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Old 12-13-2013, 09:17 AM   #316
XR650L_Dave
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http://www.sr-71.org/blackbird/manual/

http://books.google.com/books?id=ZHk...0speed&f=false

Apparently the SR-71 goes from flying to falling without style without any recognizable 'stall' condition in-between...
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Old 12-14-2013, 01:10 PM   #317
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Originally Posted by ragtoplvr View Post
To test the blackbird engines in development they ran the exhaust from another jet engine into it. That did not develop full power then either. These engines were designed on paper and slide rule, no computer modeling. The final tests were on the blackbird. Very exotic stuff. You would be very hard pressed to find an engineer of that caliber today.
There was computer modeling, just (obviously) not to the extent and fidelity of today. I've read some of the engineering reports describing the analysis...
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Old 12-14-2013, 03:29 PM   #318
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I consider the SR-71 and Concord to the pinnacle of military and civilian aircraft respectively, truly amazing machines.
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Old 12-14-2013, 03:49 PM   #319
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The Boeing SST, had it been built, would have been a significantly more capable aircraft than the Concorde. It was fairly far along in development when it was killed.

Lockheed certainly did have some creative/appropriate thinking back then. C130, F104, U2, SR71. With exception of the F104, all found useful long term service.

Maybe Lockheed's satellites are as cutting edge these days, but it seems the aircraft market for them, excepting the F117 (not likely to be so long lived) just isn't what it used to be.
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Old 12-14-2013, 04:18 PM   #320
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Originally Posted by chazbird View Post
The Boeing SST, had it been built, would have been a significantly more capable aircraft than the Concorde. It was fairly far along in development when it was killed.

Lockheed certainly did have some creative/appropriate thinking back then. C130, F104, U2, SR71. With exception of the F104, all found useful long term service.

Maybe Lockheed's satellites are as cutting edge these days, but it seems the aircraft market for them, excepting the F117 (not likely to be so long lived) just isn't what it used to be.
coulda, woulda, shoulda - Concord made it off the drawing board and into service for many years....
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Old 12-14-2013, 04:29 PM   #321
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Lockheed certainly did have some creative/appropriate thinking back then. C130, F104, U2, SR71. With exception of the F104, all found useful long term service.
The F104 may not have had a long service life with the USAF (1958-1969), but it was it service with other countries until 2004 which seems like a good run. Also, the U2 spy plane is based on the F104.
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Old 12-14-2013, 04:49 PM   #322
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Concorde, a engineering marvel, was perhaps the most heavily subsidized government civil program in history. Everyone knew it wasn't going to be economically feasible. The Boeing SST had far less in subsidies going for it, which might be one of the reasons for canceling it. But mostly there was not sufficient interest and orders coupled with the land based overflight sonic boom issues.

RE: F104. Good point about others flying the 104 for a long time, I think Italy was the last to retire them. Still, not that useful a plane, mostly an interceptor that beyond visual range missiles killed off. It did fly in the 1971 Pakistan -India war, and was used briefly in Vietnam, for reasons no one could understand. Maybe it was some sort of way for a 104 wing to get combat medals.
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Old 12-14-2013, 05:01 PM   #323
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Apparently the SR-71 goes from flying to falling without style without any recognizable 'stall' condition in-between...[/QUOTE]


Makes me wonder what happened when they descended into icing conditions to land ...low on fuel.....not many options.

I was flying a C172 cross country many years ago when the weather turned and started building ice on the wing's leading edge, felt lucky to get on the ground after it started handling like a 1950 Dodge station wagon...made flat wide turns coming in
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Old 12-14-2013, 05:04 PM   #324
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Concorde, a engineering marvel, was perhaps the most heavily subsidized government civil program in history. Everyone knew it wasn't going to be economically feasible. The Boeing SST had far less in subsidies going for it, which might be one of the reasons for canceling it. But mostly there was not sufficient interest and orders coupled with the land based overflight sonic boom issues.
I believe that's called sour grapes
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Old 12-14-2013, 05:52 PM   #325
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Nah, no sour grapes, I don't think I could have ever afforded a ticket on either one of them. I don't have xenophobic tendencies about where a (good) airplane (or anything else) comes from.
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Old 12-14-2013, 11:50 PM   #326
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Did anyone mention the SR-71 at the Hill AFB museum? It's one of the two humpbacked trainers. There's also an engine on a stand and the starting unit (was it a single or two Chrysler hemis?).
It was in pieces in the hangar next to the engine shop back in '89 before the museum opened.
The only one I ever saw in the air was being escorted into Palmdale by a T-38 or two. Impressive sight even at low altitude going slow. It was a couple thousand feet below us. I was sitting sideways in a C-141B heading somewhere in southern CA. That was in the late 90's and the program was winding down.
Two Buick Wildcats iirc
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Old 12-15-2013, 02:20 AM   #327
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Maybe Lockheed's satellites are as cutting edge these days, but it seems the aircraft market for them, excepting the F117 (not likely to be so long lived) just isn't what it used to be.
The f-117 had been retired since 2008.
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Old 12-15-2013, 05:26 AM   #328
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Fantastic thread,stories told by the pilots are brilliant.
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Old 12-16-2013, 06:09 AM   #329
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Makes me wonder what happened when they descended into icing conditions to land ...low on fuel.....not many options.

I was flying a C172 cross country many years ago when the weather turned and started building ice on the wing's leading edge, felt lucky to get on the ground after it started handling like a 1950 Dodge station wagon...made flat wide turns coming in
Maybe they land while it's still too hot to ice!
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Old 12-17-2013, 10:52 AM   #330
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All mission profiles were carefully charted, they even looked for air over the target dry enough so there would be no con-trails. I suspect entering icing conditions was very rare. And they had tankers. I suspect it would take very little ice to cause issues.

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