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Old 07-04-2013, 11:04 AM   #571
Cos
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Originally Posted by Cortez View Post
They cost virtually the same here so..

2 Grand more for the 700 in Cyprus
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Old 07-04-2013, 11:09 AM   #572
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..........The 19 inch front and additional travel wouldn't have any real drawbacks and wouldn't have cost a dime more. That was the point of my statement.
A 19" front wheel would slow down the steering and make it less nimble on the street. It wouldn't handle as well with a 19" on the street and a 19" is not really the ticket for riding in dirt anyway, that is what 21" fronts are for so the 19" ends up being a fashion compromise. If the bike is used most of the time on the street the 19" ends up being a drawback. Someone that knows what they are doing can ride within the limits of a 17" on unimproved roads which is what most of the adventure posers ride anyway.
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Old 07-04-2013, 11:29 AM   #573
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Originally Posted by whipit1k View Post
well how did people ever do it in the past? There have been motorcycles out there in this scary, multi surface world you describe for a hundred and ten years, dealing with the treacherous , ever changing conditions you describe without electronics to control the bike for them. How did they ever do it? they must have been supermen.
Lots of them are dead.

500 looks like a great little bike either way. Probably not enough motor for me, but maybe I'm wrong about that.

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Old 07-04-2013, 11:59 AM   #574
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Originally Posted by dduelin View Post
A 19" front wheel would slow down the steering and make it less nimble on the street. It wouldn't handle as well with a 19" on the street and a 19" is not really the ticket for riding in dirt anyway, that is what 21" fronts are for so the 19" ends up being a fashion compromise. If the bike is used most of the time on the street the 19" ends up being a drawback. Someone that knows what they are doing can ride within the limits of a 17" on unimproved roads which is what most of the adventure posers ride anyway.
Notice the "any real drawabacks" in my post. You are right, apples to apples, a 19 front "should be slower steering" than a 17 inch front but things would not be "apples to apples". There are many factors that go into how a bike steers and front wheel size is only one aspect. The CB isn't a repli-racer and the amount a 19 inch front would slow down steering on this type bike is insignificant. My DL650 has lighter and quicker steering than many bikes with a 17 inch front and is plenty nimble on the street. Considering the bikes light weight and reputed low COG, I'm betting a switch to a 19 front wouldn't have any noticeable effect, none that 99% of the riders would notice. Especially considering how this type of bike will be ridden most of the time.

I can see why Ducati went with a 17 inch front on the Multi Tarma,,,,, that's a bike in which a 19 would make enough of a detrimental difference to matter. I can see why a GSXR or the like has a 17. I can even see why Yamaha fitted a 17 front on my FJR. I can not understand why Honda choose to fit a 17 on this bike as the 19 would not be a detriment in commuting, wouldn't be a detriment in 99% of riding and that 1% when you are hauling the mail in the twisties,,,, most riders wouldn't notice it.

On the other hand, a 19 front would have opened up many tire options that would have worked great on this type of bike. The 19 inch front is just smoother over rough terrain whether that be pot-holes on tarmac or rough, unmaintained roads off tarmac. It doesn't matter that a "fast guy" of a bike with a 17 inch front is faster off tarmac than a poser on a bike with a 19 inch front. This isn't about "fast",,,, it's about the best tool for the job and like I said, a 19 inch front has a better, broader tire selection and it's noticeably smoother off tarmac and on rough tarmac. That is more of a consideration on this type of bike than ultimate speed or handling IMO.

Add is another inch of travel at both end and another inch of clearance,,,,, and you would have had a bike that would have been better at being an all-around bike than my DL. As it is, it's just another streetbike with poser styling. There are a see of streetbikes out there to pick from,,,,, very few decent all-round bikes in this weight and price range. There is a reason Suzuki sells the hell outta the DLs. They do a lot of thing "good-enough" despite not being great at any one thing. Had the CB500X had the 19 front, additional travel and clearance,,,,, it woulda been a home run for this price range. And like I said, it wouldn't have add a dime to the bike's cost.

Yes, you an ride any bike off tarmac,, my FJR has done more dirt road mileage than most GSs and DLs but it sure would have been easier on my DL and easier still on a CB500X "if" it had just a few changes, changes that would not have cost a dime more and changes that wouldn't have significantly hurt it's on-road manner. As it is, I would buy a used DL over a new CB500X. Maybe, someone will find work out an easy fix for a 19 front and find some additional travel via mods like I did on my DL. Maybe then I'll pick up a nice cheap used CB for the wife and get to modding.

I'm not bashing the CB500X, I'm just lamenting the fact that Honda choose to bunt when it woulda been so easy and cost effective to just smack a home run.
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Old 07-04-2013, 12:02 PM   #575
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Reason why honda is running a 17... cause the f and r have them.. do they already make a bike with a cast 19? If not then yes, it would have cost more and they would of had to have one off parts for the front wheel and tire.
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Old 07-04-2013, 12:26 PM   #576
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Reason why honda is running a 17... cause the f and r have them.. do they already make a bike with a cast 19? If not then yes, it would have cost more and they would of had to have one off parts for the front wheel and tire.
Point taken, you are ultimately correct and I was technically wrong on the statement of "not a dime more" but really,,,, how much would it cost for their supplier to cast up a 19? Bet it wouldn't add 100$ to the CB500X's bottom line. The travel and additional clearance would be the same,,,,, different than the F and R but honestly,,, not much when talking economies of scale. I bet it wouldn't have taken 250$ to have made this bike worlds better.

Honda has a habit if this. Take for instance their XR650L. It's a decent big bore dual sport that even today only gets bested for it's intended purpose buy something like a Husky TE610/630. Even so, it has little issues that are irritating and if addressed,,,, would make the bike so much better for it's intended use. The front forks suck,,,, yet they have nice USD forks on their CRF line that would be easy to mount up. I know,,, I already did it and it didn't cost much more that 300$ after I sold the OEM parts. Honda coulda done it much cheaper.

The tranny gearing could be better. It does have a wider gear spread than most big bore thumpers but the 1st to 2nd spread sucks yet they have a 2nd gear already produced and used in another bike that's perfect. They also have a 5th gear that's about 5-10% taller and would spread that gearing range even wider and would have allowed a lower final gearing so one could run even slower in 1st yet still have the same cruise rpm. Again, already produced, woulda just taken a trip to the parts bin. I bought the 2nd and 5th gears and will eventually install then but it takes splitting the cases and that will have to wait. Again, Honda coulda easily added the 2nd and 5th gears at basically no cost and had one of the best gearing of all the big bores but nope.

Had Honda took the time to change to the better tranny gears and used a the CRF USD forks, the XR650L would be so much better but nope,,,,, Honda refuses to make the changes and the parts have been around for ages. Add fuel injection {250-500$ max added to the final price and man, the XR would be the bee's knees in my opinion. It would be a home run but nope,,,,,, bunt, bunt,,,, make a half assed attempt and leave it that way for 20years when you have all the parts needed for a great bike.
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Old 07-04-2013, 03:34 PM   #577
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Originally Posted by fragile_this_side_up View Post
Reason why honda is running a 17... cause the f and r have them.. do they already make a bike with a cast 19? If not then yes, it would have cost more and they would of had to have one off parts for the front wheel and tire.
Plus the NC700x and the NC700s and the CTX700 and the CTX700n. But this may one of the reason why the CB500x with ABS is $6,499 and the 650 strom is $8,299.
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Old 07-04-2013, 08:01 PM   #578
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The 500X runs 41mm forks and so did the 600 Transalp with 21 inch front wheel. Wonder who will try it first?

Just need to get triple clamp widths for each model.
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Old 07-04-2013, 09:23 PM   #579
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They cost virtually the same here so..
Still, the 500 could be the winner here because it has a real motorcycle motor, it should be virtually more fun.
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Old 07-04-2013, 10:45 PM   #580
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Old 07-05-2013, 01:49 AM   #581
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Add is another inch of travel at both end and another inch of clearance,,,,, and you would have had a bike that would have been better at being an all-around bike than my DL. As it is, it's just another streetbike with poser styling.
Are you sure, that the 500X would SELL more, if it were made more off-road oriented?? I´m not convinced about that. And from Honda´s point of view, I believe THAT is what matters.

Besides, this bike is built very much to a budget, and there are those sister models (naked bike and full faired “sportsbike”), whose parts need to be as much interchangeable as possible. Any true capability off-road seems to go in a different directions from those two other models, so that to me explains, why at this point they just simply offer it as a streetbike with a more upright riding position.

Sure, why not make a parallel version with a 19 inch front, and some other modifications, a bit like BMW F700GS / F800GS... but also expect this version to cost more, just like the F800GS does. Who knows, maybe they will make something like this in the future?
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Old 07-05-2013, 11:04 PM   #582
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Are you sure, that the 500X would SELL more, if it were made more off-road oriented?? I´m not convinced about that. And from Honda´s point of view, I believe THAT is what matters.

Besides, this bike is built very much to a budget, and there are those sister models (naked bike and full faired “sportsbike”), whose parts need to be as much interchangeable as possible. Any true capability off-road seems to go in a different directions from those two other models, so that to me explains, why at this point they just simply offer it as a streetbike with a more upright riding position.

Sure, why not make a parallel version with a 19 inch front, and some other modifications, a bit like BMW F700GS / F800GS... but also expect this version to cost more, just like the F800GS does. Who knows, maybe they will make something like this in the future?
I'm not sure it would sell more but we will never know.

You are right, bike is built to a budget and I just don't think casting up a 19 inch front and adding an inch or so of travel would make or break this bike. I doubt it would add 250$ bucks. If I can add DR650 fork tubes and internals to my DL bottoms along with Ricor Intimidators for no more than 350$,,,, surely an the manufacturer could do it for less? If I could add a set of CRF USD forks to the front of my XR650L for around 300$ after the sale of the OE forks and wheel,,,, surely Honda coulda done it cheaper????

I agree with you that BMW does great things and is very smart for using one basic bike as a platform for several different bike options. Yes, they may cost less or more but they are offering bikes that are actually different and have real benefits and it's not just a paint and stripe job like the American performance cars of the middle 70s to middle 80s. I wish the Japanese would learn a thing or two from BMW and this is one where they really could do well to copy. I was also disappointed in the new DL650 and it's Adventure option. Triumph needs to take more notice of this also. If you give people real benefits, you can charge more and even cheap asses like me will understand. Slap different plastics on the same exact bike and all it "different and I'll call BS.
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Old 07-05-2013, 11:36 PM   #583
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i could give a rats ass about abs, traction control, or any other type of electronic bs. I have been the one riding and controling the bike since the beginning, and that is how it is going to stay. I dislike the ugly, bulky clutter thet these systems require, too. Whiz on it...if i am ever so old and decrepit that i am no longer able to control the bike myself, i guess i will consider some electronic bs to do the job for me. Of course i will also need one of those three wheeled electric scooters to get to the garage to mount my bike by then too.i hope it is a long time before that happens.
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Old 07-06-2013, 12:15 AM   #584
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This bike does not have traction control, so bringing it into this discussion is not necessary.

One common thing about everybody who does not like, or want ABS, seems to be, that they have not tried a modern system on a modern bike. Some of them might have tried it on a bike 10-20 years ago, and the way it worked, was very different back then. It has evolved a lot.

Then there's those, who have never even tried it, instead they've decided it's bad. And they are usually the ones, who have by far the strongest opinions on it. Surely we're all entitled to our opinions, though.
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Old 07-06-2013, 07:03 AM   #585
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The CB500x may not be the right adventure bike for some, but it looks like it will be for me. It all depends on what you plan on using the bike for. Sure a wee strom may be a little better off road with it's 19" front tire, but if I bought that bike I would hear from the klr650 owners with a 21" front tire telling me how much better that bike is off road, and before you know it, I will be on a full blown motocross trying to make it street legal for the 99% of the time the bike will be on pavement. I am going to use the bike for back road riding just like I did with my shadow. Everyone says it's just a street bike, but there are different types of street bike. I think my shadow was a street bike, you ever try standing on the pegs on a shadow riding on a less than perfect road? And as far as the CB500x being the same bike as the cbr500r, Motorcycle Ergonomics has me on the CB500x with a 0% forward lean, and a 14% forward lean on the CBR500r. sure they use a lot of the same parts, but it's the riding position I'm looking at. I sat on all the new 500 Honda's and there is a difference besides the plastic.
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