What Dual Sport should Honda build next

Keep us updated on your mileage. I might have to grab one and DS it.

Absolutely. Have discussed with a very knowledgable pro guy and very tempted to DS a CRF-X...but not quite!

Interested like others to hear how the newer 250X and 450X do as DS/ adventure rigs. And as well, I am very interested to hear how the new 500 and 350 KTMs will do for DS and adventure. Info appreciated. Have read that the KTM 350 did great in Baja and Morocco...

Would be nice to have that performance in a lower-maintenance less- problems ride...maybe soon?

I d/sed a crf450x back in '08. Its been an awesome bike! No issues whatsoever, no need to swap intake valves...the key her is to keep a clean air filter and make sure the things mounted correctly... its the dirt that gets the intakes. Tiny flat one ring piston keeps chugging along. Its a little weaker after 10000 miles but only by a tiny bit. Might swap into a TRX 2 ring version at rebuild, though it would hamper the 450's awesome fast spool up... Its got the full race Honda book mods done on it too, heaps of power.

No need for a 6 speed at all. I have to wonder about all the comments about the need for a wide ratio box...it comes with one! Its the R version that has the close ratio box! I can hit 100mph with 15/45 gears and its still low enough for most stuff. Technical single track s easier 14/45, and its still got a top end that can easily cruise at 70... I really fail to see the need for a 6th beyond just having one because the KTM do.

Added an oil cooler so it would hold more, though its really no biggie. Bigger tanks...I have several on up to the gigantic 7+ Acerbis. Add a stater, hand controls and lights and its good to go. In fact, I ripped all that stuff back off, unnecessary. Brake light switches and a rear tail with a license light are all thats required here in NC. Even dumped the soft bags too, backpack works fine. Trick is to travel with only the stuff ya need, take twice as much money and half as much stuff.

CRFX makes a great ds!

Honda could make a bike with a nice frame and the XR650R motor to replace the XR650L, I think it's about due. I mean, seriously, is their anything even in the works?

There is good reason why we have the term "Yawnda". Completely uninspired designs provided by bean counters and focus groups - whether it be cars, snow blowers, generators, or motorcycles.

Soichiro is spinning in his grave at 10K rpm.

Very. Cool. Thanks

Edit to add: What you say there makes me want to wait and hope for a street-legal CRF450 Rally!

Honda should build a 1981 XL500. I had one, 20 years later, and it was the best dual sport I've ever had by far. Way better than the KLR650 and XR650L, and I'm assuming the DR650 as well. Unfortunately the PO had not treated it well, and the engine blew up. And as is typical for Honda, I could not get parts to fix it.

Xl500.

Thanks for taking the time to compile that. Pretty much describes it. I try to follow whether or not some KTMs or the new models are better. Maybe some day, but then the price. In spite of the bs banter, it is true that Honda makes some high-performance motorcycles similar to KTM, but better for reliability and maintenenance.

In spite all of the things we don't like, Honda makes great motorcycles. Some models made just one or two years are seen running for 20-30 years, some have a cult following.

Very unfortunate that the latest offering 250L is 317 lbs, not a great dual sport at all, a mall cruiser or dirt road rider.

Yep, the XR400R resurrected on new frame and suspension and FI, or my dream slightly smaller 300, would be a great dual sport that one could trail ride on real terrain.

If you keep spewing this tripe this thread can go on forever. You have anecdotal evidence at best.

Tell me what "great high-performance bikes" Honda has produced for the dual sport/enduro market in the last 10 years.

And I would put up KTMs RFS series of bikes against any Honda built for reliability and maintenance. Keep in mind that I've actually owned both an XRR and a KTM RFS bike. Pay attention, because this is the important part.....actual empirical evidence.

You do know that dual sport bikes require regular maintenance, right? There is no bike you can just flog.

That "list" you are parading around is due to one thing only...the amount of riders that are on KTMs now. Period.

RyanR, very impressive? How is that CRF250x for riding highway between dirt road etc sections? How is it for say 2 hrs slab before the next dirt?

The local dealer has the 250x and 450x with DS kits sitting there ready to buy....looks nice.

With about 55hp would make me happy, as long as it was just as reliable as before. EFI and water cooling would probably do it.

Well, I've owned plenty of RFS bikes too, and XRs going back to the 1970's, CRF's now... race prepped both kinds too.

IMHO, I do like the RFS bikes but they don't hold up as well as the Honda's. I've seen too many cast pistons crumble and output shafts sheer off to believe in KTM reliability. I think they have a great platform, but the QC just isn't there as it is in Japan.

This is my good buddy Hal just a few days ago riding his purchased from new 02 520 EXC with 18k miles on it. Original Engine, top end, valves, etc. You can see he is not easy on his bike. The other bike is a GasGas 2-stroke

Skill aside, does Honda even make a bike that could ride these trails, at these speeds...safely? Does it have a bike that makes the power that can do roll-on wheelies in 3rd and 4th gear to get through puddles and over obstacles? Has it EVER made a bike with the brakes, suspension and HP to ride like this?

This is why everyone I know started on Japanese bikes, and now ride Euro...
Tower City, Pa
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I am odd, and do not want Honda to build a KTM type race bike, but I wish they built a good light mid sized street biased dual sport like the SL350 used to be.
A smooth 350 twin that makes enough power for real street use, a nice seat that would fit two adults, lower weight and seat height, and around 7 or 8 inches of suspension.
No, not a water cooled motocross looking bike, not a 500+ pound street bike with dual sport tires, just a general purpose long lasting practical mid size bike that is happy on the road or in the dirt, no 36 inch seat height, no plastic frames, crappy seats, 1/2 quart of oil, radiators hanging off the bike.

Move to Europe. There are dozens to choose from.

I've owned the XRR and RFS as well. So far, my experience has also been that the RFS is at least as reliable as the Honda. The Honda never gave me any issues, and neither has the KTM so far (and it has seen more abuse than the Honda). That being said (and back to the original question), I would love to see Honda offer a modern, street legal, incarnation of the XR400.

Seems reasonable, I appreciate what you posted. Thanks. I guess one accepts one or the other limitation...

I agree with many that I would like to see a dualsport Honda 300cc to 500 cc at around 270lbs, a motorcycle that one can ride trail terrain on.

A flash in the pan high-performance disposable motorcycle that lasts like 5 minutes compared to something like a Honda. Or, get a Honda, Yamaha, or Suzuki and ride it hard every day for a decade or more, not excessive maintenance/ rebuilding, does the job well enough (unless one has some need to fulfill with that $10k investment for a few seconds faster:huh). Does that performance margin really matter if one is not racing- myself and lots of folks I talk to know that a eg Honda etc riding with a KTM is not just left behind recreationally, very reasonable if one has sober consideration, self-confidence, ego control...

Most folks understand the score. Some, particularly KTM blowhard punks (not to be confused with fine citizens who ride excellent KTM motorcycles), just sound like they are compensating for something else missing in their life. This Honda blowhard just does not want to accept the illogic and bullshit of blowhard punks who do not want to allow others to have an opinion, preference, or enjoy their choice. WTF- like some religious fanaticism these KTM blowhards (again, not to be confused with fine KTM owners who post here, a couple of friends of mine, very good folks, reasonable, not bullies). Some asshole that blows $10k for some small ego satisfaction measured in a few faster seconds perhaps feels superior in his mind, but doe not realize how little he really matters to the world...

Looking at the XT225 thread just now, I do not see so much of the KTM blowhard punks (not to be confused with fine citizens who ride excellent KTM motorcycles) inserting themselves. Perhaps it is just an attack-Honda thing? There is a posting there of a guy stating that he likes riding steep ground and does it better up and down on his TW200, and it does it better than his 525EXC! ANd I did not notice these punks hanging around dissing Honda going after that...


If someone wants to ride a TW200 across the northern tier or around the world, or a scooter, KLR650, whatever their choice, and they like it and talk about it, great.

I agree with many that I would like to see a dualsport Honda 300cc to 500 cc at around 270lbs, a motorcycle that one can ride trail terrain on.

That one about made me made spit my Coke on the monitor. Who could ask for more than 30 hp wrapped in a 335 pound package featuring flexible forks, a screen door shock and wooden brakes. Too bad they dropped the 23" front wheel in '82. That was a truly unique feature.