NYC commuters?

It was pretty much implied by the OP's post that "it's stupid to ride in this city without ABS" as if that was the only solution to riding in the city. To his credit, he did mull briefly over what he could have done but he did conclude with wanting to have ABS- implying that is the only thing that will save him in the future.

Then, in your snarkiness, you said you would need to go down to 10 MPH at intersections to prevent a crash- though if you stay at 30 (the legal limit any way), it can get the job done and you can stop before the car actually crosses your path as in your example. If the car is closer than that, even ABS wont shorten your braking distance, esp at a higher speed. This just implied that if you have ABS you will definitely go faster and keep yourself (and other road users) at higher risk rather than slow down and think.

Forget semantics but I have not implied anywhere that all ABS is dangerous and I have said it before that I know ABS can be helpful in certain situations and to certain people more than others. Hence I mentioned KTM's new system- which is so far the only moto-ABS that has not been "defeated", yet- and that's why IMO, the only system to actually work like it should. My personal experiences with ABS in cities (in better roads than NY) has been different than maybe yours, but it does not make it any less true. Ditto for others but you choose to disregard other people's bad experiences with the technology to push your point through your experiences, conjecture and even publications (because maybe you believe that's the final word?)- even though all of these are realities that do not make the other untrue.

However, as I have been trying to say, any crash is not the result of just one factor. People are free to believe that ABS will save them even if they choose to be irresponsible in certain situations- that simply won't be true though. The mentality and technology, both have to work together. Cars are more forgiving that motorcycles and we all know that and we should think in a slightly different way about these things. It would be more helpful if we introspected a little more rather than getting defensive when asked to.

Sounds like you had a great morning! I am glad that all the roads have been finished. Earlier this summer, that was a hot mess. Maybe, I should get the FZ up on those twisties before winter comes knocking again.

That sounds awesome. It's exactly what I'm going to do tomorrow but it's a bit further for me. Going to leave 7am and come back by 1130am to Brooklyn.



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Looking forward to tagging along and getting out of the city. Riding [red light] in [red light] Brooklyn [red light] is driving me [red light] crazy!

Where you going? And what was the name of the phone bracket you got at B&H? I just got an iPhone 6 and need a mount

ooooo, iphone6!

new toys...ahem...tools....



ymmv

be well.

rob

Ram mount!
Union garage has them and so does BH.
My 2nd time around buying it I actually got the M8 bolt attachment instead of the U Bolt.
http://city-gs.com/2014/06/13/iphone-mount-power/

We are going up to bear mountain leaving Brooklyn around 7am if you'd like to join.
PM or email me if interested.


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The implication exists only in your mind. How the implication got there is anyone's guess but the way I see it, it's solely you and your projections. Most of us here know George well enough to know that your projections - that ABS is the only solution or that it's the only thing that will save him - is the farthest thing from his mind. And I'm fairly certain it's the farthest thing from anyone else's mind here as well. Except you, I mean, of course.

As for whether it's stupid to ride here without ABS, I'd say it's foolish to ride here without taking advantage of every possible opportunity to gain some additional safety margin. ABS is proven technology. It's not [just?] a cash conspiracy between the IIHS and Bosch. It has huge benefits in most of the situations we here in NYC face every minute we spend on the road here and presents only the tiniest of liabilities.

Not investing in ABS or getting in the habit of turning it off before you've even left your garage because it only works in 80% (or whatever) of situations, i.e. not while you're heeled over in a turn, or while you're in the sand dunes of the Pine Barrens, is what I would call a poor evaluation of cost/benefit ratio. Unless you have some shite first-generation thing perhaps.

FWIW I was playing around in my friend's gravel driveway today. At 75' or so, not really long enough for a thorough test, but I can say I didn't have any issues with the ABS on my new VFR. And that's not KTM's MCS, BMW's ASC or Honda's CABS. Though if I end up in the Barrens I do know which fuse to pull.

Oh by the way, stop by the Ear and introduce yourself. You'll find out I'm much different in person. I'm a LOT SNARKIER!

I can say from personal experience that you are absolutely wrong about being OK at 30, and known physics will back that up.

Instead of saying you are absolutely wrong about the legal speed limit I'll just say you're making grand (and incorrect) assumptions.

Your continued assertions about ABS and panic braking distances are by and large incorrect. Did you read either of those articles I posted? Have you paid any attention to the issues surrounding unpredictable pavement features and contaminations? Are you forgetting about human reaction times?

And once again you invent these implications that have absolutely no connection to reality. It is annoying and antagonistic. Give it a rest.

You seem quick to assume the worst of everyone here.

As soon as you let go of your assumption that ABS will turn us all into reckless maniacs, things should be a little more peaceful here.

Yes, I know, it happens. Ask any 4WD driver how he ended up in the snowy embankment. That's a human issue. It doesn't mean 4WD is the work of the devil or that it needs further technical evolution so as not to be "defeated".

Let's try to think better of our fellow inmates here, eh?

[EDIT: Except me of course; I'm a total asshole]

Thanks,
Brad

hey i mostly lurk this and the LI threads however i made my way up this route this morning. it was great thanks. riding an sv1k, somehow i glanced over your dirt road warning. perfect amount of dirt for me lol. i left around 7:30am and there was no traffic anywhere really. I got there around 10:20ish (I left from LI).

route i took home is this https://goo.gl/maps/1v3Qn
hit traffic at GCP after whitestone bridge welcome back home. overall a great day of riding though thanks again.

here's a bonus pic at milltown rd.

So, how were the waffles? Glad you enjoyed the ride. I had an SV1K, in fact that was my NY plate for it, but the 1 year only ('03) naked version. Great bike. What town did you start from on the island, curious about the time?

Was great. Started from Mineola approx 130 mi. Took some breaks and went at a leisurely pace

You know what's awesome... ESC.


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I have got a ram mount, but I don't think it is bomb proof. If my iPhone is in a wooden case, the vibration moves it around. If the iPhone moves towards vertical rather than horizontal plane the vibration also can move it.

Since the iPhone six is thinner, which means less friction on the four rubber points, And more surface area, be more concerned if it's not protected from on rushing air.

I feel like there should be a safety wire, because it's fine 99 of the time, unless it isn't, in which case you're kind of unhappy.

I also push my rubber mounts down every time I get on the bike. That's not superstitious, they're just always coming up very slightly.

My friend has lost a couple of his rubber caps, but mine haven't moved. It seems to be hit or miss.

I wonder if weatherstripping adhesive might help.

Only annoyance for me is turning off automatic rotate to use it.

Wow, let me just make two things clear. One, you are completely wrong about me and two, I never assumed the worst of anyone. I think this is a great forum with some great people who are very helpful and I have never said anything that was in contrary to that.

You guys may know each other and understand each other completely. That's great but you don't know me at all and the conclusions that you are drawing seem to be based purely on your prejudice and your constant need to be right. All I know is that it's amazing that asking a little more introspection (and for using caution) only leads to more defensive rants. That is what is annoying, so give it a rest. We are just having a conversation, no need to lose sleep over it.

I probably used the wrong term- you asked where it was "implied"- to me, an understanding of implication means how it was implied to me, so yes, it is in my head. As is, everything that you think I am implying. We can get into the whole semantics and argue about "implications", "assumptions" etc all day long - but there are some things that are pretty objective.

Like, unless DOT is lying to all of us, I do believe that 30MPH IS the legal speed limit (except for the new 25mph zones). And again, in my own experience, 30 is OK but I had assumed that, at least you would have logically inferred that it means slowing down way before the intersection (not in the middle) when you spot the guy turning/about to turn, taking into account thinking and stopping distance. Obviously I was wrong and need to spell that out for you. So yes, when you protest to slowing down at an intersection, I can't help but assume that you want to be more reckless than one should to create safe traffic conditions. And if you feel that at a higher speed, when you are actually closer to the person turning left, that ABS is going to save you- I hope that for your sake that it does. This happens to me almost everyday (including today) on my commute on Ocean Ave that is a two-way with several intersections where someone is going to try and pull a left turn right in front of my trajectory. Though one can sometimes go up to 40 or 50, 25-30 seem the safest speed to react to most situations. To just confirm on this, today I did some quick brake checks at traffic signals as I would in emergency situations to see if I could stop in time(the stop line being the line where the car would turn in front of me in panic situations)- and I did, at 30mph. Maybe it was helped by the FZ09's strong engine braking, or it's light weight or the super sticky Michelin Pilot 4s or maybe the speedo has an error in displaying the correct speed- I can't be sure what's at play here. Physics, controlled road tests or even your experiences may be right in their own way- but it cannot invalidate mine, which are not just "grand assumptions" as you would like to assume.

That said, for the same purpose, the need to go down to 10MPH or slower is true in South Asian nations where the traffic does not afford one the luxury of space and time as it does here- and if you have ridden there, you will understand how fortunate we are here to have easier traffic conditions, even in NYC. This is also not based on assumptions but my own personal experience. I have always supported every thing that makes riders safe (including ABS) but never anything exclusively.

As for those articles, I have ready them even before you posted them. However, I don't think that still makes it okay for you to dismiss people's bad experiences with ABS. Just like I did not dismiss people's good experiences with it. I merely mentioned what I or others have felt while using ABS. And as I said before, my concern, based on meeting other riders and seeing how things are mentioned here (without having any way of knowing how someone "actually" feels or what kind of person they are in real life- I am no mind reader here), is that people put too much faith in technology without questioning human error too. Your defensiveness just makes me assume that even more so.

It really is a simple thing and your assumptions that I think "the worst" of anyone is baseless and based on your own presumptions and (since it seems like a valid argument for you supposedly) because you don't know me. You can spin things however you want but I would advice you to not instigate others by insinuating that I have assumed something bad of them when I really haven't. It's just petty.

I am done with this dog-chasing-its-tail discussion but you can feel free to continue if you like.

ps: Congrats on the new VFR, I didn't even realize that you had already bought it!

Do you guys use the lock for the mount? How do you keep it secure? I have just started using it but it feels so easy to steal if kept unlocked. I stow it away under the seat for now.

I find the rotating thing just a bit annoying but not terribly so. Anyone found a solution to keep it locked in position?

My main gripe is that using Android phones, the rubber caps tend to press the power or volume buttons. Re-positioning the phone seems unsafe as it makes it lop-sided...anyone got a solution for that? Or is it still secure enough? Has worked so far for me but just hard for me to trust it that way.

Otherwise, I am impressed with the quality of the Ram mounts.

If we can bring the ABS debate to a halt for a minute, pun intended, how did the Distinguished Gentleman's Ride go yesterday? Here's a recap of my local one: http://advrider.com/forums/showpost.php?p=25172756&postcount=3095

I don't lock my ram mount. They only people that would steal it are other moto riders or a random asshole who just wants to be an asshole.

If they steal it I'm out $30. They aren't going to steal the M8 bolt or the U Bolt - they would just steal the actual phone clamp and the arm. I'm not nervous so far.


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the DGR passed by me on the WSH @ canal while i was triking out to the bronx. they were a good 50 strong. majority of them were decked out in suitish attire. couple of them were ATGATT.