ADVrider

Go Back   ADVrider > Bikes > Thumpers
User Name
Password
Register Inmates Photos Site Rules Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 02-20-2013, 07:29 AM   #73921
eakins
Butler Maps
 
eakins's Avatar
 
Joined: May 2002
Location: Fort Collins, Colorado
Oddometer: 17,236
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob.G View Post
A lot of people strip those screws... they're actually not philips. They're a Japanese "standard" (I forget the exact term)... but if you look closely, they aren't tapered like a true philips.. the slots go all the way down completely. There's a special tool you can get to remove them, but it sounds like you already solved the problem. :)

Rob
JIS screwdrivers - http://www.webbikeworld.com/motorcyc...-screwdrivers/
http://www.amazon.com/Hozan-JIS-4-JI.../dp/B005NIY3PM

the special tool for most is using a hand-hammer impact tool.
http://www.harborfreight.com/impact-...ase-37530.html
http://www.sears.com/craftsman-impac...p-00947641000P
i've used a dremel tool in the past with a thin cutoff wheel and made a slot for a flathead screwdriver to work.

later found out the trick, if you only have Philips screwdrivers, is to use the next size smaller one (so it gets the tip down in deeper in the JIS screw) and tap it from the top with a hammer. this helps drive the tool head deeper into the screw and also shocks the screw some to loosen it. if the screw is somewhat buggered up, from previous attempts, tapping the screwdriver in harder can work. often the steel screw, alum. cap & brake res. main body somewhat fuse together if the fluid has never been serviced.

here is a way to modify Philips bits/screwdrivers to fit better in JIS:
http://www.kzrider.com/forum/21-tool...rewdriver-tips

when dealing with the JIS screws on the floatbowl, the same technique can be used but often those hand-hammered tools is key. that is 1 essential tool that every home mechanic should have! once you have those screws out replace with allen bolts from PC, Jesse or the hardware store.
__________________
Butler Maps - motorcycle maps for riders by riders -
Alaska
AZ map COBDR AZBDR IDBDR South East map
http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=598717
Cycle World Adventure Rally:
http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=956350

eakins screwed with this post 02-20-2013 at 07:59 AM
eakins is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2013, 07:44 AM   #73922
blackcap
Studly Adventurer
 
blackcap's Avatar
 
Joined: Jul 2008
Location: Wollongong aka stink-town, Australia
Oddometer: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob.G View Post
A lot of people strip those screws... they're actually not philips. They're a Japanese "standard" (I forget the exact term)... but if you look closely, they aren't tapered like a true philips.. the slots go all the way down completely. There's a special tool you can get to remove them, but it sounds like you already solved the problem. :)

Rob
wow i didnt realise there were metric and imperial screwdrivers. the jis is pretty standard in australia. you can buy them in sizes 1, 2 and 3 and i carry one of each as those small removable bits that go into T handles. having the right size screwdriver for the screw will make all the difference in the world.
__________________
"One must die sometime and to die with ones boots on is very noble" - Carl Stearns Clancy, first RTW motorcycle, 1912-13

Australia to Iceland on a DR650 http://oztoice.wordpress.com
blackcap is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2013, 07:50 AM   #73923
eakins
Butler Maps
 
eakins's Avatar
 
Joined: May 2002
Location: Fort Collins, Colorado
Oddometer: 17,236
Quote:
Originally Posted by blackcap View Post
wow i didnt realise there were metric and imperial screwdrivers. the jis is pretty standard in australia. you can buy them in sizes 1, 2 and 3 and i carry one of each as those small removable bits that go into T handles. having the right size screwdriver for the screw will make all the difference in the world.
oh the US likes to go it's own way vrs most of the rest of the world. same crap with metric vrs sae bolts.
metric bolt numbering is so much more logical vrs sae.
seems many of the US cars have gone with metric bolts but the building industry is firmly entrenched in the US standard of measuring length.
__________________
Butler Maps - motorcycle maps for riders by riders -
Alaska
AZ map COBDR AZBDR IDBDR South East map
http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=598717
Cycle World Adventure Rally:
http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=956350
eakins is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2013, 07:50 AM   #73924
isaac004
Studly Adventurer
 
isaac004's Avatar
 
Joined: Sep 2007
Location: Los Angeles
Oddometer: 676
Quote:
Originally Posted by isaac004
So yesterday I got around to making the modification described above. After draining some oil and pulling the spring out, I had to compress the fork while it was upside down in a oil pan, and slowly compress the fork to get the Intiminators out. Well not once but TWICE did I end up spraying oil all over the floor as it shot down with force into the oil pan. I should have built a little cardboard wall/fort around the pan so I did not have to spent half a hour wiping off of everything.



I removed about 1mm from each oil ring, and as I put everything back together it was MUCH easier to slide the Intiminators back in the forks. Now I had hopes. After finishing off the re-assembly with Maxima 5wt oil, I bolted everything back together. Time for the moment of truth...

..and no dice. It feels and sounds exactly the same as before.

Not sure what to do at this point. Might be a good time to upgrade to Gold Valves for slightly better off road performance!
Quote:
Originally Posted by isaac004 View Post
OK, another update here.

I was trying to avoid just straight up removing them, but I figured it was worth a shot. So today I had a free hour and decided to pull out the Intiminators to see how the fork action is. I did not bother to add more oil (as the oil height dropped), add preload (to keep the same preload I should add around 3/4" extra in PVC pipe, or bump the oil viscosity up (with the Intiminators removed I should go back up to around 10 wt, as Ricor recommended a lower 5 wt). I will do these things later.

The fork action has pretty much returned to normal, in regards to no more excessive binding, easier to compress, and it rebounds back to normal ride height without me having to "pull" it up. There is still a slight amount of stiction, more then my F800GS or WR250R, but hey, it's a low tech DS bike without nice USD forks, so it feels pretty damn good now for what it is.

It looks like the bottom edge could have been scrapping the inside of the fork tubes a bit too much.


For now I will just return to a higher viscosity oil and leave the Intiminators out, more or less a stock fork setup.
Ok, an update here on this issue which I posted about on post 70057 around Oct 2012. I sent the Intiminators back to Ricor, as they said they wanted to have a look at them. They opted to rebuild them, part of which involved replacing the oil ring which confirms that it was probably an older version which swelled when soaked in oil.

I reinstalled the Intiminators and have since taken the bike out on some commuting rides, and they are much better. You feel the stiffness of the anti dive, but there is no binding, and the fork always returns to regular ride height (unlike before where it would stick.

So all is good now!
isaac004 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2013, 08:04 AM   #73925
eakins
Butler Maps
 
eakins's Avatar
 
Joined: May 2002
Location: Fort Collins, Colorado
Oddometer: 17,236
Quote:
Originally Posted by isaac004 View Post
Ok, an update here on this issue which I posted about on post 70057 around Oct 2012. I sent the Intiminators back to Ricor, as they said they wanted to have a look at them. They opted to rebuild them, part of which involved replacing the oil ring which confirms that it was probably an older version which swelled when soaked in oil.

I reinstalled the Intiminators and have since taken the bike out on some commuting rides, and they are much better. You feel the stiffness of the anti dive, but there is no binding, and the fork always returns to regular ride height (unlike before where it would stick.

So all is good now!
thanks for the update!
i have some of the original ones so i might look into that too:
http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=468588
__________________
Butler Maps - motorcycle maps for riders by riders -
Alaska
AZ map COBDR AZBDR IDBDR South East map
http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=598717
Cycle World Adventure Rally:
http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=956350
eakins is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2013, 08:46 AM   #73926
poppawheelie
Gnarly Adventurer
 
poppawheelie's Avatar
 
Joined: Jul 2003
Location: Central Pennsylvania
Oddometer: 495
Quote:
Originally Posted by eakins View Post
JIS screwdrivers - http://www.webbikeworld.com/motorcyc...-screwdrivers/
http://www.amazon.com/Hozan-JIS-4-JI.../dp/B005NIY3PM

the special tool for most is using a hand-hammer impact tool.
http://www.harborfreight.com/impact-...ase-37530.html
http://www.sears.com/craftsman-impac...p-00947641000P
i've used a dremel tool in the past with a thin cutoff wheel and made a slot for a flathead screwdriver to work.

later found out the trick, if you only have Philips screwdrivers, is to use the next size smaller one (so it gets the tip down in deeper in the JIS screw) and tap it from the top with a hammer. this helps drive the tool head deeper into the screw and also shocks the screw some to loosen it. if the screw is somewhat buggered up, from previous attempts, tapping the screwdriver in harder can work. often the steel screw, alum. cap & brake res. main body somewhat fuse together if the fluid has never been serviced.

here is a way to modify Philips bits/screwdrivers to fit better in JIS:
http://www.kzrider.com/forum/21-tool...rewdriver-tips

when dealing with the JIS screws on the floatbowl, the same technique can be used but often those hand-hammered tools is key. that is 1 essential tool that every home mechanic should have! once you have those screws out replace with allen bolts from PC, Jesse or the hardware store.
Yeah, for the um-teenth time, an $8 ~ $10 impact driver is all you need. 45 years of cracking open Japanese float bowls and old side cases held by X-head screws, and I never stripped one!
__________________
"To me the trail is calling! The old trail - the trail that is always new." Matthew Alexander Henson

"It's not the destination. It's the journey." Me
poppawheelie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2013, 08:48 AM   #73927
Albie
Kool Aid poisoner
 
Albie's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2004
Location: Upstate SC
Oddometer: 8,453
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob.G View Post
A lot of people strip those screws... they're actually not philips. They're a Japanese "standard" (I forget the exact term)... but if you look closely, they aren't tapered like a true philips.. the slots go all the way down completely. There's a special tool you can get to remove them, but it sounds like you already solved the problem. :)

Rob
JIS. Easy to find JIS drivers online.
__________________
Good. Bad. I'm the guy with the gun.

Another day, another foot injury!
Albie is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2013, 08:58 AM   #73928
blackcap
Studly Adventurer
 
blackcap's Avatar
 
Joined: Jul 2008
Location: Wollongong aka stink-town, Australia
Oddometer: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by eakins View Post
oh the US likes to go it's own way vrs most of the rest of the world. same crap with metric vrs sae bolts.
metric bolt numbering is so much more logical vrs sae.
seems many of the US cars have gone with metric bolts but the building industry is firmly entrenched in the US standard of measuring length.
the good news is that if you guys ever do convert, youll have a couple of hundred years of having to know both measurements and the conversion rates. pressure is even better with psi, bar and kpa to confuse you even more.
__________________
"One must die sometime and to die with ones boots on is very noble" - Carl Stearns Clancy, first RTW motorcycle, 1912-13

Australia to Iceland on a DR650 http://oztoice.wordpress.com
blackcap is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2013, 10:03 AM   #73929
TrophyHunter
Beastly Adventurer
 
Joined: Aug 2009
Location: San Diego
Oddometer: 1,839
Quote:
Originally Posted by poppawheelie View Post
Yeah, for the um-teenth time, an $8 ~ $10 impact driver is all you need. 45 years of cracking open Japanese float bowls and old side cases held by X-head screws, and I never stripped one!
+1 Used my cheapo HF one on my wifes quad over the weekend....float bowl screws. Works like a champ.
__________________
www.dualsportmoto.com
2005 DR650 2003 DRZ-250
2013 HD Road King

"It's a small amount of gas, but it represents a long walk" My Dad...
TrophyHunter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2013, 10:07 AM   #73930
eakins
Butler Maps
 
eakins's Avatar
 
Joined: May 2002
Location: Fort Collins, Colorado
Oddometer: 17,236
Quote:
Originally Posted by TrophyHunter View Post
+1 Used my cheapo HF one on my wifes quad over the weekend....float bowl screws. Works like a champ.
I didn't find it the first time I searched. For $5 why not?
http://www.harborfreight.com/7-piece...set-93481.html
this is the light duty one and actually better than the heavier duty one I posted above.
__________________
Butler Maps - motorcycle maps for riders by riders -
Alaska
AZ map COBDR AZBDR IDBDR South East map
http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=598717
Cycle World Adventure Rally:
http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=956350
eakins is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2013, 12:04 PM   #73931
wizdum
Adventurer
 
wizdum's Avatar
 
Joined: Apr 2011
Location: north of Pittsburgh
Oddometer: 28
I also just put on a stainless rear brake line.

While I was at it, I noticed how sloppy the clevis/pin area was.
I drilled the clevis and pedal hole to the next larger size (standard 3/8") and put it a new pin.


Much less slop. There is still minor play in the pedal axis...but, I see nothing to do about that.
__________________
2005 DR650>>>1978 SP370>>>2006 KX450F >>>1989 KX500>>>1987 Husky CR430>>>1981 Husky CR430>>>1982 KX250>>>1977 KE175B3>>>1975 Suzuki TS 75 Colt>>>1974 Kawasaki 90>>>197? Honda MR50>>>19?? Indian Mini Mini
wizdum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2013, 01:59 PM   #73932
FlowBee
Just me.
 
FlowBee's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2004
Location: Stasis.
Oddometer: 5,740
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tex76 View Post
Hey guys, my DR is having a hard time cranking when its cold. 5 or 6 times of holding down the starter for 2-3 seconds before it turns over. Time for a new battery or will a few days on a tender fix this? Its happening every cold morning.
By " ..down the starter for 2-3 seconds before it turns over." do you mean the time before the starter starts turning the engine, or the cranking time before the engine catches and begins firing on it's own?

If it's the latter, it could be that your pilot jets are beginning to clog up with varnish/sludge during storage. This would make your bike run leaner and leaner until the bike no longer starts without extreme choking and playing with the throttle. Today's gas is garbage, full of bunny-hugger ethanol (courtesy of ADM and Cargill) which causes it to separate and decompose into varnish and slime much more quickly than even 15 years ago. This crap slimes up your carb and causes hard starting within even a month or two of storage. The fix is to use lots of Stabil and frequent runs around the block, or a carb teardown and cleaning or replacement of the pilot jet. PITA either way. I use a little extra Stabil, run the bike whenever I can in the winter, and then when it warms up in the spring I add Techron to the last gallon and run the %$@& out of the bike before filling it up and changing the oil for summer use.

About a decade ago my wife had a Suzuki GSF400 Bandit. It was a 400 4-cylinder bike from the early 90s. Ran like a scalded cat above 6K rpms, but would sludge up the pilot circuits if not started every 4 weeks due to Chicago's EPA ethanol gas. I got really adept at pulling all four of those carbs and cleaning out the pilot circuits. 4x. PITA !

My bike has a TM40 carb kit conversion and it jetted to be hard to start without a couple of pumps and full choke when the temps are below 40F. Sometimes in the winter I have to start it a couple of times and play with the throttle a little. Once the bike is warmed up I can release the choke and the bike runs perfectly fine with a decent MPG and no watering eyes from a rich mixture. No surging at all.

Good luck,

FB
__________________
"And then this one time at banned camp ....."
FlowBee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2013, 04:00 PM   #73933
eakins
Butler Maps
 
eakins's Avatar
 
Joined: May 2002
Location: Fort Collins, Colorado
Oddometer: 17,236
I put Lucas fuel treatment http://www.lucasoil.com/products/dis...catid=2&iid=26 in everything I own, every fill up.

It's not a crap petroleum distillate, but rather a oil based (pours out like oil) product with additional cleaners. Fuel (since it is oil after all) use to offer lubrication properties to the fuel pump (if FI), carb/FI. Today's gas is mfg. so dry and even worse has ethanol in it. This product return that lubrication property, plus cleans the fuel system & valves.

I've parked my DR filled with gas & Lucas for up to 3 months at a time and the fuel has not issues as it also works as a stabilizer too. I've been using it for over 10yrs now with great success. I have a small bottle for fill ups and buy it in the gallon containers to save $. Costs maybe .25c, if that, per fill up.

I first found out about when touring on my old CB750. It was air-cooled and carbed (sound familiar?) and jetted lean for high elevations (Colorado). When i took a tour down to the coast and sea level, it run like crap, was real hot and pinged. I know it was way to lean, but no way I was going to rejet.

Went to a parts store and they said try Lucas as it will reduce friction in your lean mixture and help it run better/cooler. Bought a small bottle and no shit it ran well again. Bought a few more bottles to finish the tour and started using it in everything I own.

I'm not a fan of additives at all! This one is different as it's basically lubricating & cleaning oil for gas in 4 strokes used at very low dosages. I add this to my small list of things that truly makes engines work better. Iridium plugs are another.
Works for me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by FlowBee View Post
By " ..down the starter for 2-3 seconds before it turns over." do you mean the time before the starter starts turning the engine, or the cranking time before the engine catches and begins firing on it's own?

If it's the latter, it could be that your pilot jets are beginning to clog up with varnish/sludge during storage. This would make your bike run leaner and leaner until the bike no longer starts without extreme choking and playing with the throttle. Today's gas is garbage, full of bunny-hugger ethanol (courtesy of ADM and Cargill) which causes it to separate and decompose into varnish and slime much more quickly than even 15 years ago. This crap slimes up your carb and causes hard starting within even a month or two of storage. The fix is to use lots of Stabil and frequent runs around the block, or a carb teardown and cleaning or replacement of the pilot jet. PITA either way. I use a little extra Stabil, run the bike whenever I can in the winter, and then when it warms up in the spring I add Techron to the last gallon and run the %$@& out of the bike before filling it up and changing the oil for summer use.

About a decade ago my wife had a Suzuki GSF400 Bandit. It was a 400 4-cylinder bike from the early 90s. Ran like a scalded cat above 6K rpms, but would sludge up the pilot circuits if not started every 4 weeks due to Chicago's EPA ethanol gas. I got really adept at pulling all four of those carbs and cleaning out the pilot circuits. 4x. PITA !

My bike has a TM40 carb kit conversion and it jetted to be hard to start without a couple of pumps and full choke when the temps are below 40F. Sometimes in the winter I have to start it a couple of times and play with the throttle a little. Once the bike is warmed up I can release the choke and the bike runs perfectly fine with a decent MPG and no watering eyes from a rich mixture. No surging at all.

Good luck,

FB
__________________
Butler Maps - motorcycle maps for riders by riders -
Alaska
AZ map COBDR AZBDR IDBDR South East map
http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=598717
Cycle World Adventure Rally:
http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=956350
eakins is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2013, 05:31 PM   #73934
TinkerinWstuff
Take it apart
 
TinkerinWstuff's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2010
Location: Colorado Northern Front Range
Oddometer: 1,287
Quote:
Originally Posted by isaac004 View Post
Ok, an update here on this issue which I posted about on post 70057 around Oct 2012. I sent the Intiminators back to Ricor, as they said they wanted to have a look at them. They opted to rebuild them, part of which involved replacing the oil ring which confirms that it was probably an older version which swelled when soaked in oil.

I reinstalled the Intiminators and have since taken the bike out on some commuting rides, and they are much better. You feel the stiffness of the anti dive, but there is no binding, and the fork always returns to regular ride height (unlike before where it would stick.

So all is good now!
That is good to hear. I've had them installed in mine for about a year or so and am quite pleased.
__________________
1999 Suzuki DR650
1998 Honda VFR800 Interceptor
http://share.findmespot.com/shared/f...KJutW9osVpn3hd
TinkerinWstuff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2013, 05:31 PM   #73935
Mambo Dave
Backyard Adventurer
 
Mambo Dave's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2011
Location: Pompano Beach, FL
Oddometer: 4,321
Quote:
Originally Posted by eakins View Post
I put Lucas fuel treatment http://www.lucasoil.com/products/dis...catid=2&iid=26 in everything I own, every fill up.

It's not a crap petroleum distillate, but rather a oil based (pours out like oil) product with additional cleaners. Fuel (since it is oil after all) use to offer lubrication properties to the fuel pump (if FI), carb/FI. Today's gas is mfg. so dry and even worse has ethanol in it. This product return that lubrication property, plus cleans the fuel system & valves.

Works for me.
Lucas is fine, but I'd rank Sea Foam over it for all the same reasons based on what I've read.
__________________
"After reading through this thread I've come to the conclusion
that more people cruise the internet looking for reasons why
X bike won't work in Y scenario rather than actually riding
their motorcycles
." --
RyanR
Mambo Dave is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Share

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

.
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


Times are GMT -7.   It's 03:28 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ADVrider 2011-2014