker that can be removed.

http://www.triumphperformanceusa.com...roducts_id=201

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Current: 2012 Triumph Scrambler;
'97 Honda XR440 (plated)
Past: '83 Honda XR500; '84 Honda XL600;
'86 Yamaha XT350
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Old 01-20-2013, 08:05 PM   #16635
Graniteone
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Joined: Jul 2011
Location: Golden, Colorado
Oddometer: 421
Quote:
Originally Posted by tvscum View Post
There's a Triumph OEM replacement for the urine sample cup. The writing in the center of the cap is a sticker that can be removed.

http://www.triumphperformanceusa.com...roducts_id=201


That looks good. I ll keep it in mind.

As far as the double headlight is concerned, I dig it and that is all that matters. Still looking for a mesh screen to adapt to them for protection.
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