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Old 03-23-2013, 06:36 PM   #16681
tremor38
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Originally Posted by twinrider View Post
Yeah, I agree the S10 is good bang for the buck but for the same money Yamaha could have tuned the motor a bit better. At the very least done away with the tuning that created a $450 surcharge to get rid of the 1-3 gear restrictions. The GS pulls like a beast in both road and dynamic modes right off the showroom floor.
Not surprising. You see the same thing around you every day, don't you? About the only things that jump out and say 'notice me' are the pachinko parlors. In the same manner, yamaha has made the tenere very low-key and reliable, if not a bit boring and sedate for some people in stock trim.

I've grown a bit suspicious of bikes that give a wow factor on first impression, regardless of brand. The 4-valve oil head boxer also has a more powerful engine than the S10, and made the claim that it could burn any grade of fuel because of the knock sensor. Turns out it burned up cylinder heads on RTW trips.

All I'm saying is if you start bumping up the compression and give the bike more agressive timing there's normally a trade off. Remove the restriction in the first three gears and the S10 will still not have the power of the beemer engine although the low-end pull noticably improves. It all comes down to being purpose-built. Yamaha has designed the S10 to operate reliably most anywhere in the world, while BMW banks on the fact that the majority of riders will stay primarily on tarmac. They also know that many will gladly pay a premium for the bike and all of the maintenance headaches for the privelage of sporting the blue and white badge.


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Old 03-23-2013, 07:04 PM   #16682
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Originally Posted by dickensheets View Post
My tenere seems to be wearing the rear brake quite quickly. At 20k miles it is mostly consumed. It has not been ridden hard.

I would like to know if it is possible to grind this rotor like with a car.
The rotors are not designed with enough excess thickness to be machined, but a few have done it anyway.

Why do you think you need to replace the rotor? They typically last through several sets of brake pads.

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Old 03-23-2013, 07:10 PM   #16683
twinrider
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Originally Posted by GrahamD View Post
Just goes to show the S10 is as good as an oil head then?

But really, if you look at the motor it has suddenly acquired a few "2010 S10" features, at a price, hasn't it?

But no one is over there mentioning it.

The RRP numbers have been released for OZ and it looks good on the base spec until you realize that once the options are added, it's still 30-40% more money.

I have heard that it has switchable ABS as well. Did you find the option?

So I wonder if YAMAHA will ever be able to charge BMW prices. Imagine what would be possible.

look up YAMAHA morpho and morpho II from 25 years ago. A lot of those technologies would be good on an all purpose bike.
Only the premium line 12GS is sold here in Japan, it has all the whiz-bang features. About $7,000 dearer than the Super Tenere, although they will through in a grand's worth of accessories for free. I think switchable ABS is standard in the GS lineup, even my Dakar has it.

No doubt the S10 will be be more reliable over the long term and I'm not rushing to trade mine in. Just think it would have been nice if Yamaha had given more consideration to the modes.

Do you think Yamaha would have to bump the compression up to get more power? The Tenere's 11.0:1 is quite a bit higher than the compression on the 145hp FJR and unlike the FJR requires premium gas.
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Old 03-23-2013, 07:10 PM   #16684
RonKZ650
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i still don't feel or care I guess if there is a restriction in the low gears. I must be somewhat retarded in my expectations of what a good engine is because to me the Tenere is darn good.
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Old 03-23-2013, 07:17 PM   #16685
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Originally Posted by twinrider View Post
I was curious about how the new GS stacked up against my Super Tenere and figured others here might be as well. Was surprised by some of the responses — thought all the narrow-minded koolaid slurpers were in the Oilhead Boxer forum.
I think it was your tone more than anything. I'll chalk it up to context and inflection being lost in the written (typed) word.

I bet that motor is sweet though, and I wish the Tenere had the ABS setup the BMW does where you can turn the rear off but leave the front on. That would be ideal.

I just can't get over the look of the new 1200GS. Maybe it looks better in person, but the camera is not that bike's friend. Or it could just be me. Doesn't matter really since I've still got 4 years and three months or 40k miles before I can consider a new bike. Keeping it for 5 years or 50k miles was the deal when I got the Tenere.
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Old 03-23-2013, 07:20 PM   #16686
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Originally Posted by RonKZ650 View Post
i still don't feel or care I guess if there is a restriction in the low gears. I must be somewhat retarded in my expectations of what a good engine is because to me the Tenere is darn good.
I thought the same thing till I did the fuse mod. There's a huge difference, comfirmed in dyno charts as about 20hp.

I added a switch and use SS for normal conditions and only revert to standard S for slippery road conditions when I want a less abrupt response.
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Old 03-23-2013, 07:23 PM   #16687
twinrider
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Originally Posted by Anticyclone View Post
I think it was your tone more than anything. I'll chalk it up to context and inflection being lost in the written (typed) word.

I bet that motor is sweet though, and I wish the Tenere had the ABS setup the BMW does where you can turn the rear off but leave the front on. That would be ideal.

I just can't get over the look of the new 1200GS. Maybe it looks better in person, but the camera is not that bike's friend. Or it could just be me. Doesn't matter really since I've still got 4 years and three months or 40k miles before I can consider a new bike. Keeping it for 5 years or 50k miles was the deal when I got the Tenere.
Tone? I think you read into it too much. Try not to be too sensitive, otherwise you will be mistaken for a BMW owner.

To be honest I love bikes, not brands. Right now I have a Yamaha, BMW, Suzuki and a Harley sitting in my garage.

I also don't care for the looks, but that motor is magnificent. The on-the-fly adjustable screen is pretty nifty as well.
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Old 03-23-2013, 08:11 PM   #16688
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Anyone using these MotorAnchor 82° valve stems in their Tenere? Changing tires today, have a spare set and am wondering if they will work.

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Old 03-23-2013, 08:38 PM   #16689
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Originally Posted by twinrider View Post
Do you think Yamaha would have to bump the compression up to get more power? The Tenere's 11.0:1 is quite a bit higher than the compression on the 145hp FJR and unlike the FJR requires premium gas.
The S10's modest power output mostly has to do with its peak torque being reached at fairly low RPM. If they wanted to bump the output, they'd probably do it mostly by raising revs, not compression. They may be somewhat restricted by the crossplane crank which puts additional bottom end stresses on the engine which would be aggravated with a higher RPM ceiling.

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Old 03-23-2013, 09:58 PM   #16690
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I dont really feel like going back and reading through a 1000 + page thread so Ill just ask . How are yall doing with 2 up on yalls S10s , rider/passenger comfort and handling? My wife and son both had asked about riding with me on a bike , the problem is my bike is a super sherpa 250 so no 2 up on that out of the yard . I was thinking about a DL650 /1000 or a tiger but the tenere would have a bit more grunt and it seems like a hell of a bike .
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Old 03-23-2013, 10:04 PM   #16691
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I've ridden 2-up with my wife, 5'6"/135 lbs, with no problems. I do have a Givi top box that provides back support for her.
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Old 03-23-2013, 11:14 PM   #16692
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I was thinking about a DL650 /1000 or a tiger but the tenere would have a bit more grunt and it seems like a hell of a bike .
Any of the above bikes will carry two people.

The S10 has the space and the motor for you not to notice as much that's all. It is probably the easiest of the lot to use on rough terrain with a load as it has a slower more predictable steering response. HOWEVER mud and sand will probably be harder.
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Old 03-23-2013, 11:32 PM   #16693
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Originally Posted by markjenn View Post
The S10's modest power output mostly has to do with its peak torque being reached at fairly low RPM. If they wanted to bump the output, they'd probably do it mostly by raising revs, not compression. They may be somewhat restricted by the crossplane crank which puts additional bottom end stresses on the engine which would be aggravated with a higher RPM ceiling.

- Mark
+1. It's not the compression so much, you can just get more power at low revs with more compression, however the fuel must be better to use it, which again is fine for most of the "ADV Tourer" market just not where I live if you want to actually do some country touring.

Since power is RPM X torque a S10 spinning at 12000RPM will theoretically make about 200HP but in reality about 0 HP because the pistons would have departed the engine by then. You could do it but I would assume the bike would be heavier because the crank and rods would be thicker and YAMAHA would be talking to Wärtsilä to source their cranks at that speed.
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Old 03-23-2013, 11:54 PM   #16694
twinrider
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+1. It's not the compression so much, you can just get more power at low revs with more compression, however the fuel must be better to use it, which again is fine for most of the "ADV Tourer" market just not where I live if you want to actually do some country touring.
I understand the logic, but Yamaha recommends premium for the S10, same as the gs.
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Old 03-24-2013, 01:07 AM   #16695
tremor38
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I understand the logic, but Yamaha recommends premium for the S10, same as the gs.
Find the first S10 to burn up a cylinder head and you get a cookie. I'm sure Yami has an appropriate timing curve. I'm also sure the premium fuel recommendation is for posterity purposes. I burn mid-grade fuel regularly and can induce a ping only by whacking the throttle wide open at super- low RPM. I'm sure the recommendation was made with that in mind. OTOH, BMW would rather ride the ragged edge so they can wow you enough to make you sign the dotted line.

Now the new GS being water-cooled might make CR and related heat issues less of a concern, but that doesn't change the overall mentality of a company run by accountants that would rather do test runs on an unsuspecting public. Loved reading about the tank slappers on the water boxer. I'd lay money that's the REAL reason Kevin Ash went down.

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