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Old 05-30-2013, 12:00 PM   #77161
eakins
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Joined: May 2002
Location: Fort Collins, Colorado
Oddometer: 17,661
Quote:
Originally Posted by ER70S-2 View Post
The DR has been known to have the fuel enrichment cable () rust internally, never allowing the plunger to seat in its bore.
that could be a possibility.
i keep my cables lubed with tri-flow http://www.triflowlubricants.com/Tri...Lubricant.html
it's oil based and penetrates and lubes plus it also has teflon (ptfe) so after the oil is long gone that remains. it works great to keep cables smooth operating.

i remove the cable at the top end and drip slowly drip it in. it pulls quickly into the cable housing. i do this until i see a small amount come out the bottom end.
my clutch, choke and throttle cables are all butter smooth.

any bicycle shop will have it in stock.
it work great to lube all pivot points on the bike too.
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Old 05-30-2013, 12:03 PM   #77162
eakins
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Location: Fort Collins, Colorado
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bronco638 View Post
Scott(bed),

I'm wondering if your carb's internals aren't shot. If the slide is worn, or the slide guide is worn (or both), I'm thinking the needle can move around within the needle jet which can cause rich/lean conditions (since the needle isn't centered). More and/or less vacuum can cause the slide to move which shifts the needle around.

So, if you ride at a slower speed (and lower RPM) does fuel economy improve?
could be if the mileage is up there. Motolab posted measurements awhile back to determine slide wear.

i've also found a solid pine sol soak pulls all sort of crap out of the carb that is not seen otherwise and the bike runs better. might just start here.
http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=560117
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Old 05-30-2013, 12:13 PM   #77163
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eakins View Post
could be if the mileage is up there. Motolab posted measurements awhile back to determine slide wear.

i've also found a solid pine sol soak pulls all sort of crap out of the carb that is not seen otherwise and the bike runs better. might just start here.
http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=560117
Brand new TM40 carb from Procycle installed middle of last year....mileage did go up on average but still swung all over the place. I got 47mpg sometimes....sometimes I got in mid 30's.

I pine sol soaked the original carb...no change. Replaced with another stock carb...no change. Rebuilt original carb...no change. Replaced with TM40...some change but still very erratic.

No carb change has fixed this...that is why I think it's not the carb.
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Old 05-30-2013, 12:17 PM   #77164
8gv
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Location: North central CT
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NSU...done

I've finished securing the NSU. It felt strange doing this invasive surgery for something that hasn't broken yet and may never have broken. Along the way I saw some opportunities to screw it up but so far, it seems I did ok. I'll appreciate this task more when the engine doesn't grenade in the mountains of Colorado.

Now I can get to the other items on my list:

Bash plate
DirtBagz pannier frames
BBQ rack
Remove upper chain roller
12v receptacles (2)
Battery tender wiring
14 tooth c/s sprocket (I'll start with the 15t on the eastern TAT)
Enhanced carb vent filter
K270 rear, T-63 front, heavy duty tubes

What non-performance mods am I missing?
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Old 05-30-2013, 12:21 PM   #77165
8gv
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scottbed View Post
Brand new TM40 carb from Procycle installed middle of last year....mileage did go up on average but still swung all over the place. I got 47mpg sometimes....sometimes I got in mid 30's.

I pine sol soaked the original carb...no change. Replaced with another stock carb...no change. Rebuilt original carb...no change. Replaced with TM40...some change but still very erratic.

No carb change has fixed this...that is why I think it's not the carb.
Don't know nuttin' 'bout nuttin' but...

My airplane mx tells me that a cylinder with poor compression will often cause a high fuel burn before its performance declines enough to alarm the pilot.
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Old 05-30-2013, 12:24 PM   #77166
Kommando
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Joined: Nov 2006
Location: Spacecoaster FL
Oddometer: 6,930
Quote:
Originally Posted by scottbed View Post
So, after 2 years of monkeying with the entire intake/exhaust on my bike I am convinced I have a real problem, maybe with the top end or even electrical.

I am looking for a mechanic to help me go through the top end. I would like to work with you if possible nights and/or weekends. Let me know what you want for rate and/or gifts! I only want someone with 4-stroke dirt bike experience, preferably on DR650s. I'd be open to a real shop if anyone knows someone reputable and reasonable and I would just drop it off and pick it up. Reasonable is the key here....if it's too much I'll just sell it and invest the money I'd spend to fix it on a newer year.

Symptoms/Observations:
  • Bad gas mileage, ranges from 30mpg to 45mpg (bad to almost normal, mostly around 39mpg), this started happening the 2nd year after I bought it used in 2009 with 2k on it (it's a 2002)
  • rarely I'll hear a single ping sound (like you hit a musical triangle with a small hammer) - only happens once in a while...usually when I get on the gas - sticky valve?
  • makes good power
  • only needs tiny amount of choke (probably not a problem, maybe idle jet is too large)
  • some type of vibration and/or runs slightly rough up hills some of the time
What I've done:
  • opened air box
  • TM40 carb (cleaned original carb, replaced original carb with OEM, replaced that with a TM40).
  • new exhaust can
  • new air filter
  • honed exhaust header
  • valve adjustment (many times)
  • new plugs
  • brought to mechanic to clean carb and jet properly - didn't fix mileage issue
Thoughts:
  • sticky exhaust valve
  • improperly jetted and/or carb settings like the float. I'm still scared of pinging noise even if this is issue
  • Other top end issue
  • electrical issue with CDI or pickup coils
But I just want to tear down to the cylinder, inspect valves/valve stem seals/seats, inspect cylinder/rings, safety wire NSU screw, inspect clutch, inspect steering head bearings. Maybe more...replace parts as necessary.

I'd like to start this work as soon as possible...riding season is happening now and I'm losing time :). My primary goal is to make sure the bike is up to snuff for a 6 day labor day ride in New Brunswick. I have a 2nd DR (2000) that I might have someone do once over on it if they have time.

I've been riding/racing and working on bikes for a lot of years...I'm not lugging it or riding it incorrectly. I can work on bikes but just don't have the time right now and would really like a more experienced person to help out.

Thanks!
Have you checked for bad wheel bearings or dragging brakes? Bad sprockets, rollers, chain guide, or chain?

You're sure that the carb O-rings and boots are in good shape?

Cam chain and tensioner are in good shape?

Super-aggressive tires and/or low pressures?
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Old 05-30-2013, 12:25 PM   #77167
TUCKERS
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Joined: Dec 2005
Location: Villa Maria Sanitarium, Claremont, CA.
Oddometer: 11,452
Quote:
Originally Posted by 8gv View Post
I've finished securing the NSU. It felt strange doing this invasive surgery for something that hasn't broken yet and may never have broken. Along the way I saw some opportunities to screw it up but so far, it seems I did ok. I'll appreciate this task more when the engine doesn't grenade in the mountains of Colorado.

Now I can get to the other items on my list:

Bash plate
DirtBagz pannier frames
BBQ rack
Remove upper chain roller
12v receptacles (2)
Battery tender wiring
14 tooth c/s sprocket (I'll start with the 15t on the eastern TAT)
Enhanced carb vent filter
K270 rear, T-63 front, heavy duty tubes

What non-performance mods am I missing?
HANDGUARDS
FATBARS
HEADLIGHT PROTECTOR
TOOL TUBE (19" of 3" ABS plastic drain pipe fit's opposite exhaust)
Safety wire brake caliper bolts and sump plug/oil filler
Fender bob and 250 rear light.
Six stainless Allens on carb
One in air box
Four on air box lid
Two for side panels (then just carry Allen head tools)
Crutch to aid with side stand for wheel off's and chain oiling.
Easier to swap out your front sprocket than your rear, get 14/15/16
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Old 05-30-2013, 12:30 PM   #77168
8gv
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Joined: Nov 2009
Location: North central CT
Oddometer: 2,290
Quote:
Originally Posted by TUCKERS View Post
HANDGUARDS
FATBARS
HEADLIGHT PROTECTOR
TOOL TUBE (19" of 3" ABS plastic drain pipe fit's opposite exhaust)
Safety wire brake caliper bolts and sump plug/oil filler
Fender bob and 250 rear light.
Six stainless Allens on carb
One in air box
Four on air box lid
Two for side panels (then just carry Allen head tools)
Crutch to aid with side stand for wheel off's and chain oiling.
Easier to swap out your front sprocket than your rear, get 14/15/16
I had better hurry up then! 5/10/14 is coming up fast!
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Old 05-30-2013, 12:30 PM   #77169
Kommando
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Joined: Nov 2006
Location: Spacecoaster FL
Oddometer: 6,930
Quote:
Originally Posted by 8gv View Post
I've finished securing the NSU. It felt strange doing this invasive surgery for something that hasn't broken yet and may never have broken. Along the way I saw some opportunities to screw it up but so far, it seems I did ok. I'll appreciate this task more when the engine doesn't grenade in the mountains of Colorado.

Now I can get to the other items on my list:

Bash plate
DirtBagz pannier frames
BBQ rack
Remove upper chain roller
12v receptacles (2)
Battery tender wiring
14 tooth c/s sprocket (I'll start with the 15t on the eastern TAT)
Enhanced carb vent filter
K270 rear, T-63 front, heavy duty tubes

What non-performance mods am I missing?
- Swap upper chain-roller for a loc-tited setscrew, as you touched on.
- Loc-tite and torque primary nut.
- Remove safety switches, if that's your thing.
- Grease all bearings and semi-seal brake-pedal pivot to hold clean grease.
- Real handguards and sidecase covers.
- Replace fragile tail/brake light with DR250 model.
- Swap to LED bulbs or lights for lower wattage use.
- Tooltube?
- Countershaft seal-retainer.
- Magnet for oil filter and/or drainbolt.
- Scotts stainless oil filter.
- Spare foam airfilter(s).
- Flat-repair tools/supplies.
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Old 05-30-2013, 12:37 PM   #77170
8gv
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Location: North central CT
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I suppose i just missed a great opportunity to do the primary nut.
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Old 05-30-2013, 12:58 PM   #77171
eakins
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Joined: May 2002
Location: Fort Collins, Colorado
Oddometer: 17,661
Quote:
Originally Posted by scottbed View Post
Brand new TM40 carb from Procycle installed middle of last year....mileage did go up on average but still swung all over the place. I got 47mpg sometimes....sometimes I got in mid 30's.

I pine sol soaked the original carb...no change. Replaced with another stock carb...no change. Rebuilt original carb...no change. Replaced with TM40...some change but still very erratic.

No carb change has fixed this...that is why I think it's not the carb.
sorry you said that before. yes deduction says it's past the carb as far as a problem. i'd check the valves. maybe a timming is thrown off, skipped chain?
how is engine compression? what about electrical? plugs?
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Old 05-30-2013, 01:18 PM   #77172
Emmbeedee
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Joined: Mar 2008
Location: Near Ottawa, ON, Canada
Oddometer: 9,059
Quote:
Originally Posted by scottbed View Post
It ran well for a year. I've torn down in-line fours and rebuilt them so the DR isn't too complicated to me. It has 9900 miles...

I was going to go down one click on the needle and one size on the main jet (one step at a time of course) and see if the fuel mileage got better. It's odd, sometimes it gets pretty good gas mileage...others it's just amazingly bad (like sub 30mpg). So that concerns me slightly. For example, did a 100 mile stint last year on the highway around 70mph mostly on a slight incline and the bike ran poorly, not much power and the gas mileage was horrendous. My thought was since the throttle was almost wide open the entire time it was getting too much gas.
This sounds to me like the float in the carb is sticking occasionally, causing the bike to run rich and waste fuel...
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Old 05-30-2013, 01:18 PM   #77173
thump!
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Joined: Jan 2007
Location: Northeast Tennessee
Oddometer: 1,087
Quote:
Originally Posted by 8gv View Post
I suppose i just missed a great opportunity to do the primary nut.
If it's dry it will be VERY dusty. If it's wet it will be VERY muddy. Be prepared. For my group in the OK panhandle it was 103 (mid June) without any shade for miles in any direction. Beware the innocent looking shallow water crossings in west TN. Algae makes them suckers really slippery. Beware the "tour" vehicles around the high passes in CO. The drivers consider you a nuisance.
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Old 05-30-2013, 01:40 PM   #77174
Meter Man
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Joined: May 2005
Location: Montana
Oddometer: 7,425
Quote:
Originally Posted by Emmbeedee View Post
This sounds to me like the float in the carb is sticking occasionally, causing the bike to run rich and waste fuel...
could also be the air filter. If I forgot to clean and oil on schedule my mpg would drop about 25%. It was the reminder on a few occassions.
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Old 05-30-2013, 01:56 PM   #77175
Rusty Rocket
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Joined: Dec 2005
Location: Trying to leave CT
Oddometer: 8,592
Quote:
Originally Posted by 8gv View Post

What non-performance mods am I missing?
DO NOT go on that trip with the stock seat.
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