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Old 05-14-2009, 07:51 AM   #1501
longtallsally
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kawalaser
Oris makes some cool timepieces for the money ~$600-700




http://www.watchesonnet.com/733%2075...l?id_partner=4
Not bad. Enjoying their collection.

Does "automatic" mean it's manual wind or some sort of motion like the Rolex or Citizen to wind, or does it have a battery?
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Old 05-14-2009, 07:54 AM   #1502
kawalaser
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Quote:
Originally Posted by longtallsally
Not bad. Enjoying their collection.

Does "automatic" mean it's manual wind or some sort of motion like the Rolex or Citizen to wind, or does it have a battery?

Auto means it uses the kinetic energy of being worn on your wrist to either self-wind (most swiss movements) or self-charge (as with the Seiko Kinetic movement), AFAIK.

manual winding would mean hand-winding by turning the crown.


I just bought a hamilton manual wind (ETA/Unitas 6497) that I'm enjoying. They make some quality autos with swiss movement as well. Bought second-hand on Ebay for less than half of retail.

www.hamiltonwatch.com
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Old 05-14-2009, 08:13 AM   #1503
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Quote:
Originally Posted by longtallsally
I need a dress watch but am getting pretty adamant about no batteries. So I know the Citizen has their movement, and from what I've seen here, Seiko has some as well. I/we don't have the type of income to afford thousands of dollars for a watch at this stage in our lives (I'd rather buy another motorcycle anyway).

As such, how does one know if it is a battery or non battery powered watch? I see a whole bunch of obscure ones here that are really cool. I'd like something unique (a Rolex is not unique to me) and classy, but does denote a bit of adventure. I also like a lot of functions (see above).

How can I start my research on something like this? I'm getting married soon and she is asking me what type of watch I'd like.

Virtually all quartz movement watches have "batteries." That said, Citizen has their "Eco" line, Casio has their "Solar" line, and Seiko has their "Kinetic" line, and in those wristwatches, the batteries are very long life rechargeable cells that should not need replacement for about as long as you own the watch. In the first two cases, the battery is recharged by ambient light impinging on the dial of the watch, behind which is a photovoltaic cell. In the latter case, Seiko uses a rotor-driven generator to allow for wrist movement to recharge the battery.

All other quartz watches will have a battery that needs periodic replacement, over some period of one to five years, generally.

To have "a lot of functions," particularly those of which your Casio Triple Sensor is capable, you are going to have a quartz watch, and a battery.

To get away from batteries, you can either get one of those lines mentioned above which do not require battery replacement, or you have to go automatic or mechanical.

Automatics use wrist movement, or orbital motion in a watch winder, to cause the rotor to wind the mainspring in the barrel through a sequence of gears and clutches. Automatic movements use that stored mechanical energy of the mainspring to drive the movement, which is regulated by a balance wheel escapement. Mechanicals [automatics are mechanicals, too, of course, but watchmaking convention differentiates between the two] do not have a "self-wind" rotor, but have to be hand wound each day, via the crown of the wristwatch.

Pros and cons:

Quartz wristwatches "keep better time." Set it and forget it, usually for months at a time. Automatics and mechanicals typically stay within +/- 5 seconds per day, and thus, depending on your tolerance for such matters, need to be reset perhaps every couple of weeks. Isochronism is also a big factor in the accuracy of an automatic/mechanical: how constant the balance wheel escapement regulation is depending on whether the mainspring is applying high force [high state of wind] or low force [low state of wind.] Some makers/calibres are better at isochronism than others. Typically, a very inexpensive automatic will not exhibit good isochronism, while a more expensive automatic will, as generally more engineering and care was applied.

Quartz watches exhibit that characteristic "skip" of the sweep second hand, as the stepmotor drive pulses once each second. Automatics and mechanicals generally have between 4 to 10 pulses per second, and thus exhibit smoother motion. Two wristwatches of further note, Bulova's Calibre 214 Accutron of the '60's and early '70's, stepped 360 times per second, and Seiko's Spring Drive is absolutely, perfectly smooth, as the Spring Drive movement doesn't step at all.

Quartz watches, with the exceptions noted above, need to have batteries replaced periodically. Automatics don't. That said, automatics do require periodic care - depending on the marque, perhaps once every five or so years, the case needs to be opened, and the movement cleaned, serviced, and re-regulated.

All the above said, you can find very nice Citizen Eco-Drive wristwatches that are absolutely suitable for dress purposes, which have a number of functions, including chronograph, perpetual calendar, and even minute repeater. Yes, they are quartz, and they have a battery, but you shouldn't need to crack the case and replace it for as long as you own it, if proper care is taken.

Likewise, Seiko makes a broad range of Kinetic styles. Again, you shouldn't have to replace the battery.

Automatics, aside from fundamental complications like day and date, and chronograph, won't give you much more in the way of features, until you start spending several thousand dollars and up.

The best way to start hunting for a nice wristwatch is to start writing down a list of things that you NEED the watch to do.: Tell time, obviously, but do you need it to be visible in low-light conditions? Darkness? Some dress designes eschew luminous hands and cardinal markers. Day, date? Perpetual calendar [this accounts for months and leap years]? Alarm? Chronograph? Do you need it to be water-resistant, and if so, to what degree? Do you need an elapsed-time bezel? Or some other bezel design? Tachymeter, perhaps?

Next, start thinking about things you'd LIKE the watch to do. Some on the above list of needs might actually be more appropriate for "likes." Do you want a bracelet, or a strap? Would you like E6 or E6B "flight computer" capability? Would you like radio synchronization? [Very cool! NEVER set your watch again!] And so on. You probably get the idea.

Happy hunting! And congrats on the pending marriage!

WA.
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Old 05-14-2009, 08:18 AM   #1504
kawalaser
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Buccleuch
Virtually all quartz movement watches have "batteries." That said, Citizen has their "Eco" line, Casio has their "Solar" line, and Seiko has their "Kinetic" line, and in those wristwatches, the batteries are very long life rechargeable cells that should not need replacement for about as long as you own the watch. In the first two cases, the battery is recharged by ambient light impinging on the dial of the watch, behind which is a photovoltaic cell. In the latter case, Seiko uses a rotor-driven generator to allow for wrist movement to recharge the battery.

All other quartz watches will have a battery that needs periodic replacement, over some period of one to five years, generally.

To have "a lot of functions," particularly those of which your Casio Triple Sensor is capable, you are going to have a quartz watch, and a battery.

To get away from batteries, you can either get one of those lines mentioned above which do not require battery replacement, or you have to go automatic or mechanical.

Automatics use wrist movement, or orbital motion in a watch winder, to cause the rotor to wind the mainspring in the barrel through a sequence of gears and clutches. Automatic movements use that stored mechanical energy of the mainspring to drive the movement, which is regulated by a balance wheel escapement. Mechanicals [automatics are mechanicals, too, of course, but watchmaking convention differentiates between the two] do not have a "self-wind" rotor, but have to be hand wound each day, via the crown of the wristwatch.

Pros and cons:

Quartz wristwatches "keep better time." Set it and forget it, usually for months at a time. Automatics and mechanicals typically stay within +/- 5 seconds per day, and thus, depending on your tolerance for such matters, need to be reset perhaps every couple of weeks. Isochronism is also a big factor in the accuracy of an automatic/mechanical: how constant the balance wheel escapement regulation is depending on whether the mainspring is applying high force [high state of wind] or low force [low state of wind.] Some makers/calibres are better at isochronism than others. Typically, a very inexpensive automatic will not exhibit good isochronism, while a more expensive automatic will, as generally more engineering and care was applied.

Quartz watches exhibit that characteristic "skip" of the sweep second hand, as the stepmotor drive pulses once each second. Automatics and mechanicals generally have between 4 to 10 pulses per second, and thus exhibit smoother motion. Two wristwatches of further note, Bulova's Calibre 214 Accutron of the '60's and early '70's, stepped 360 times per second, and Seiko's Spring Drive is absolutely, perfectly smooth, as the Spring Drive movement doesn't step at all.

Quartz watches, with the exceptions noted above, need to have batteries replaced periodically. Automatics don't. That said, automatics do require periodic care - depending on the marque, perhaps once every five or so years, the case needs to be opened, and the movement cleaned, serviced, and re-regulated.

All the above said, you can find very nice Citizen Eco-Drive wristwatches that are absolutely suitable for dress purposes, which have a number of functions, including chronograph, perpetual calendar, and even minute repeater. Yes, they are quartz, and they have a battery, but you shouldn't need to crack the case and replace it for as long as you own it, if proper care is taken.

Likewise, Seiko makes a broad range of Kinetic styles. Again, you shouldn't have to replace the battery.

Automatics, aside from fundamental complications like day and date, and chronograph, won't give you much more in the way of features, until you start spending several thousand dollars and up.

The best way to start hunting for a nice wristwatch is to start writing down a list of things that you NEED the watch to do.: Tell time, obviously, but do you need it to be visible in low-light conditions? Darkness? Some dress designes eschew luminous hands and cardinal markers. Day, date? Perpetual calendar [this accounts for months and leap years]? Alarm? Chronograph? Do you need it to be water-resistant, and if so, to what degree? Do you need an elapsed-time bezel? Or some other bezel design? Tachymeter, perhaps?

Next, start thinking about things you'd LIKE the watch to do. Some on the above list of needs might actually be more appropriate for "likes." Do you want a bracelet, or a strap? Would you like E6 or E6B "flight computer" capability? Would you like radio synchronization? [Very cool! NEVER set your watch again!] And so on. You probably get the idea.

Happy hunting! And congrats on the pending marriage!

WA.


encyclopedic!
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Old 05-14-2009, 08:22 AM   #1505
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Great explination1 In a nutshell, if a watch says Automatic or manual in the description, it does nOT have a battery. Those are mechanical in nature, ANY quartz movement had a battery wether it is recharged by the sun or other light source, or if it is simply replaced by the wearer. I have a Citizen GMT that is an Ecodirve and have not had to change the battery....I should never have to but for one wanting to NEVER change a battery, one should buy a automatic watch!
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Old 05-14-2009, 08:58 AM   #1506
longtallsally
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kawalaser
encyclopedic!
+1!!!!!!!! I can't thank you enough for the insight and info.

I chose the Casio for the "ABC" functions as well as the atomic time and- obviously- no battery (well one to be replaced at least- it's solar). Also it wasn't too expensive and I've had other Pathfinders and found them extremely durable and handy with the toys.

As for a more dress oriented watch, I found these:



I really like the battery meter on that one. Kinda cool. However, Citizen is kinda out b/c an old g/f gave me one...



This one REALLY had me lit up in terms of the map reading function. I'm going to try to learn more about this one as that is the coolest feature I've found outside of the Casio I currently have. Plus I had a very nice Seiko that was a graduation present from my undergrad from my parents that was stolen in a move, so I'm partial to the marque to start with. I had no idea they made such cool watches, so I have to say this one is very high on the list right now.

I'd love to say I'm a pilot and have a tachymeter and the need to use one, but honestly it would end up being a cool toy that I'd be a poseur with. I'm also not traveling as I used to.

I also found a Tissot that was pretty cool, but their more interesting automatics get a bit pricey.

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Old 05-14-2009, 12:26 PM   #1507
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That's it sally I am telling the SO, you are in trouble now!

I drool over the bell & ross collection these days
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Old 05-14-2009, 12:27 PM   #1508
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I'll add one other thing for budding wristwatch enthusiasts who just got their first automatic, or even for those who have enjoyed autos for some time.

Some of you are probably already aware of what magnetic fields can do to a wristwatch, but for those who aren't...

If your automatic has been keeping very good time, +/- 5 seconds or better a day, no worries, for months and months, and all of a sudden, like a switch got flipped, your auto is now gaining two to ten minutes a day, don't despair.

It's most likely that your auto wristwatch got magnetized. It's complicated, but magnetized parts very near the glucydur balance wheel cause eddy currents and weirdness, and that's generally the cause of a typically well-behaved wristwatch suddenly switching to ludicrous speed.

If you think that might have happened to your auto, think back to what you might have been doing, or what equipment you were near, to see if the circumstances make sense. For example - magnetron tubes that drive microwave ovens have two big, powerful magnets on either end. Imagine that. In another example, when the local museum does a special hands-on exhibition on electricity and magnetism, leave your auto in the glove box of the car! [In my defense, it was a REALLY cool exhibit, particularly the one where you made a large iron ring "defy gravity" and float in mid-air by manipulating two powerful magnets above and below a massive split copper bar.....]

Anyway, if your auto gets magnetized, you need to get it zapped by a jeweler's demagnetizer. Once or twice should set it right. Many full service jewelers will have one. I have one in my closet, for just such emergencies.

WA.
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Old 05-14-2009, 12:31 PM   #1509
kawalaser
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AngryScot
That's it sally I am telling the SO, you are in trouble now!

I drool over the bell & ross collection these days

interesting collection

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Old 05-14-2009, 12:59 PM   #1510
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Bell & Ross makes some fabulous stuff, but before you fall in love with a B&R, check the price!

B&R is justifiably proud of their designs. I love their Instrument line. I also love the HydroMax, just for sheer geekness.

Granted, it's the top of the heap, but the B&R Minuteur Tourbillon you posted, VERY limited manufacture [only 30 pieces] with satin rose gold case, is probably in the $150,000 to $250,000 range.

Perchance to dream...

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Old 05-14-2009, 03:03 PM   #1511
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AngryScot
That's it sally I am telling the SO, you are in trouble now!

I drool over the bell & ross collection these days
I had one, loved it but was offered more than I paid so I sold it. I think I'll buy the Invicta version because it is cheap and looks amazing for the money.
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Old 05-14-2009, 03:07 PM   #1512
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Not bad for under $200.00
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Old 05-15-2009, 05:45 AM   #1513
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Quote:
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(Pic not quoted. No need to thank me.)

Not bad for under $200.00
On this forum I've seen that we have similar tastes on several topics. That thing is not one of them.
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Old 05-15-2009, 07:47 AM   #1514
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On this forum I've seen that we have similar tastes on several topics. That thing is not one of them.
The big square watches are definitely not for everyone. I had a Bell & Ross and it was cool in it's way.
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Old 05-15-2009, 07:51 AM   #1515
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The big square watches are definitely not for everyone. I had a Bell & Ross and it was cool in it's way.

I had Space III Ti and a Military 123, liked them both but feel B&R went off the deep end with their squares.

Too fashionista for me. Thought a few were cool years ago when they first came out, but then they went way overboard with way too many square styles/colors, etc.

Still like some of their quartz designs though.
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