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Old 01-08-2013, 03:17 PM   #72631
Adv Grifter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dljocky View Post
Sorry for jumping in on what i guess I should know, but I haven't heard the stories of the Shinko's coming apart. Is this common? I've probably got over 25K miles from several 705's on the rear of my DR with no problems. Were there any recalls or anything?

Thanks
I think if you search around on the GSpot forum you may find Shinko stories ... every BMW guy on there now hate Shinko and really believe they are junk.
This is good ... keeps the price down for those of us who know better.

A few did come apart on loaded R1200GS's and the like. I don't believe the tire is rated to hold up under a 700 lbs. R1200GS ADV fully loaded with 100 lbs. of luggage, two up, doing 100 mph in 95F heat for hours and hours.

I'm on my 3rd 705 Shinko now and no such issues. But many OEM's have had bad batches of tires. Metzeler certainly did and so has Avon. Avon gave away LOTS of free tires when the Distanzia first came out ... I was the recipient of one. Metzeler? Not so much! (and one reason I still support Avon today)

Shinko are made in Korea by Yokohama. So these dudes are not new at this. If you ever have a problem with a tire ... go to a dealer. Any dealer. Most times you'll get a new tire out of it if what you have is truly a fault.

That said, our lightweight DR is far easier on tires (and everything really) than a GS, Tenere' or KTM 990. But were 150 lbs. to 200 lbs. lighter, makes sense, right?
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Old 01-08-2013, 03:26 PM   #72632
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Adv Grifter View Post
A few did come apart on loaded R1200GS's and the like.
Yes, the early 705s had problems dealing with heavy bikes and high speeds. The tires in the problem sizes have been redesigned and carry different part numbers (and higher prices). The update happened about 2 years ago. Since then Shinkos have been getting rave reviews.
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Old 01-08-2013, 03:31 PM   #72633
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Adv Grifter View Post
I think if you search around on the GSpot forum you may find Shinko stories ... every BMW guy on there now hate Shinko and really believe they are junk.
This is good ... keeps the price down for those of us who know better.

A few did come apart on loaded R1200GS's and the like. I don't believe the tire is rated to hold up under a 700 lbs. R1200GS ADV fully loaded with 100 lbs. of luggage, two up, doing 100 mph in 95F heat for hours and hours.

I'm on my 3rd 705 Shinko now and no such issues. But many OEM's have had bad batches of tires. Metzeler certainly did and so has Avon. Avon gave away LOTS of free tires when the Distanzia first came out ... I was the recipient of one. Metzeler? Not so much! (and one reason I still support Avon today)

Shinko are made in Korea by Yokohama. So these dudes are not new at this. If you ever have a problem with a tire ... go to a dealer. Any dealer. Most times you'll get a new tire out of it if what you have is truly a fault.

That said, our lightweight DR is far easier on tires (and everything really) than a GS, Tenere' or KTM 990. But were 150 lbs. to 200 lbs. lighter, makes sense, right?
Well stated for dljocky.

Yeah, it's an armchair quarterback, hindsight is 20/20 kinda thing, but the build of 705's maens large areas (the knobs) that won't flex much, and the in-between areas (the sipes) that have to do all the flexing. Now it just makes sense to not allow the flexes to be in that great of a range or it's like working a specific piece of sheet steel back and forth a ton until it heats up and tears/snaps. The sipes can flex enough for the life of a tire if limited to the range they have to flex, and if kept cool enough. Lower pressures on 705's are probably just fine if you find yourself stuck, or about to be stuck, and need sure-traction to get out of where you're at... but don't then run it hard, or fast, or much at all on the highways home with that super-low pressure once you get out of being stuck.

--------

shu, most manufacturers may recommend that for two-up, or because on some bikes more of the rider's weight and load weight goes over the rear?

Anyway, I come from the bicycle world where the taller and skinnier the tire, the higher pressure it gets. Mountain bike tires are typically used from 17 to 35 psi (lower for traction), beach cruiser tires at about 45 to 55, and road bike tires from 90 to 110 psi (fatter tires gets lower pressures for the same sized wheel / rim, but the lightest and skinniest of tires get the most pressure).

With that tall narrow 21" up front, and with all the braking that happens up there, I'm a fan of just a tad more in the front if I were to choose for this bike. But right now I'd bet they're about even.

Mambo Dave screwed with this post 01-08-2013 at 03:39 PM
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Old 01-08-2013, 05:01 PM   #72634
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Adv Grifter View Post
I asked Mark Salvisburg and the boys ... they suggested a smaller Pilot (leaner). I did this and problem went away. Bike ran well everywhere else.
Go figure. Turns out the Pilot that was in the CARB was oversize, not stock. Went to stock Pilot Jet, all good. Wonders never cease.
I suppose I should have qualified my statement with, "if the stock pilot jet is installed"...

I am curious though, did you try to adjust the idle mixture via the fuel screw and find it was closed or close to it when adjusted properly before asking Marc for advice?

Regards,

Derek
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Old 01-08-2013, 06:16 PM   #72635
Carl Childers
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Question Rear Shock Questions.

I'm done with the front forks and now I'm eyeing up the rear shock and wondering how many of you out there have simply replaced the stock spring and changed the oil weight and said "hey this works great it's all I need"?

If I wen't back in later because I didn't like the performance would I still be able to use the same replacement spring with the valving upgrade? I don't mind several tries at the shock as long as I'm not throwing away $$ on the spring that I couldn't use in round two.
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Old 01-08-2013, 06:25 PM   #72636
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Shinko 705s!

Yea, I'm one of the GS1200 guys that blew the tread right off my rear Shinko. First ones out stated 33psi max on the bias tire side wall. So thats what I ran. Have to admit I did hit 200kph a couple of times on our well maintained gravel roads though. Think if I would have run 38psi they would have held up. Heat must have got to them. Shinko 705s do tent to howl after they get worn a little though. I'm sure on a 35hp DR you won't have any problems.
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Old 01-08-2013, 06:59 PM   #72637
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I run Shinko's and I agree that the main difference between the DR riders and the GS riders is we tend to go slower with less weight. Either one will make a huge difference in the tires life combining the 2 makes for an extended life. Before i get jumped on by the nay sayers how many times has a DR really been run flat out on a highway the same way a GS has been with or without saddle bags and top box?.
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Old 01-08-2013, 07:09 PM   #72638
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PPCLI-Jim View Post
I run Shinko's and I agree that the main difference between the DR riders and the GS riders is we tend to go slower with less weight. Either one will make a huge difference in the tires life combining the 2 makes for an extended life. Before i get jumped on by the nay sayers how many times has a DR really been run flat out on a highway the same way a GS has been with or without saddle bags and top box?.
Probably put 4,000 or more miles of 75 to 90 MPH (true, not indicated) on my DR650 and the Shinko 705's I have on there now before I resigned from the job that required that commute.

I have a 705 on the rear of my home-built adventure bike (Ninja 500) and that's been to 100 MPH a few times, and did the +1000 trips of highway miles (mostly, with some dirt) just fine.

Now that's not 100 MPH, but I don't think I've ever seen a GS tooling along at 100... ever... either.
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Old 01-08-2013, 07:45 PM   #72639
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Originally Posted by Mambo Dave View Post
my home-built adventure bike (Ninja 500)
OK, you can't mention that without being ready to throw out some pix...
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Old 01-08-2013, 07:59 PM   #72640
Adv Grifter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by motolab View Post
I suppose I should have qualified my statement with, "if the stock pilot jet is installed"...

I am curious though, did you try to adjust the idle mixture via the fuel screw and find it was closed or close to it when adjusted properly before asking Marc for advice?

Regards,

Derek
This was a friends bike. But yes, he had an extended fuel screw. I adjusted it IN until it stumbled, then out a half turn ... it was set about one turn out. But the rich stumble with choke on persisted and would start with NO choke when stone cold. Once Pilot jet was changed back to stock I went a tiny bit richer on the fuel screw and all was well.
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Old 01-08-2013, 08:01 PM   #72641
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dljocky View Post
Sorry for jumping in on what i guess I should know, but I haven't heard the stories of the Shinko's coming apart. Is this common? I've probably got over 25K miles from several 705's on the rear of my DR with no problems. Were there any recalls or anything?

Thanks
Love my 705's on the DR and the TT350.
The sizes we use are rated to higher speeds than the big bike ones.

Off road, I run 20f/18r.

Yet to find a situation they haven't got me through yet.
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Old 01-08-2013, 08:15 PM   #72642
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Adv Grifter View Post
This was a friends bike. But yes, he had an extended fuel screw. I adjusted it IN until it stumbled, then out a half turn ... it was set about one turn out. But the rich stumble with choke on persisted and would start with NO choke when stone cold. Once Pilot jet was changed back to stock I went a tiny bit richer on the fuel screw and all was well.
+1
It's well documented on the various DR650 forums that a pilot jet larger than stock will cause a rich stumble.
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Old 01-08-2013, 08:15 PM   #72643
Adv Grifter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carl Childers View Post
I'm done with the front forks and now I'm eyeing up the rear shock and wondering how many of you out there have simply replaced the stock spring and changed the oil weight and said "hey this works great it's all I need"?

If I wen't back in later because I didn't like the performance would I still be able to use the same replacement spring with the valving upgrade? I don't mind several tries at the shock as long as I'm not throwing away $$ on the spring that I couldn't use in round two.
Go for it. Even if you decide you want to buy a whole new shock ... you won't have any trouble selling off that Eibach spring if you no longer need it.

If you go with a re-valve the spring will most definitely be put to use unless you are the ideal weight for the stock spring. (130 to 160 lbs.)

I bought an Eibach spring and put it on the stock shock with no other changes. Like putting lipstick on a pig. Well, not that bad .... it did help but the lack of rebound damping was clear along with a certain lack of sophistication in the ride. Not ideal.

If you know shocks you can bust into that stock KYB and re-do the shim stack, get better pistons and you'll be better off. My shock knowledge is limited so I just got hold of an Ohlins.

Lots of ways to go here ... but unless you really can do shocks I'd let a pro set it up or buy aftermarket. Really DOES make a difference over all with the DR650 and will match the goodness of your forks.

Contact this guy for inexpensive rebuilds of stock shock:
http://www.manta.com/c/mmlpmhr/hlebo...ing-suspension

If you use John Hlebo, send the spring you want to use with the shock.
Magic! Be sure to tell him your weight, riding level and style and terrain ridden, bike and bike weight. A true Mom and Pop shop ... very reasonable prices.

He deals with Pros so don't tell him your "FAST" unless you are a Pro level rider.
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Old 01-08-2013, 08:16 PM   #72644
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Adv Grifter View Post
This was a friends bike. But yes, he had an extended fuel screw. I adjusted it IN until it stumbled, then out a half turn ... it was set about one turn out. But the rich stumble with choke on persisted and would start with NO choke when stone cold. Once Pilot jet was changed back to stock I went a tiny bit richer on the fuel screw and all was well.
The screw having to be in that far should definitely be interpreted as the pilot jet being too large. When it's quite a bit too large, and the screw is far in as a result, the adjustment becomes overly sensitive as well (i.e. a small adjustment makes a large difference in terms of percentage change in area exposed), meaning that 1/2 turn out from a lean stumble could very well have been too much.

Regards,

Derek
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Old 01-08-2013, 08:18 PM   #72645
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dljocky View Post
Sorry for jumping in on what i guess I should know, but I haven't heard the stories of the Shinko's coming apart. Is this common? I've probably got over 25K miles from several 705's on the rear of my DR with no problems. Were there any recalls or anything?

Thanks
Wait...you got 25k out of a single set of 705's, or you've put a total of 25k on 705's over the course of several tires? I've had the 705's on mine for probably 3000-4000 miles of almost all highway and in town commuting, and the rear tire is definitely starting to square off.

Then again, I'm a pudgy kid.
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