Why the 1200s?

Hey all. I'm new around and was reading some threads. In a couple of months, I might be moving so I was reconsidering my bike. I am fairly new to riding, so excuse the question if it is dumb.

I usually ride a Honda XR250 around town. Where I currently am, it is marketed as a small dual sport bike. I do most of my riding in pavement and often find that 250cc is good for zipping around a busy town. I almost never do any off roading and mostly stick to pavement. So far, the bike has done well for me.

I was considering the 800GS or the Tiger 800 XC when I move, mostly because I find that my XR250 lacks on mid and long travels. I figured that despite having bigger engines, they still look somewhat agile while being able to deliver speed on highways. 800cc seems to me a great deal of power, being able to easily deliver speeds of 150-180 km/h with no problem, more than enough for crossing continents.

My question is, why do some riders opt for the 1200s? What do they look for that 800ccs can't deliver? Why do they opt for more ccs and sacrifice maneuverability?

Any insights you can provide are greatly appreciated!

I have a Tiger 800 now, and I used to have a few 1000cc bikes and have done lots of miles on them all. To me the 800 is perfect, good power for cruising, but not so much that you can't use it on the streets without getting arrested. The only place the 800 lacks is in high speed highway riding, 80mph+. At that point the engine is doing over 6000rpms and really feels like it's working, and the gas mileage nosedives. I hate highway riding anyway and avoid it whenever I can, so I don't care. But if I was going to be doing a lot of Highway, I'd want a 1200 or 1000cc bike, as they can do those high speeds for a long time effortlessly and their mpg doesn't take a huge hit.

It can take a lot of motor to deal with 30 mph headwinds doing 75 mph on an interstate loaded up for a week or two.

So 800ccs are not enough to ride at 80 mph?

My XR250 can reach a max cruising speed of about 70 mph. The engine is working, of course, and mileage plummets. I thought 800ccs would easily reach 900-100 mph.

Guess I need to do more research!

Not being smart here... But go ride a 1200 and you may well answer your own question.

IMHO, unless you're drag racing, there isn't anything you can do with an over liter bike that you can't do with 800cc. The bigger/heavier thing is all marketing hype. Is America... bigger is better right?
Granted 250cc's is a bit puny for long distance comfort/capacity but a properly set up 800 is more than adequate for mere mortal uses.

You may be taking too much stuff with you. My 800XC does very well in those conditions you described above. But you know what, I only take the interstate for very few miles at a time, just to cross to the other side of the world of nice roads divided by the boring interstate. So even if it could not handle the wind, it would not really matter.

And yes, I know about 1200's because I own one of those too. And even that nice bike, that cruises well at 100mph or above (not that I've ever done that perhaps I just read about it in the interwebs), I do not take on the interstate. What a waste of tires!

Yes, 1200's will tax the maneuverability. And 800ccs bike will do fine! Even smaller ones do fine, like the V-strom 650. Unless of course you are a heavy dude and travel with lots of gear and/or two-up, the 650-800cc bikes will do just fine.

Some people travel two-up on 650-800cc machines around the world. Usually they are not American, though.

Heck, when I had my XL250 I traveled two-up all the time, with gear for a week! Yes, I wished it had more power, but I never dreamed of an 800cc enduro machine on those days. The closest largest thing available was the XL600 at that time, and I already thought it was too much. I had long eyes for an XL350 those days.

Yes, the 800XC or the F800GS have plenty of power for long distance travel and are still agile enough for some urban fun.

Sure enough, but it's not the best cruising speed -- with more cc you add comfort, stability, easiness, pay load and high altitude resilience. Someone just thinks he needs all of this

Thanks guys for your replies.

I'm not torn between 800cc and 1200cc. Based on my type of riding, I think the 800cc would do just fine for me.

I was mostly asking because I've noticed a surge of people around me talking about 1200cc bikes and wanted to understand what the fuss was all about.

I'm about 240 lbs and about 6'1" ft tall. I'm overweight, but I still believe that and 800 cc beast would do just fine. If the XR250 can do it, I would expect either one of the bikes I mentioned to do it. I just want a more relaxed engine at higher speeds.

Subaru kept increasing their ground clearance with every new generation until they got to 8.7" (221mm)

For about ten years or so they have kept this number.

I guess it offers the best off-roading until the handeling and fuel economy start to be a negative.

__
So, to answer you question, I do not know.

__
A lot of folk have typed before that maybe the whole ADV touring thing is mostly an image thing.

I mean, premium gas in a RTW vic. WTF, sigh.
However, the new R1200GS takes reg. unleading now, so that is good. Except it is more street. So, sigh again.
_

Back to useing cages to help me communicate.

Maybe it's kind of like asking why people lease cars instead of buying.
Leasing is cool if
1. You like the newsest thing
2. You like to have a warrenty to take care of stuff.
3. (this is the most important one) You do not go over the 10K, 12K, or even 15K miles/year agrement.
(16,093 KM/ 19,312 KM, 24,140 KM)

__
I can see the importance of a 1200 cc MC when 2 up and caring gear.
The Super Tenere (1200cc) would be a great MC for a RTW trip with a passenger.
If the team split the cost and the fuel cost and such, it would be one hell of a bargain!

I bought my 1200 because it was a smoking deal and because I wanted to get something my wife would ride on more. 800 Tiger was one of my choices, but it is just too small for two people and gear. I like the room I have on the 1200 and it cruises well on the highway. I don't think it is too bad to handle off road, but I have a lot of experience.

they say... bigger is better

I think it also depends where you live. Utah has 80mph speed limits and a constant 20-30mph headwind.

But...

I think the perfect "adventure" bike would be a liquid cooled 650 with 50-70 hp, have LONG service intervals (Yamaha 25k valves), strong frame to pile the crap onto it, and weigh in under 400lbs, fully fueled with 6 gallons. Yamaha, PLEASE bring the 660 over. Anyone? Oh, that's right. Americans only want 900lb cruisers..............

Two up and/or lots of interstate riding? 1200 Super Tenere.

I would have bought an 800cc boxer engine without even thinking about the larger one. But this is the US. People here think you need huge engines to reach the speed limit. What a bunch of BS.

Every single one of the bikes I had, even the tiny ones was able to go with the flow on the freeway. Even uphill. Sure a 250cc might strained uphill, but everything from 400 or 500cc up is just plain fine.

The reason I have a 1200cc bike is because I don't get all the goodies the new GS has in a small bike. If they made 800cc boxer in the F800GT form, with LED lights, all the other electronics and niceties, I'd have that one. I just wanted all the gizmos. In the last few years I had an F800GS, DL650 (wife's), R1200GS, WR250X, Tiger 800, R1200GS LC, R1200R (wife's), after having lots of 400 to 750cc bikes back in Europe. By far the best engine of all these was the 800cc Triple in the Tiger. Could have used a longer 6th gear, but that was it.

But if you want a shaft drive, electric/electronic gizmos, high and relaxed seating position, and excellent hard luggage, there isn't much in the smaller classes. Selection in Europe is much better than in the US, but so be it. I ride a 1200 now and don't think it's too big a bike. It's bigger than I would buy given other choices, but that's not possible.

Highway stability is the big thing for me. The Super Tenere is almost as good in a crosswind as my last cruiser, where my KLR seemed almost eager to jump into the next lane.

And then don't forget there's a Veek for the 'real world'. If you don't puke at the sight of it, i would think about it also.

I don't want to threadjack too much but - does anyone know where the KTM 990 falls on the maneuverability continuum? Closer to 1200s or the 800s? I like my dad's Tiger 800, but off road I prefer the KLR650 because it just feels...cheaper if you fall maybe?

This is an answer that is closer to my personal answer. Looking at bikes today, I notice that the only way to get the full electronics pack and other goodies is to get the big bikes. In fact, the only reason why I find myself looking at the bigger bikes is to get the additional gadgetry; not because I'm seriously considering that I need extra power for my riding style.

Torque - the ability to potter about in top gear at 40mph, open the throttle wide and accelerate hard without changing gear.

A little bike will accelerate pretty much as hard but you have to put more effort in to achieve it. A big engine makes everything more effortless, and on a long on-road journey you'll arrive less tired on a bigger bike.

Also big bikes are more about what we want and less about what we need. Some of us just want the biggest that's available, and there's nothing wrong with that.

Downsides are few. Initial cost is higher. Weight is more, but once you're moving you don't really notice it. Fuel consumption is a little higher but at the same speed a 1200 will not use much more than an 800 - it takes the same amount of energy to part the breeze....