Garmin Montana

Emmbeedee · Dec 23, 2012

Drif10 said: ↑

Another difference from the 478:

You lose one level of detailed zoom. Now, the 478 was unique that way, all other garmins topped out at the same level, only the 478 went one more step. So... not a big, but a diff.
Click to expand...

You need the Canada Enhanced Basemap.

You get road detail out to the 5k zoom level.

snooker · Dec 23, 2012

Emmbeedee said: ↑

Do you even need to have the gps plugged in as you install to the new PC? I think the issue is that your gps has newer maps than the dvd so if the gps with newer maps is plugged into the target computer, it will try to match the serial number on the dvd to the updated maps and fail because of it.

Have you tried installing without the gps plugged in?

And there is a forum you could ask the question on. forums.garmin.com.
Click to expand...

Inserting the CNNANT 2012 DVD will autorun and then Garmin Map Setup shows the following screen. The Continue key is greyed out until you either connect your GPSr or you click on "Have a device you cannot connect?" and then enter the serial number of it. This happened the very first time I ever popped in the DVD on my first PC. So I think it has to know what device you are "tying" your single device license to before it continues, as far as I can tell. That kind of makes sense to me since it is licensed only to a single GPSr.

On my first WinXP PC I installed CNNANT from DVD with its product key and did the Lifetime Update as well with its product key. So I have different 2 sets of CNNANT installed on my PC, but I have never used MapInstall (or anything else) to install any maps onto the Montana.

But the problem is, Now on my new Win8 notebook whether I connect the Montana or enter the serial number of it, it will go the next screen asking for the product key, and if I enter the product key from the DVD it says:
"The Product Key is not valid for this Map Update".

It does seem like it knows I have installed and updated with the latest version once and won't let me do it again, maybe thinking I should already have the latest for the GPSr I have specified. But it should be able to tell I am on a different computer (MAC Address or whatever). I wanted to get this installed for a present but guess I will have to wait until Garmin is open again, haven't found anything helpful in Garmin forum yet either.

Emmbeedee · Dec 23, 2012

snooker said: ↑

But the problem is, Now on my new Win8 notebook whether I connect the Montana or enter the serial number of it, it will go the next screen asking for the product key, and if I enter the product key from the DVD it says:
"The Product Key is not valid for this Map Update".
.
Click to expand...

What about going to your MyGarmin account online, downloading the map update to the new computer then installing that?

Check this FAQ in the Garmin Forums.

There is a section dealing with getting the maps onto a second computer.

Drif10 · Dec 24, 2012

Emmbeedee said: ↑

You need the Canada Enhanced Basemap.

You get road detail out to the 5k zoom level.

Click to expand...

Yeah, been using that trick for years.

Could get 8k zoom on a 478, which was totally useless.

Metroguide Can V4 is damn near the backroads mapbook. All the old crown road allowances and abandoned railbeds are on it.

Jon_PDX · Dec 24, 2012

Regarding installing maps on computers and unlocking them......

I have my CN installed on more than on computer (Windows and MAC). I ran the installs off the CD's without the GPS connected and the installs went fine. Just like installing anything else.

Were I ALWAYS run into issues is with the product keys to unlock the maps. It seems like I have to try multiple times before I get the correct key to unlock the maps. Sometimes I get the correct key from the My Garmin site on the first try and other times I have to search through their menu system under my account to find the correct key for the product I wish to unlock because for some reason they seem to list more than one key for some of my maps.

Either that or I'm getting old and confused when I look for stuff in my account at their site

Eventually it does work and I think I finally got the correct keys backed up on my system now.

But it sure was a hassle the last time I had to do it.

Jon...

johnpitts01 · Dec 24, 2012

I've had my Montana now for more than a month. I loaded all the maps on the SD card a couple weeks ago. Due to a heavy International travel schedule I havent even turned the Montana on...... until yesterday.

I am now back at home and needed to take a short trip to a place I'd never been before. Turned the unit on. Let me see, I need to find a place. Why isn't there a choice for recreation, community, etc. Oh I know, I probably dont have the CN map active. Find the wrench, easy, find maps, ok. Hmmmmmm, no CN map and 5 versions of Topo 100k. WTF?!?!?!

OK, go to this thread. And there like magic is someone else with the same problem and the solution from Emmbeedee.

Thanks again.

BUT, why is this damned thing so complicated?
I know the answer already. It is so powerful and can be configured to do exactly what YOU want it to do, no matter what that may be.
Which means it aint for everybody.
But if you take the time to figure it out, or follow the lead of others on this thread it is a great device.

Now I need to start working this thing and getting it configured for my needs: Adventure Motorcycling, Mountain biking, Geocaching, On road car and motorcycling.

JB

Emmbeedee said: ↑

You're on a Mac, right? My most recent install to 2013.30 also didn't work. It kept telling me it was installed and the update was applied but it wasn't so I complained to Garmin. A nice young lady phoned me and I shared my computer with her, and she navigated to the place on my drive where the update resided, ran it from there and all was well from then on.

This screen shot shows where the update was found on my computer - yours should be similar.

Never mind the red arrows at the top left.

Click to expand...

snooker · Dec 24, 2012

snooker said: ↑

Inserting the CNNANT 2012 DVD will autorun and then Garmin Map Setup shows the following screen. The Continue key is greyed out until you either connect your GPSr or you click on "Have a device you cannot connect?" and then enter the serial number of it. This happened the very first time I ever popped in the DVD on my first PC. So I think it has to know what device you are "tying" your single device license to before it continues, as far as I can tell. That kind of makes sense to me since it is licensed only to a single GPSr.

On my first WinXP PC I installed CNNANT from DVD with its product key and did the Lifetime Update as well with its product key. So I have different 2 sets of CNNANT installed on my PC, but I have never used MapInstall (or anything else) to install any maps onto the Montana.

But the problem is, Now on my new Win8 notebook whether I connect the Montana or enter the serial number of it, it will go the next screen asking for the product key, and if I enter the product key from the DVD it says:
"The Product Key is not valid for this Map Update".

It does seem like it knows I have installed and updated with the latest version once and won't let me do it again, maybe thinking I should already have the latest for the GPSr I have specified. But it should be able to tell I am on a different computer (MAC Address or whatever). I wanted to get this installed for a present but guess I will have to wait until Garmin is open again, haven't found anything helpful in Garmin forum yet either.
Click to expand...

Well MBD gave me a good tip and I figured this out, thanks!

The solution was to go my.garmin.com, login and go to the My Maps tab. There it showed CNNANT 2013.30 and had a Download link. This is the latest version which is a result of my installing the nuMaps Lifetime Update earlier. Clicking on the Download link goes to a new page and a link to Download Map Updater, and when you click on that it downloads this executable called Map Updater. Note when you run it that it is a different program from the one above launched from the DVD. Instead it is running "Map Updater v3.1.20".

At this point it wants you to connect your GPSr but it does not ask you for a Product Key. Again note below it is Map Updater and not Map Setup which is running if you try an install from the DVD:

I think what I have learned here is that because CNNANT has the posssibility of a Lifetime Update, once you activate the Lifetime Update online and download a new update, then Garmin knows that fact and you can not use the (older) DVD version and install it, not even on a different PC. I am guessing the reason is that it knows you have already downloaded a newer update so the DVD is an older version.

For comparison, I *WAS* able to install the latest Topo US 24k Southwest onto my 2nd PC from the DVD, and it was able to install fine using the Product Key in the DVD cover. I'm guessing the reason is that there is no update available so this is still the latest one and it accepted the product key.

GSXR · Dec 25, 2012

Drif10 said: ↑

http://garminmontanagpsr.wikispaces.com/

First thing I read.

Well, after wading through a bunch of this thread until I found the wiki.
Click to expand...

Thanks Drif. That's a brilliant link.

Smithy

Drif10 · Dec 25, 2012

Smithy69 said: ↑

Thanks Drif. That's a brilliant link.

Smithy
Click to expand...

I'm just passing it on, I got it here. Somebody else did the work.

BergDonk · Dec 25, 2012

So I unpacked my new Montana 600 yesterday, thanks Santa, and have a had a bit of a play, and I seem to have one major problem that someone may be able to assist with.

It won't switch on with the supplied LiIon battery pack.

I installed the battery as per the instructions and plugged the GPS into the supplied mains charger. I did remove the packaging from the battery. Once the AC was on, it booted up, so I had a bit of a play and then switched it off to get the battery charged up for a few hours, a max of 4.5 hrs if flat according to the manual.

It won't turn on unless the mains charger is connected. It will however work OK with 3 AA Alkaline batteries fitted instead of the LiIon pack.

When I plug it into the computer, a W7 PC, It boots into a 'comms' state with a USB symbol on the screen and it won't allow anything else to happen.

My questions then are:

Should there be some sort of charging indication on the screen when an external power supply is connected via the USB cable?

Is it possible to use the Montana when its connected to a PC or is it purely a 'slave'? My 60CSX allows me to use it when its connected to the PC, so I expected the Montana would too.

What voltage should the LiIon battery pack have available at its various pins? The 2 outers measure 3.77 v and I get other voltages when measuring across other combinations, so I'm not sure what is right or wrong. The pack is rated at 3.7 v so I'm guessing that its the GPS itself that isn't connecting to the battery. All the connectors look OK as far as I can tell.

Thanks
Steve

Yossarian™ · Dec 25, 2012

BergDonk said: ↑

Should there be some sort of charging indication on the screen when an external power supply is connected via the USB cable?
Click to expand...

Yes, you should get a battery symbol on the screen if the Li-Ion pack is installed and charging.

BergDonk said: ↑

Is it possible to use the Montana when its connected to a PC or is it purely a 'slave'? My 60CSX allows me to use it when its connected to the PC, so I expected the Montana would too.
Click to expand...

The Montana is different; when in USB storage mode, that's all it can do.

BergDonk said: ↑

What voltage should the LiIon battery pack have available at its various pins?
Click to expand...

I have no idea.

My guess is that you have a bad battery pack.

atlas cached · Dec 25, 2012

BergDonk said: ↑

So I unpacked my new Montana 600 yesterday, thanks Santa, and have a had a bit of a play, and I seem to have one major problem that someone may be able to assist with.

It won't switch on with the supplied LiIon battery pack.

I installed the battery as per the instructions and plugged the GPS into the supplied mains charger. I did remove the packaging from the battery. Once the AC was on, it booted up, so I had a bit of a play and then switched it off to get the battery charged up for a few hours, a max of 4.5 hrs if flat according to the manual.

It won't turn on unless the mains charger is connected. It will however work OK with 3 AA Alkaline batteries fitted instead of the LiIon pack.

When I plug it into the computer, a W7 PC, It boots into a 'comms' state with a USB symbol on the screen and it won't allow anything else to happen.

My questions then are:

Should there be some sort of charging indication on the screen when an external power supply is connected via the USB cable?

Is it possible to use the Montana when its connected to a PC or is it purely a 'slave'? My 60CSX allows me to use it when its connected to the PC, so I expected the Montana would too.

What voltage should the LiIon battery pack have available at its various pins? The 2 outers measure 3.77 v and I get other voltages when measuring across other combinations, so I'm not sure what is right or wrong. The pack is rated at 3.7 v so I'm guessing that its the GPS itself that isn't connecting to the battery. All the connectors look OK as far as I can tell.

Thanks
Steve
Click to expand...

Tons of good information to answer all these questions available from the Montana wiki, including how to USE the Montana while connected to your computer!

Are you absolutely certain you are inserting the li-ion battery in the Montana correctly?

BergDonk · Dec 25, 2012

Yossarian;20327920 said:

Yes, you should get a battery symbol on the screen if the Li-Ion pack is installed and charging.

The Montana is different; when in USB storage mode, that's all it can do.

I have no idea.

My guess is that you have a bad battery pack.
Click to expand...

Thanks. I was initally suspicious of the battery pack, but it could also be the unit itself not connecting to the pack. I expect it'll be a warranty replacement, just gotta wait for the vendor to come back on line.

BergDonk · Dec 25, 2012

atlas cached said: ↑

Tons of good information to answer all these questions available from the Montana wiki, including how to USE the Montana while connected to your computer!

Are you absolutely certain you are inserting the li-ion battery in the Montana correctly?
Click to expand...

Thanks for this. I have previously had a look at the Wiki, and I guess I should have mentioned that too. I guess I'm just thick, but I can't find the answers to the questions that I've asked, and that's why I thought I'd try the ever helpful ADV community.

As far as using the Montana when connected to the PC, the Wiki explains how to get it to remain in USB mode which seems to have been an issue for some, but not that it can be used normally when connected to a PC. I note that Yossarian states that it can't, which is consistent with the evidence I have.

As far as fitting the battery, I did it as per the manual. Lined up the connections, put that end in first and then press the other end down. Removal is the reverse, with the non pin end being the power switch end.

FWIW this is not my first GPS device, I've been using them since about 1987.

I have got it visible in BaseCamp, and updated the firmware OK. And I can see the maps in BaseCamp OK too. I've been able to upload a couple of routes, although not tracks for some reason, but I want to sort the battery out before I get too far into it.

atlas cached · Dec 25, 2012

BergDonk said: ↑

Thanks for this. I have previously had a look at the Wiki, and I guess I should have mentioned that too. I guess I'm just thick, but I can't find the answers to the questions that I've asked, and that's why I thought I'd try the ever helpful ADV community.
Click to expand...

They certainly are a very friendly and helpful bunch!

BergDonk said: ↑

As far as using the Montana when connected to the PC, the Wiki explains how to get it to remain in USB mode which seems to have been an issue for some, but not that it can be used normally when connected to a PC. I note that Yossarian states that it can't, which is consistent with the evidence I have.
Click to expand...

Setup -> System -> Interface -> Garmin Spanner

When you connect your Montana via USB, it will ask if you wish to enter Mass Storage Mode.

Select 'No'.

The Montana will finish booting as if it were not connected to the computer, and you can continue to use it as such. If you have nRoute installed, it will read location information in real time from your Montana.

Very last line of the Mass Storage page in the wiki.

BergDonk said: ↑

As far as fitting the battery, I did it as per the manual. Lined up the connections, put that end in first and then press the other end down. Removal is the reverse, with the non pin end being the power switch end.

FWIW this is not my first GPS device, I've been using them since about 1987.

I have got it visible in BaseCamp, and updated the firmware OK. And I can see the maps in BaseCamp OK too. I've been able to upload a couple of routes, although not tracks for some reason, but I want to sort the battery out before I get too far into it.
Click to expand...

I agree, get the battery issue resolved ASAP, then move on.

If I can be of any further assistance, please let me know.

Yossarian™ · Dec 26, 2012

atlas cached said: ↑

Setup -> System -> Interface -> Garmin Spanner

When you connect your Montana via USB, it will ask if you wish to enter Mass Storage Mode.

Select 'No'.
Click to expand...

Learn something every day.

Thanks!

pizzaboy · Dec 26, 2012

Anyone seen any smoking deal on a Montana 650 for today ?

snooker · Dec 26, 2012

BergDonk don't forget to troubleshoot battery problems you can also try inserting AA batteries as an experiment. While 3 AA's put out 4.5-4.8volts, I'm a bit surprised at the voltage rating on the LithiumIon being so much lower than that?

BergDonk · Dec 26, 2012

snooker said: ↑

BergDonk don't forget to troubleshoot battery problems you can also try inserting AA batteries as an experiment. While 3 AA's put out 4.5-4.8volts, I'm a bit surprised at the voltage rating on the LithiumIon being so much lower than that?
Click to expand...

As I noted above, it works fine with 3 AAs and as you point out, if they are in series as seems likely, then 4.5-4.8 V. USB is supposed to be 5 V +/- 0.25V, so that's what it gets when connected to the PC, and presumably the supplied mains charger which is labelled 5 V 1 A.

The labelling on my LiIon battery pack indicates 3.7 V, 2000 mAh, 7.4 Wh. I assume the Montana's actual operating voltage must be down around 3.3-3.5 V after regulation, assuming that 3.7 V is the correct LiIon spec for the Montana.

My LiIon battery measures 3.77 V across the 2 outer pins and other lesser voltages with other pin combinations. What I don't know is why it has 4 pins, and what the voltage across the various combinations of the 4 pins should be.

If someone could measure the voltage of pins. 1-2, 1-3, 1-4, 2-3, 2-4, 3-4 for me that'd be really helpful in working out if its the battery or GPS. The pin nos I've arbitrarily assigned are if you remove the battery from the GPS, stand it on its end with the pin connections up, and on the left, and 1-4 are left to right.

BergDonk · Dec 26, 2012

atlas cached said: ↑

They certainly are a very friendly and helpful bunch!

Setup -> System -> Interface -> Garmin Spanner

When you connect your Montana via USB, it will ask if you wish to enter Mass Storage Mode.

Select 'No'.

The Montana will finish booting as if it were not connected to the computer, and you can continue to use it as such. If you have nRoute installed, it will read location information in real time from your Montana.

Very last line of the Mass Storage page in the wiki.

I agree, get the battery issue resolved ASAP, then move on.

If I can be of any further assistance, please let me know.
Click to expand...

When I had it connected to the PC it offered no option re the connection. I'm used to this behaviour with my Magellan Explorist XL. But I will have to experiment more, maybe it depends on the connection and boot sequence. All I have done to date is have the PC booted, connect the Montana and then turn it on. It boots straight to USB mass strorage mode without the choice. Maybe a hot conection changes this? I guess I'll find out. Its no big deal if this is the way it is, just unexpected, because the 60CSX doesn't care, and of course, it seems I should have a choice.

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