I lurk the Faceplant from time to time but it always makes me uncomfortable. Mostly because it's an aspect of our passion that I, like many riders don't care to think about. However I see a growing trend lately and it really has me wondering if, as a whole, our community can sit down these asshats and educate them before they kill themselves and our sport. I know youth is immortal and they won't hear a god dam word said to them, I didn't. So what about the DMV issuing 2 tier license test like in Japan. Make riders earn the next CC level and prove they are ready for bigger bikes. something has to change. This morning's frontpage headline: 2 killed in 3 motorcycle wrecks 55-year-old rider has both arms severed in Rt. 80 crash the story: BY ROB JENNINGS DAILY RECORD Tuesday, August 7, 2007 <!--StoryChat--><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width=280 border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top width=85> </TD><TD vAlign=top width=200>4 Comments </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>Three motorcycle accidents over the weekend claimed two lives and left two others seriously injured, authorities said. Two of the accidents were on Route 80 in Parsippany and Allamuchy, while the third was on Route 15 in Sparta. In the first crash at 3:58 a.m. Saturday, Kire Talevski, 41, of Landing was heading west in a Route 80 express lane near mile marker 44 in Parsippany when he lost control of his 2007 Yamaha, state police spokesman Sgt. Stephen Jones said. Highway conditions at the time were described by police as wet and foggy. <SCRIPT language=JavaScript></SCRIPT>Talevski, who was wearing a helmet, was thrown from his motorcycle. He was found in the left shoulder; the bike came to a stop in the right shoulder, police said. He was pronounced dead at the scene at 4:31 a.m., police said. Hit guardrail In the second crash at 6:59 a.m. Sunday, William C. Freeman, 55, of Staten Island, N.Y. was heading west in a right lane on Route 80 near mile marker 18.8 in Allamuchy Township when he lost control of his 2007 Harley-Davidson and struck the right guardrail, police said. The impact severed both his arms, police said. Highway conditions at that time were described by police as clear and dry. Freeman was taken to Morristown Memorial Hospital, where a hospital spokeswoman on Monday said he remained in critical condition. Investigations into both these accidents are continuing. Thrown onto Rt. 15 Later Sunday, at 5:15 p.m., a 32-year-old woman from Union County -- a passenger on a 2005 Suzuki GSX -- was killed after being thrown from the motorcycle, authorities said. Her name was not immediately released. The driver, a 45-year-old man, was traveling south on Route 15 in Sparta when he swerved to avoid hitting a parked vehicle and instead sideswiped an oncoming 2002 Chevrolet Tahoe in the northbound lane, according to a police report. He was also ejected from the motorcycle, police said, and airlifted to Morristown Memorial Hospital with serious neck and head injuries. Motorcycle safety is a growing issue nationwide -- including New Jersey, where fatalities rose from 61 two years ago to 83 in 2006. The state Motor Vehicle Commission launched a safety campaign last spring, shortly after two riders were killed in separate accidents on the same day on Route 80. I'm just sick by this stuff and wonder how many lives we could save by simply changing our licensing test and manditory rider skills courses? I dunno, Just sick of it Joe
Although not mentioned in the report, riders in crashes are often unlicensed as well as uninsured for the motorcycle. In those cases, tiered licenses and mandatory training would avail little.
Can't help the insurance, but you can prevent registering a bike you're not qualified to ride. That won't stop the problem, but it'll help.
We could save about zero. Lets face it, most people don't practice skills in a meaningful way. I would even bet that the vast majority of riders reach a certin skill level and then never move beyond that. Infact I believe, from watching people I have known for years ride, I think their skills deteriorate due to lack of use and quite possibly ego. Honestly.....how many HOURS of REAL skills practice do people put in? I'm not talking a few panic stops in some parking lot every few days. ATGATT is probably the better bet for saving lives. Even then there is the inevitableaccident that will over ride any and all gear. But I bet it's the most effective. How about this.....How many lives would be saved by revoking the license of people who do dangerous things on the road? Crank up the penalties for dangerous actions, both car and bike. Impound their bikes. Put them on the bus for a year or two? File the action with DMV and do not allow them to register ANY vehicle.
Lets face it....riding and driving in this country is a joke. We have minimal driver training that barely covers the basics. Some states have limited or graduated licenses but it doesnt do much when their parents are bad drivers too. This country was built around the mentality that it is my right to do whatever I damn well please and you just try to stop me....oh and if I screw up I am not responsible. The only way that drivers are going to get safer is by the fuel running out.
Speaking of the inexperienced killing themselves, this was in our local paper this weekend. "SACRAMENTO CA.-- Two area men were killed Saturday in separate motorcycle accidents. Jarrad Cole, 18, of Fair Oaks, crashed at about 11:50 a.m. as he was leaving a driveway in the 8500 block of Nephi Way. Cole, a top scorer for Sacramento Waldorf's basketball team last season, had recently obtained his permit and was practicing riding his 2003 Suzuki GSX motorcycle, purchased just two days earlier, according to a report from the California Highway Patrol. The CHP said Cole accidently "popped a wheelie" as he accelerated through a left-hand curve, then lost control of the motorcycle, landing on a neighboring embankment landscaped with river rocks and railroad tie timbers. Cole was taken to Mercy San Juan Medical Center, where he died less than an hour later. Christopher Ramos, 22, of Sacramento, died at about 3:30 a.m. after his motorcycle skidded out of control near American River Drive and Howe Avenue and hit a building, according to Sacramento Police Lt. Don Rehm." I think it would be a very good idea for a 2-tier license system like the UK has. No 18 year old kid should be driving a GSXer for his first bike.
Amen!!! Among the many bad habits of American drivers, it baffles me why we let kids juggle learning how to drive and the distraction of talking on a cell phone at the same time. Drivers age 16-21 should not be allowed to talk on a cell phone while driving, period.
You first speak of youth then list three middle aged people. Could there be better training? YES. Should we go to tiered licensing? NO FUCKING WAY. NEW LAWS.... IS NOT A ROAD YOU WANT TO GO DOWN. A new law for this, a new law for that... Before you know it you will not even be able to buy a decent bike. If you like the socialist laws in the UK & Japan then move there and have all the restrictive fun you can. I for one like it the way it is here. Face it motorcycles can be dangerous. Why do you think we ride? It is the pleasure of not having a cage around us. It is the difference of wacthing a movie (driving) and Staring in the movie (Riding) It is freedom. Keep it free!!!
I assume you have never heard of the Isle of Mann and the sanctioned racing that goes on there on public roads? FYI - The UK has a thriving sport bike market. All riders must learn on a 125cc bike for a year before buying one.
And... Is that what you want to happen here? NOT ME. Like I said before. If you like the socialist laws in the UK & Japan then move there and have all the restrictive fun you can.
I don't think that's a bad idea. Some people might not like it, but I bet the people who make it past that first year, and decide this motorcyle thing is really for them, will be way better riders. The law already makes compromises between safety and personal freedom, like taxes, seat belts, helmets, traffic lights, etc... I think this one would be worth it. Only one year of compromise, for who knows how many lives saved. And please don't give me any "slippery slope" counterarguments about heading towards socialism
June 2006, I bought a used Yamaha 125 --82 vintage when my wife, daughter and son decided to take the MC class for the license endorsement in Washington state. They all passed-- stories about other members of the class who already had bikes and failed-- due to many reasons -- bad attitude, dropping the bike on day 2 or 3, failing the written part-- My son still in college-22-- took the Yamaha 125 beater to school where he rides it when it is running. No one has stolen it yet and it is unlikely to go faster than 45 mph -- unless down hill with the wind. A year has passed, I picked up a F650GS for my wife-- she does ride it but has not gone over 45 mph yet. My daughter has ridden it also. My son came home for the weekend. We went for a ride about 35 miles in rural King county in Wa last sat. My son rode the F650GS, my wife on the back of my bike, R1150RS. All went well. My son rides well, and has ridden his buddy's Honda 600 and 1000 cc. My son has no problem with riding the F650GS-- After the ride, I let my son do one loop [about a mile] around the block on the R1150RS. He said he liked the bike-- He plans on getting a bike, but I want him to finish college as top priority... I think he'll be getting a used Honda 600 this winter. I'd like to find another F650 for him... Anyways, if you can get a kid to work [ride and experiment] with a small bike for awhile, I think it is a good idea. I had a Honda cb125 from my brother, 40 years ago for my prime vehicle when 17 and 18. It would do 70 with the wind.. 40 against. My first bike I bought was a 73 Honda CB750 --new. I never had any problems or crashes. It would do 115+ but only on dead empty roads. Even at my age now, I still like to give it tha gas, but respect the congestion of the city and the windy hilly roads out here. I think I read a thread where in Germany the limit is 27 HP for 2 years. I think a simple gradual cc or hp is a good idea. Too many kids doing 100+ and finding the back end of a truck or a curve they have no idea on how to stay on the road. Hell, I think I still have skills to improve after all these years. It is not only important to know what you know but also what you don't know.... Cheers from the rainy NW.
I am sure that Jarred would have strongly supported your position, saying: "small bikes are for pussy's." Now he is dead because he was trying to learn how to ride a motorcycle far too powerful for a beginner rider. The 2-tier license idea would save a lot of young men who think they are immortal. I rest my case.
If squid kids keep pulling the street stunts, and getting killed at the the current rate, you won't be able to buy a performance bike in this country. How will you dig that? I'm all for the tiered system, and an improved driver education. European drivers are far superior to drivers here.
yes yes...we get it...you all know better and no self-respecting advrider on a DS bike would ever have such unfortunate circumstances befall him. wake up...it can happen to any rider. at any time. sounds like a lot of you need a reality check. abe
Only one year... Are you a complete ignoramous? Have you any idea how our legislature works? You say: "don't give me any slippey slope counter...bla bla bla". Oh, forgive me. I just noticed that you are one of the enlightened ones from the peoples republic of kalifornia. Go ahead. Legislate yourself into a corner. Don't come sniveling to me when you can't even buy a decent bike in ten years. Tiered Licensing is a very bad idea. Only a year. If you can't be a grown up and take responsibilty for yourself then stay the fuck off of motorcycles. Stay the fuck off the road period. It is my year to freely do with what I want / ride what I want. Keep your hands off. If you want to ride a 125 go for it have fun. You will die just as quick on a 125 as on a 1200.
This is exactly my point, people don't take responsibility for themselves. Instead, they get on advanced motorcycles and endanger themselves and others. I'm starting on a 250 because I think beginners should learn on beginner bikes. How hard is it for me to ride around on this one for a year before I move up? Not hard at all.
Of course it can. It just happens to happen to the younger riders on 600+ sport bikes way more often. I'm 23 and on my first bike. I'll have the rest of my life to gain the skills necessary to operate a 100+ horsepowered two wheeled machine. OF COURSE something can happen and I can die or get hurt on my 250. It's a dangerous sport. I just like my chances WAY better than if I were on a GSXr, that's all.
That's nice but don't you worry about me. If I legislate myself into a corner, I'll just move to Canada.