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Old 06-16-2013, 04:59 PM   #256
LarryRickenbacker
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Destination charge, TT&L, et al..I'm buying "Used"!

Howdy,

JerryH's sobering post is just a reminder of why I enjoyed buying my 2010 Sh150i "used" at the dealer with just 30 miles on it for some $800 below list price and I also skipped that $310 destination fee. Forgive me for raining on the parade, but I'll get my next scooter used-unless of course my monthly income dramatically increases.
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Old 06-16-2013, 07:10 PM   #257
JerryH
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The Piaggio BV350 is only $100 more. I like the look better. Also has bigger wheels. Sadly it also comes with a boatload of fees.

http://www.piaggiousa.com/scooters.h...verview/bv-350
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Old 06-17-2013, 03:08 AM   #258
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I rode a Kymco Downtown 300i and was very disappointed with the ergonomics of the seat/ running boards. By the look of the photos of riders on the Forza, I am afraid it will be the same. These manufacturers have chosen to design in an abrupt "backrest" into the seat which limits the riders ability to slide back when riding solo. I found the Downtown to be very cramped and would never buy one. And the "highway pegs" area of the running boards are uselessly too high and pushed back. The Forza has a similar problem by having the highway position tipped up at too steep of an angle and the seating position forced forward. I love my PCX with the seat hump removed. Plenty of room for a solo rider of any size to stretch out and the forward position of the running boards have the perfect angle even if the area at the toes could be just a bit more generous. The PCX150 could use a bit more power and top speed though. Heavy riders will struggle to hold 50 mph up hills which makes impatient cars try stupid things during rush hour traffic. The Forza will have plenty of power and highway hugging weight but looks like it may need a different seat at least.
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Old 06-17-2013, 04:28 AM   #259
Cortez
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sendler View Post
I rode a Kymco Downtown 300i and was very disappointed with the ergonomics of the seat/ running boards. By the look of the photos of riders on the Forza, I am afraid it will be the same. These manufacturers have chosen to design in an abrupt "backrest" into the seat which limits the riders ability to slide back when riding solo. I found the Downtown to be very cramped and would never buy one. And the "highway pegs" area of the running boards are uselessly too high and pushed back.
The upper floorboards are actually for the kid sitting in front of you.
It's from Taiwan, remember?

Also, the butstop was fine for my 5'11" frame, but the BV350 that a lot
of people are talking about has it's butstop even more forward and was
too cramped for me.

Had no issues with comfort on the DT, but I did wish it had one size bigger
wheels.
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Old 06-20-2013, 11:46 AM   #260
Dav101
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Originally Posted by oldhippie1 View Post
I'm getting about sick of how Honda is dicking around with the release of the Forza 300. I really want one but this waiting is crazy. Why can't they tell is when they will be available? I'm not putting ANY miles on my current bike because a dealer offered me a good trade. I do want to do some riding this summer however and if it runs into September no time is left,

Hey OldHippie, my local dealer has ordered one and was told to expect delivery in August. Good luck.
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Old 06-20-2013, 01:09 PM   #261
longhaul747
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I am still thinking about this scoot but I need to see it in person first. Also I am deeply concerned that after the dealer/Honda shenanigans this bargain priced $5499 scooter will end up being $7,500 out the door stripping it of being any sort of real bargain.

Plus my Reflex witch is pretty much the same thing and possibly a more functional and thought out design is already broken in and paid for and only needs annual oil changes plus other routine maintenance.

What I am about to say may sound incredibly odd but I am kind of tired of the new bike game. First you buy it and in overly inflated MSRP price and then the dealer gets his hand in as well. Then if you really want to do it right you should dump the factory fill within the 1st 100 miles. Then you should take it in at the 600 miles service for an overpriced once over and an oil change plus likely a valve inspection and the dealer gets his hands in at this time as well. It just seems new bikes now days are cluster f**ks!

Odd thinking I know but lately the used market is flooded with perfectly good used bikes that have already had the break in stuff completed and priced half of what new cost.

I will likely end up getting a Forza 300 but it will be 2 years from now in perfect shape with 1,500 miles on it for $3500 out the door. I guess I have just bee lucky since buying used has its risk but if you are smart shopper odds are actually in your favor.
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Old 06-20-2013, 01:29 PM   #262
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^I'm with you. I really want a Forza, but I can't afford new (when you factor in the markups) so I'm hoping a bunch of folks decide to trade in their gently used Reflex toward that new Forza. I can't see paying the 3500 people are asking right now for a 7-10 year old Reflex, but if the market gets flooded with them I could certainly see paying 2500.
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Old 06-20-2013, 01:59 PM   #263
oldhippie1
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Forza on dealers order forms as of today.

I talked to two dealers in California today and they said it went on dealers order forms today. So I phoned my dealer. He wasn't aware of this but checked and said yes he could order for August delivery. Only ordering one since late in the year. its mine. $5499 out the door. No freight, set up of paperwork fees. I'll do maintenance myself. Plan to ride from Kansas to International Falls for a check out run.
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Old 06-20-2013, 02:45 PM   #264
JerryH
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I'm also tired of playing that game. That's why I haven't bought anything yet. Since 2005, I have bought and sold a brand new Kawasaki Eliminator 125, Ninja 250 ('07 old style) a Honda Recon 250 quad, and an '09 Ninja 500. Both Ninjas were big mistakes. I put a lot of miles on the little Eliminator and had a lot of fun, but I paid too much for it, and lost a lot when I sold it. I would still have the quad, but the people I was riding with moved away, and I sold my 8 mpg truck. I also bought, and still have, and intend to keep, my '08 Vino 125, '09 Genuine Stella, and '12 Zuma 125. I also bought and sold a used Honda Rebel, and a used Goldwing. Lost money on both those too. I still have my '02 Vulcan 750 and an XT225 with a lot of mods and a nearly complete parts bike with an almost new engine. Time to quit buying and start riding what I have.
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Old 06-26-2013, 08:37 AM   #265
oldhippie1
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Forza release date

I know effective last week Honda started taking orders from dealers but WHY can't we be told when they will start arriving in showrooms? I've heard August and September.
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Old 06-26-2013, 10:11 AM   #266
k3ith
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldhippie1 View Post
I know effective last week Honda started taking orders from dealers but WHY can't we be told when they will start arriving in showrooms? I've heard August and September.
No one wants to commit to a date when they don't know if they'll be able to get any till later than that.

They're having the same issue with not being able to keep up in Europe where they've been selling them for a few months already. I read somewhere that the UK hasn't gotten any (or very few) but was supposed to have them in April.

Hard to tell if it's because of really high demand or if they've had production issues. (I'm guessing demand is actually that high.)
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Old 06-26-2013, 10:13 AM   #267
oldhippie1
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Forza delivery date

Whatever the problem I'm about ready to tell them to stick it and keep my beautiful Sportster.
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Old 06-30-2013, 01:59 AM   #268
hippiebrian
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Wow! I was considering the Kymco People 300 so I could feel just a bit more secure on longer trips than my People 150. Now Honda comes out with this.

Which one? I mean, I could probably get the Kymco cheaper out the door, but when I'm 1000 miles away from home in b.f.e., the Honda dealership network would sure come in handy...

Which one? I'm interested in a smaller bike than the KLR (if you can believe that) because one of the things I love about motorcycling is the cheap travel aspect, and 300 class motorcycles/scooters seem to be the sweet spot for enough power with good mileage.

So which one? I know you people can throw some opinions out here...
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Old 06-30-2013, 06:41 AM   #269
klaviator
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The People 300 and Forza are totally different style of scooters. The people has an upright seating position while the Forza is a Maxi Scooter. Which do you prefer? As for dealer support, no one except maybe Harley can match Honda's dealer network but Kymco has a pretty extensive dealer network too. I have a good local Kymco dealer. How are your local Honda and Kymco dealers?

Some things to consider:
-16" wheels on the Kymco VS smaller wheels on the Forza. Which do you prefer?
-Under seat will be much better on the Forza.
-Kymco has 2 year warrantee.
-Kymco claims 54 degree leans angle. I don't know about the Forza but I seriously doubt it's as good. Maxi Scooters with there smaller wheels tend to have limited cornering clearance. There are exceptions like the T-max. This is a big deal if you ride hard through the curves, not a big deal if you don't.
-Brakes. All Honda scooters seem to have linked brakes. The Kymco does not. The Kymco does not have ABS in the USA. Does the Forza? Is this important to you? Personally I hate linked brakes but it's not as big of a deal if they also have ABS.
-Price. You should be able to get the Kymco well under MSRP. Expect to pay MSRP plus lots of fees on the Honda. The Kymco will probably be way less OTD than the Honda.
-Service intervals. Kymco requires more frequent valve adjustments. Not sure about everything else. Usually it's easier to get to the motor on an upright scooter like the people than the Maxi style scoots but you'd need to do some research to find the details on these two.
-The DT300 is probably more comparable to the Forza than the People is.

I'd probably go with the Kymco but then you probably have different priorities than I do. If at all possible, take them both for a test ride. My Kymco dealer allows test rides but it may be difficult to get one on the Honda.
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klaviator screwed with this post 06-30-2013 at 01:00 PM
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Old 06-30-2013, 08:56 AM   #270
oldhippie1
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Forza

Valves only need adjusted every 16,000 miles. I'd definitely buy Honda quality. I'm getting one as soon as they are available.
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