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Old 11-20-2007, 07:07 AM   #7606
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flip18436572
What I am saying is that 99% of the people that ride bicycles get them at a department store for less than $150 on a day to day basis. We live about an hour from a city that has bicycle shops and even though people go there quite often, very few if any even know what a bicycle shop is.

The only one people even know about is the TREK store, and I won't go back there unless a family member needs something that I MUST get at that TREK store.

I live in a town of about 6000 people and there are very few people that I even see on the streets and we don't have any trails or anyplace for mountain bikes.

I know of a family that buys their kids new bikes at K-Mart about twice a year because the kids destroy them in about 6 months. He threw away about 10 bikes last year that were sitting in his back yard rusting away. He said he waits until they go on sale at K-Mart, or finds the same bike on-line and has it shipped to the house for less.

Most of the people don't ride the bikes enough to care about what shifter will last and when they break, they don't have anyone to take them to anymore. So, they sit and rust away and then head to the local land fill.

Respectfully, I don't even consider a $150 department store bike, a bike that a bicyclist, roadie, messenger, mountain biker, tourer, club rider, commuter would even consider. And that goes for the bicyclists on this thread or on Fried Quads or Bike Forums.
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Old 11-20-2007, 07:29 AM   #7607
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Perry
Respectfully, I don't even consider a $150 department store bike, a bike that a bicyclist, roadie, messenger, mountain biker, tourer, club rider, commuter would even consider. And that goes for the bicyclists on this thread or on Fried Quads or Bike Forums.
Looks to me that your consideration is rather narrow for the rest of the bicycle riding population.

The fact is that is majority of bicycles sold in the US are not sold to population that you consider to be cyclist, they are just people who consider bicycles as disposable items that are not worth fixing beyond $100.
Maybe in affluent urban area near NYC where average income is well above the poverty line, you have more exposure to expensive bicycle purchase, that could be what you base your considerations.
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Old 11-20-2007, 07:33 AM   #7608
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Originally Posted by Cat0020
Looks to me that your consideration is rather narrow for the rest of the bicycle riding population.

The fact is that is majority of bicycles sold in the US are not sold to population that you consider to be cyclist, they are just people who consider bicycles as disposable items that are not worth fixing beyond $100.
And we go back to your flat tire scenario

(what was it, "most people can't afford tire patch kits, or was it, most people don't have access to tire patch kits..")



Are those "consumers" on this thread, Bike Forums (BTW I've seen you there too) or Fried Quads....are they the one's who shop for bicycles in LBS's or on Bicycling Magazine's buyer's guide?

To be perfectly frank, who cares about a 5 year olds Walmart training bike in this conversation about how much a decent road bike costs?

You're a bicycle mechanic right, you work in an LBS, (or big one I dunno) why are we bringing disposable department store kiddie bikes into this picture anyway?
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Old 11-20-2007, 07:35 AM   #7609
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cat0020
Looks to me that your consideration is rather narrow for the rest of the bicycle riding population.

The fact is that is majority of bicycles sold in the US are not sold to population that you consider to be cyclist, they are just people who consider bicycles as disposable items that are not worth fixing beyond $100.
Maybe in affluent urban area near NYC where average income is well above the poverty line, you have more exposure to expensive bicycle purchase, that could be what you base your considerations.
Those links to actual avg prices per unit/ spread sheets - were taken from the whole of the US and Cananda, not urban areas only...

sounds like you're the one thinking too narrowly here.

Again, where in this conversation did it come up that we were talking about cyclist who consider them disposable items...?
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Old 11-20-2007, 07:43 AM   #7610
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Average price is hardly representation of unit sales.

I would say that 40% of the repair business in my LBS are related to department store bicycles, most of them flats, brake adjustment and wheel true follow. They actually generate good protion of profit for my LBS, certainly more than $2000 or above profit from bicycle sales.

When life is on the line any bicycle is disposable, even the $5000 carbon fiber ones.
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Old 11-20-2007, 07:52 AM   #7611
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Originally Posted by Cat0020
Average price is hardly representation of unit sales.

I would say that 40% of the repair business in my LBS are related to department store bicycles, most of them flats, brake adjustment and wheel true follow. They actually generate good protion of profit for my LBS, certainly more than $2000 or above profit from bicycle sales.
Go back to the first post where this comes up, between Flip and I.

http://www.advrider.com/forums/showp...postcount=7610

Where did we talk about unit's sold? We were talking about what the avg cost of a bike we would ride cost. Flip brought up department store bikes, which I completely understand, but the question was - what the avg cost of a bicycle we would ride is, not how certain units sell more than others...

I found charts and links to the avg cost of each type of bike sold in the US & Canada.

If you want to talk about kiddie disposable department store bikes which look good under a Christmas tree for about a week until they implode so be it.

But it's comparing apples to oranges.

Hell, lets throw those foldable edge scooters into the mix too.



Shit I gotta move the car before get a ticket-
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Old 11-20-2007, 08:02 AM   #7612
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Perry
And we go back to your flat tire scenario

(what was it, "most people can't afford tire patch kits, or was it, most people don't have access to tire patch kits..")

Are those "consumers" on this thread, Bike Forums (BTW I've seen you there too) or Fried Quads....are they the one's who shop for bicycles in LBS's or on Bicycling Magazine's buyer's guide?

To be perfectly frank, who cares about a 5 year olds Walmart training bike in this conversation about how much a decent road bike costs?

You're a bicycle mechanic right, you work in an LBS, (or big one I dunno) why are we bringing disposable department store kiddie bikes into this picture anyway?
Get it right, I worte that most people who ride a bicycle do not carry a patch kit with them while they are riding, including the ones that you do not consider as "cyclists".

I bring up the disposable department store kiddie bikes into this picture because they actually produce a significant portion of profit when they are taken to LBS for repairs.. more so than the percentage of profit generated by bicycle sales over $2000. That's why the LBS should care about the department store bikes.
LBS could charge $10, $15, $20 to change a flat for a 5 cent tube, in a few minutes. A $2000 bicycle sales usually don't have the profit margin of 25% and take at least 1/2 hour, if not more.. then the customers for the highend bikes always require more effort to sell the profitable items like computers, pump, patch kits.. all that could be purchase from the internet for less. Why would people buy them from LBS?
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Old 11-20-2007, 08:03 AM   #7613
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[quote=Perry]Go back to the first post where this comes up, between Flip and I.

http://www.advrider.com/forums/showp...postcount=7610

Where did we talk about unit's sold? We were talking about what the avg cost of a bike we would ride cost. Flip brought up department store bikes, which I completely understand, but the question was - what the avg cost of a bicycle we would ride is, not how certain units sell more than others...
[quote]

I never said what bike I/we would ride and I didn't mean to start world war three. Your bike club average being $2500 and I brought up that we don't have a bike club and therefore our average bike is less than $200.00 for people riding bikes in our town as they buy them somewhere besides an LBS that knows something about bicycles.

If I look at the people that buy from an LBS in my town, I would put the average price over $600. I can only think of three bicycles in town that were purchased at an LBS and I know that two of them are Jamis around the $500.00 price and the other one is from the guy that is 70 something and retired and built his own when he owned the shop. I only see him on one bike, but I understand he still has quite a few different bikes.

Let's move on back to enjoying the thread.

Sorry for commenting and causing problems.
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Old 11-20-2007, 08:04 AM   #7614
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cat0020
Get it right, I worte that most people who ride a bicycle do not carry a patch kit with them while they are riding.

I bring up the disposable department store kiddie bikes into this picture because they actually produce a significant portion of profit when they are taken to LBS for repairs.. more so than the percentage of profit generated by bicycle sales over $2000. That's why the LBS should care about the department store bikes.
LBS could charge $10, $15 to change a flat for a 5 cent tube, in a few minutes. A $2000 bicycle sales usually don't have the profit margin of 25% and take at least 1/2 hour.

I wish I could get tubes for $.05!!!!

And I was out riding Sunday and didn't have a spare tube or patch kit with me, because I was an ID 10 T!!!!

The first tube already had a hole in it and the second one was good to go. The one that would have been with me, would have already had a hole in it taking it out of the box, so I would have been screwed anyway.

What do you "pros" use for a quality patch kit?
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Old 11-20-2007, 08:12 AM   #7615
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[quote=flip18436572][quote=Perry]Go back to the first post where this comes up, between Flip and I.

http://www.advrider.com/forums/showp...postcount=7610

Where did we talk about unit's sold? We were talking about what the avg cost of a bike we would ride cost. Flip brought up department store bikes, which I completely understand, but the question was - what the avg cost of a bicycle we would ride is, not how certain units sell more than others...
Quote:

I never said what bike I/we would ride and I didn't mean to start world war three. Your bike club average being $2500 and I brought up that we don't have a bike club and therefore our average bike is less than $200.00 for people riding bikes in our town as they buy them somewhere besides an LBS that knows something about bicycles.

If I look at the people that buy from an LBS in my town, I would put the average price over $600. I can only think of three bicycles in town that were purchased at an LBS and I know that two of them are Jamis around the $500.00 price and the other one is from the guy that is 70 something and retired and built his own when he owned the shop. I only see him on one bike, but I understand he still has quite a few different bikes.

Let's move on back to enjoying the thread.

Sorry for commenting and causing problems.

Hey it's all good. I could only assume we were talking about the bikes we all ride, not kiddie Walmart specials

http://www.advrider.com/forums/showp...postcount=7610

PS - It's all in fun, Cat and I like to yammer & bullshit over this silly shit.


It's just that he's always wrong...










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Old 11-20-2007, 08:19 AM   #7616
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cat0020
Get it right, I worte that most people who ride a bicycle do not carry a patch kit with them while they are riding, including the ones that you do not consider as "cyclists".
iI've never been on a club ride, tour, or alone as a commuter, where I or other's in the group all didn't have at least one tube per bike, and a C02...

It's pretty much the first thing the LBS sells a bike noob - a tailbag with a patch kit. But hey, that's just my experience. Kiddie bikes don't count because most 6 yr olds don't ride a bicycle past a block from their homes.



Quote:
I bring up the disposable department store kiddie bikes into this picture because they actually produce a significant portion of profit when they are taken to LBS for repairs.. more so than the percentage of profit generated by bicycle sales over $2000. That's why the LBS should care about the department store bikes.
LBS could charge $10, $15, $20 to change a flat for a 5 cent tube, in a few minutes. A $2000 bicycle sales usually don't have the profit margin of 25% and take at least 1/2 hour, if not more.. then the customers for the highend bikes always require more effort to sell the profitable items like computers, pump, patch kits.. all that could be purchase from the internet for less. Why would people buy them from LBS?
That's great. I have no problem with that. But comparing them to bikes that people on this thread, Bike Forums, Bicyclist Magazine subscribers, or Fried Quads ride - is like comparing a cantelope to a banana.
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Old 11-20-2007, 08:25 AM   #7617
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Perry
Where did we talk about unit's sold? We were talking about what the avg cost of a bike we would ride cost. Flip brought up department store bikes, which I completely understand, but the question was - what the avg cost of a bicycle we would ride is, not how certain units sell more than others...

Hey it's all good. I could only assume we were talking about the bikes we all ride, not kiddie Walmart specials

http://www.advrider.com/forums/showp...postcount=7610

PS - It's all in fun, Cat and I like to yammer & bullshit over this silly shit.

It's just that he's always wrong...

I highly doubt that 80% of people you see in NYC on bicycles everyday carry a patch kit with them on their bicycle while they are riding.

I'm not comparing, I just think that your consideration of "people who ride" do not represent the majority of bicycle owners.

Bicycles that you refer to as "bicycle we would ride" do not represent the majority of bicycles that are being sold.

And your consideration of "bicycle we would ride" is not something that represent the majority of what LBS service and profit margin generator/factor.

I don't mind if I'm wrong, I'm still getting my tubes for 5 cents a piece.
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Cat0020 screwed with this post 11-20-2007 at 08:31 AM
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Old 11-20-2007, 08:32 AM   #7618
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cat0020
I'm not comparing, I'm just telling you the stastistics.

Bicycles that you refer to as "bicycle we would ride" do not represent the majority of bicycles that are being sold.

And your consideration of "bicycle we would ride" is not something that represent the majority of what LBS service and profit margin generator/factor.

I don't mind if I'm wrong, I'm still getting my tubes for 5 cents a piece.




can you send me a case?




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Old 11-20-2007, 08:34 AM   #7619
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cat0020
Bicycles that you refer to as "bicycle we would ride" do not represent the majority of bicycles that are being sold.
I patiently await for you to provide the annual report that shows exactly what the "majority of bicycles being sold" are.
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Old 11-20-2007, 08:34 AM   #7620
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Originally Posted by Cat0020
I highly doubt that 80% of people you see in NYC on bicycles everyday carry a patch kit with them on their bicycle while they are riding.

Been riding a bicycle here since the first 5 boro bike ride (late 70's), my Dad since the 60's, his club too.

Never seen a rider without a tube and patch kit, pump or C02.

I guess we're just smart over here...
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