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Old 12-17-2012, 01:09 PM   #71941
NordieBoy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DockingPilot View Post
Yea, your cheap Its frickin $12. Why hack up the stock one. Not even worth the time involved.
+ shipping...
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Old 12-17-2012, 01:10 PM   #71942
procycle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VooDooDaddy View Post
How is it the GSXR can doesn't breath as well? I mean the 600/750 can from the factory is bolted to an engine putting out 110/130 RWHP?? And the 1000 can is bolted to an engine making what,...150 RWHP?? And a DR650 makes what,...35ish RWHP?

I'm not saying you are wrong, but my limited internal logic cannot compute your statement; and other than what I've just written above, I have no data to support or refute your statement. Just asking for more info on this?
The dyno says so. The dyno also says the GSXR can requires a smaller main jet for the best peak horsepower.
The GSXR 1000 makes 250cc exhaust pulses that are individually blasted out the exhaust. The DR650 makes much larger individual exhaust pulses that have to escape. The total horsepower has a lot less to to with breathing than the size of the individual bang that has to find its way out.

There's no doubt that the GSXR can breathes better than the stock DR muffler but it's really only about 60% of the improvement that can be had with a good aftermarket muffler.

And of course, the GSXR1000 can gain more than 10 HP by installing a better flowing exhaust. It's choked up by the stock exhaust just like the DR is. That's one reason why there used to be so many good take-off mufflers around.
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Old 12-17-2012, 01:11 PM   #71943
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VooDooDaddy View Post
How is it the GSXR can doesn't breath as well? I mean the 600/750 can from the factory is bolted to an engine putting out 110/130 RWHP?? And the 1000 can is bolted to an engine making what,...150 RWHP?? And a DR650 makes what,...35ish RWHP?

I'm not saying you are wrong, but my limited internal logic cannot compute your statement; and other than what I've just written above, I have no data to support or refute your statement. Just asking for more info on this?
As ProCycle says, 644cc pulses vs 250cc pulses...
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Old 12-17-2012, 01:23 PM   #71944
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that larger main jet also means lower mpg which some might not want to loose. if you're a mid-ranging kinda rider it's gonna work. if you're a max kinda rider get the FMF. if you don't want to repack then the GSXR/Busa pipe is ideal, if you have no problem repacking a muffler then the FMF is your muffler. the sound levels are lower on the oem GSXR/Busa muffler (they need to be 80db per law when bolted to the original bike) vrs more sound on the FMF and i've heard even more sound on the DG. sound level is a factor for some.

anything is better than stock, it's just what are your intentions and exceptions on choosing the right pipe for you.
I know you get this, i'm just writing this for others to read.



Quote:
Originally Posted by procycle View Post
The dyno says so. The dyno also says the GSXR can requires a smaller main jet for the best peak horsepower.
The GSXR 1000 makes 250cc exhaust pulses that are individually blasted out the exhaust. The DR650 makes much larger individual exhaust pulses that have to escape. The total horsepower has a lot less to to with breathing than the size of the individual bang that has to find its way out.

There's no doubt that the GSXR can breathes better than the stock DR muffler but it's really only about 60% of the improvement that can be had with a good aftermarket muffler.

And of course, the GSXR1000 can gain more than 10 HP by installing a better flowing exhaust. It's choked up by the stock exhaust just like the DR is. That's one reason why there used to be so many good take-off mufflers around.
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eakins screwed with this post 12-17-2012 at 01:39 PM
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Old 12-17-2012, 01:32 PM   #71945
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Quote:
Originally Posted by procycle View Post
The dyno says so. The dyno also says the GSXR can requires a smaller main jet for the best peak horsepower.
The GSXR 1000 makes 250cc exhaust pulses that are individually blasted out the exhaust. The DR650 makes much larger individual exhaust pulses that have to escape. The total horsepower has a lot less to to with breathing than the size of the individual bang that has to find its way out.

There's no doubt that the GSXR can breathes better than the stock DR muffler but it's really only about 60% of the improvement that can be had with a good aftermarket muffler.

And of course, the GSXR1000 can gain more than 10 HP by installing a better flowing exhaust. It's choked up by the stock exhaust just like the DR is. That's one reason why there used to be so many good take-off mufflers around.
i'm curious about the exhaust pulses than move through the muffler.
have you ever cut open a stock muffler and measured the openings?
if the GSXR muffler is optimized for 250cc pulses (a 1000cc 4 stroke motor so 1 cyl 250cc pulse at a time so everyone can visualize that) YET it performs better than the stock muffler, what does the stock muffler pulse flow at?

150cc? less, more?

so then using this anology, the Hayabusa muffler is from a 1300cc bike with 2 mufflers. each pipe sees 650cc of the engine (being pushed by 2 cyl) so it flows at approx 325cc pulses (this does not acct for cross over pipes in the header which spreads this pulse flow out) . no wonder people who have used that muffler say it performs better than the GSXR muffler. have you dyno'd the Busa pipe to compare?
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eakins screwed with this post 12-17-2012 at 01:43 PM
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Old 12-17-2012, 01:34 PM   #71946
dljocky
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I just used the stock retaining ring when I threw my 14T CS on. No biggie, after a mile the chain "trimmed" the retaining ring. I was afraid that the chain might be damaged but it wasn't. I got 22K miles out of that chain. Hope this helps.


Quote:
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Instead of buying the smaller triangular front sprocket retainer to fit with 14t sprockets, can't you just cut the stock one down? Does anyone get what I'm saying here.
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Old 12-17-2012, 01:38 PM   #71947
MikeyP
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Quote:
Originally Posted by procycle View Post
If LexTalionis is amenable to cutting the top of his airbox and upgrading the exhaust I'm still on board for this.

I'd much rather see the test bike have a DG or FMF muffler. My own testing says the GSXR can doesn't breathe quite as well as an aftermarket performance muffler.

I'm not sure what tests you'd like to run, but I'll offer up my bike in the name of science. I live only a short drive away in SF and I have ~16K miles on the odo, GSXR exhaust, Kientech midpipe, stock header pipe with ground weld, open top air box with K&N filter (also have the stock filter on hand), relatively fresh spark plugs, fuel filter, DJ kit, and only ~1500 miles on the slides in the carb. I bought those from you just a few months ago Derek at the same time I did a complete carb rebuild. I also have on hand an mx_rob FCR that I've been trying to find time to install. I could bring that along or come back after I install it to see what numbers change if that interests you.

The only downside is that I won't be able to help for a couple weeks because of the holidays, but as soon as 2013 gets started I'm available.
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Old 12-17-2012, 01:45 PM   #71948
BergDonk
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Originally Posted by NordieBoy View Post
Or to the Paioli forks on 1993 Gilera Nordwests...

Spring one side, damping in t'other.
Yep, the Paolis in my 2008 Scorpa trials bike are SFF too which I neglected to mention earlier
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Old 12-17-2012, 01:55 PM   #71949
procycle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eakins View Post
i'm curious about the exhaust pulses than move through the muffler.
have you ever cut open a stock muffler and measured the openings?
if the GSXR muffler is optimized for 250cc pulses (a 1000cc 4 stroke motor so 1 cyl 250cc pulse at a time so everyone can visualize that) YET it performs better than the stock muffler what the stock muffler pulse flow at?

150cc? less, more?

so then using this anology then Hayabusa muffler is from a 1300cc bike with 2 mufflers so each pipe sees 650cc of engine and 2 cyl of engine pumping so it flows at 325cc pulses. no wonder people who have used that muffler say it performs better than the GSXR muffler. have you dyno'd the Busa pipe to compare?
Well obviously Suzuki spent a lot more engineering time on the GSXR exhaust system because bike sales in that market live or die by horsepower numbers and quarter mile times. There's no incentive for Suzuki to optimize the DR muffler for performance.

All factory mufflers have to meet 80dB sound levels on the original bike. It's easier to muffle a smaller bang than a big one so the GSXR cans can be a little freer flowing and still meet sound requirements.

I haven't done any cutting and comparing. I don't know what good that information would do me but if anyone wants to send me their $200 GSXR muffler I'll be glad to run it through the bandsaw to see what makes it tick.

Maybe a Busa muffler flows better but then again the bigger bangs from the Busa motor will take more muffling to meet sound requirements. The only way to know would be to do back to back dyno testing.
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Old 12-17-2012, 02:33 PM   #71950
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Thought i better show that mudguard since the Yanks lack choice in motorcycles!
Hey Mate, shouldn't you be across the border by now? Are you going to talk your so called "adventure" to death ... or go riding? You've been around here for at least two years (on HU too) putting down the DR650 and have never got out of AZ yet. ?Tiene miedo? ?Que pasa pendejo?

Yea, we don't get that overweight and poking Yamaha ... but for SM racing the WR450 is a popular choice here ... and all the below are for sale here too: Husky, Husaberg, Aprilia, KTM ... plus the various Japanese SM bikes.
No 660 Yamaha.
Choices? You must be joking!







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Old 12-17-2012, 03:55 PM   #71951
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eakins View Post
so then using this anology, the Hayabusa muffler is from a 1300cc bike with 2 mufflers. each pipe sees 650cc of the engine (being pushed by 2 cyl) so it flows at approx 325cc pulses (this does not acct for cross over pipes in the header which spreads this pulse flow out) . no wonder people who have used that muffler say it performs better than the GSXR muffler. have you dyno'd the Busa pipe to compare?
The Busa exhaust system looks like it goes from 4-2-1-2 meaning that there is sort of a collector for all 4 pistons. So, if that's right, the math is 1300cc / 4 cyl = 325cc pulses, and 325cc pulses / 2 mufflers = 162.5cc pulses. If the Busa muffler actually performs better, it is not because it is made to handle larger individual pulses.
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Old 12-17-2012, 04:07 PM   #71952
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Wow

Thanks guys, grinded it down and bolted it up. I need your advice again. Last summer i had the shop do some engine work and while they were at it they were supposed to put in the oil filter i had them order. Well i got it back and 3k miles later i go to change the oil and theres no damn filter in there! I got a magnetic plug and a filter in there now, and i was thinking of running it a couple hundred miles or so and draining it again. What do you think.?
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Old 12-17-2012, 04:24 PM   #71953
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That'd be my call. I'd also get an admission from the shop that did the work that they forgot your filter.

I just did NSU screws on a new DR (200 miles) and changed the oil for the owner. Little bits of manufacturing stuff in there. For those keeping track, the NSU screws were the tightest I've dealt with and may have been fine forever. They still got loctite and star washer since we were in there.

I like the grey color.
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Old 12-17-2012, 04:34 PM   #71954
Cobain
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The manager rebuilt my forks and changed a tube and tire free because they screwed up. The bike was 2 months past due in the shop and they charged me more than they promised. I will NOT be going back to that shop.
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Old 12-17-2012, 04:37 PM   #71955
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Originally Posted by TrophyHunter View Post
That'd be my call. I'd also get an admission from the shop that did the work that they forgot your filter.

I just did NSU screws on a new DR (200 miles) and changed the oil for the owner. Little bits of manufacturing stuff in there. For those keeping track, the NSU screws were the tightest I've dealt with and may have been fine forever. They still got loctite and star washer since we were in there.

I like the grey color.
Agreed.

Re the NSU screws, the issue is that with numerous heating and cooling cycles the plastic shrinks a poofteenth and then the tension goes off the screws. A new bike should be tight.
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