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Old 02-11-2007, 02:36 PM   #76
Stu
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Joined: Feb 2004
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Changes suggested

Leesbian.

The cush hub from KTM is a mix...there are three different hubs, backing plates and spacer combinations for three different years on the LC4. The first one I tried (for the '06 LC4) had the sprocket and rotor alignment correct but was too wide by about 7 or 8mm to fit. Basically, the sprocket carrier stuck out of the hub by that distance. I am still working on this trying to get the right combination. When I do I will post the part numbers for the right combination to go on the RFS (or on my 250 EXC 2-stroke, for that matter).

This summer I am planning on following the Pony Express trail from St. Joseph, MO to Sacramento, CA. Some of the trail is fenced off but some of it can still be ridden. I hope to head up to Prudhoe Bay in Alaska on the Arctic Ocean after that.

Your RTW trip sounds great! Need a mechanic / photographer to go along?

Stu
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Old 02-11-2007, 02:49 PM   #77
leesbian
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stu
The cush hub from KTM is a mix...there are three different hubs, backing plates and spacer combinations for three different years on the LC4. The first one I tried (for the '06 LC4) had the sprocket and rotor alignment correct but was too wide by about 7 or 8mm to fit. Basically, the sprocket carrier stuck out of the hub by that distance. I am still working on this trying to get the right combination. When I do I will post the part numbers for the right combination to go on the RFS (or on my 250 EXC 2-stroke, for that matter).

This summer I am planning on following the Pony Express trail from St. Joseph, MO to Sacramento, CA. Some of the trail is fenced off but some of it can still be ridden. I hope to head up to Prudhoe Bay in Alaska on the Arctic Ocean after that.

Your RTW trip sounds great! Need a mechanic / photographer to go along?

Stu
Damn. I'm looking at a set of '03 LC4 wheels now... can't really try them before I buy though :-/

Your trip sounds cool too! when (and if...) I get to Alaska, I plan on going upto Prudhoe Bay and then doing the classic route down to Ushuaia.

Seriously - I am trying to put together a group of 6 people to go, if you really are interested then sure - a mechanic would definately come in handy (especially seeing as it looks like its now going to be done on KTMs...)
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Old 02-12-2007, 05:41 AM   #78
flux_capacitor
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Stu, thanks for following up my post about the cush hub. That is good knowledge right there.

Leesbian, here are a few pictures I have already taken with the Wolfman bag set up. I do not have a rack, just the bracket over the exhaust. These pics were taken with some filler in the bag just to get an idea of it's shape. I have since started mounting the bag further back than this on the bike to give me some more room. Also, with this bag I do not use panniers...I have never found a way to mount them on the 525, and I don't really need them anyway. I sometimes carry a Moose backpack w/hydration bladder as well. I still need to take some pics of the bracket close up.










I strapped the rear strap a different way than most, so as to avoid getting muck in the buckle. Works well so far.


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Old 02-12-2007, 07:13 AM   #79
Stu
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RTW 525s

Flex / Leesbian,

Three comments:
1) I will get the cush hub info as soon as I can. I would not purchase the LC4 hub/sprocket carrier without trying them out. It is a lot of money to get wrong.
2) Your setup on your MXC looks great and is how my 525 will more or less be set up as well. Minimalist approach to bike packing. (I will never forget the comment in The Complete Backpacker, a weight conscious fanatic book author, that at one point he caught himself tearing the labels off of tea bags. My kind of guy!)
3) There have been many posts about the ability of the rear subframe to carry any additional weight. The Wolfman Minibag is one solution and the other is just don't worry about it. My RFS and my 250 2-stroke have been flipped over on their tails repeatedly, slammed to the ground, etc. without any damage to the subframe. I just cannot get worked up about this non-issue. (There were some recent posts of Europeans taking their MXCs with ProMoto racks to Africa with what looked like about 3 gallon plastic gas jugs attached. If you can fly over sand dunes with a load...really.)

Stu
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Old 02-12-2007, 07:17 AM   #80
leesbian
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flux_capacitor
Stu, thanks for following up my post about the cush hub. That is good knowledge right there.

Leesbian, here are a few pictures I have already taken with the Wolfman bag set up. I do not have a rack, just the bracket over the exhaust. These pics were taken with some filler in the bag just to get an idea of it's shape. I have since started mounting the bag further back than this on the bike to give me some more room. Also, with this bag I do not use panniers...I have never found a way to mount them on the 525, and I don't really need them anyway. I sometimes carry a Moose backpack w/hydration bladder as well. I still need to take some pics of the bracket close up.
Excellent. thanks :)

It does look like you can fit a whole load of kit in that bag, cool - putting one on the shopping list now

Is that the Acerbis 25L tank you have there?

I'm about to order one of those now - apparently [according to TT, at least] to fit on the '03 525 I need to use an '04 seat with it
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Old 02-12-2007, 07:43 AM   #81
John E Davies
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Cheat
I am planning on installing two MR16 Trail Tech HID lights (30watt fog and 30 watt pencil beam) plus I have grip warmers. Can the stock charging system handle this? I want to be able to run both lights and have the grip heaters going. I think the bike has 90 watts stock but I am not sure. It is a 2006 KTM EXC 450. So what do you fellers think?
I can't comment on the HIDs, other than to mention that the start up amperage is rather high until they get lit and running, so you need a good battery.

You won't see anything close to 90 watts out of a stock RFS stator. After rewinding with larger 18 gage wire and filling all the poles completely my stator gives me about 95 (calculated using a digital volt meter and amp meter.)

Stock is around 75 to 80; and 55 of that is ac, which will not work for HID, no way. So at the minimum you need to consider a rewind and float the ground to a pure dc system. Since you want to pile on the electrical accessories it might be a good idea to invest in the Electrosport stator, which is good for an "advertised" 273 watts. That way you won't have to worry about future upgrades like a cooling fan, heated vest or 100 watt mobile Ham radio ;)

A Trail Tech flywheel with stronger magnets can bump up the output of any of these mods by 10 or 15 watts. If you have been wanting either more rev or more flywheel effect, this can be a good option for a little more juice.
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Old 02-12-2007, 07:59 AM   #82
John E Davies
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Soft panniers for your RFS:

These are pics kindly sent to me by KTMTalk member "oldPentonRider" from Colorado. He allowed me to post these on my KTM website, so I'm sure he won't mind if I show them here:








He indicated to me that he would be willing to build the side guards for someone if they were interested. That was a while back - if you want to talk to him you can find send him a PM at KTMTalk.:

http://www.ktmtalk.com/index.php?showuser=6746
Note: you must first be logged in there to use this link.

Note 2: If I were building these from scratch, I would (in addition) extend the lower side guards with 1/8 mild steel plate all the way down to the frame lugs, rather than simply clamping them around the weak subframe. Subframe failure often involves damage to the lower subframe nutserts, so I think bypassing that weak point would be wise. I would drill out the threads and install a long countersunk bolt with nylock nut. Boot interference will be an issue, but not a serious one with some creativity.
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John E Davies screwed with this post 02-12-2007 at 08:04 AM
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Old 02-12-2007, 08:00 AM   #83
flux_capacitor
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I agree with Stu about the subframe....I don't really worry too much about it. As you can see, the Wolfman bag sits halfway on the back end of the seat...I tend to pack the heavier items on the seat side, and the lighter items towards the rear fender. I too have been involved with a few wrecks that should have damaged the subframe, but hasn't. Hell, I flipped my bike once and it landed completely upside down, resting on the handlebars. THAT was fun!

The tank I have is the "XC" tank, not that monster 6.6 gallon Acerbis tank. No way I need almost 7 gallons of fuel. It would be a good addition for someone like Leesbian who is going RTW but for me it is overkill. Seems like that joker would change your sterring geometry when it's full.

Sounds like our man John Davies knows his stuff about the electrical jazz! I get lost in all the technical jargon. I do not know why it loses me, it just seems to have that effect.

Yup, "minimalist" camping rules. I used to stuff all my shit into the Moose backpack (I love that thing) but it started getting too heavy all day long. That is when I started looking for a way to carry some luggage. I actually bought and returnned a few different soft saddlebags...none of them worked well enough for me. I like the Mini Beta because it can hold a lot of stuff or a little amount of stuff. Either way, the cinch straps are smartly designed and NOTHING moves around in there.
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Old 02-12-2007, 08:02 AM   #84
flux_capacitor
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John E Davies
Soft panniers for your RFS:

These are pics kindly sent to me by KTMTalk member "oldPentonRider" from Colorado. He allowed me to post these on my KTM website, so I'm sure he won't mind if I show them here:

He indicated to me that he would be willing to build the side guards for someone if they were interested. That was a while back - if you want to talk to him you can find send him a PM at KTMTalk.:

http://www.ktmtalk.com/index.php?showuser=6746
Note: you must first be logged in there to use this link.

Note 2: If I were building these from scratch, I would extend the lower side guards all the way down to the frame lugs, rather than clamping them around the weak subframe. Subframe failure often involves damage to the lower subframe nutserts, so I think bypassing that weak point would be wise. Boot interference will be an issue, but not a serious one with some creativity.
I remember that thread... it was a good one. I really like his design. Wonder how they are holding up.
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Old 02-12-2007, 08:22 AM   #85
Stu
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Rear Pannier Supports

John,

Again, thanks for an excellent post!

I am going to use the stock Dirt Bagz rack system for the older subframe ('02~'03 or '04) and mount that to the new ProMoto rear rack. The Dirt Bagz supports mount to the lower subframe bolt and include longer bolts. (You can get a longer cap screw like the stocker at a hardware store.) This Dirt Bagz mounting system holds the panners away from the wheel, pipe and up some. This system has worked great for me in the past. You can also put the MiniBeta Wolfman bag on top of this, back on the seat, and really anchor it well.
It does mean you will have to do your leg stretching routines to swing your booted foot over the rear rack, if you are a shorter guy, like me.

For a RTW trip the 6.6 gallon tank (6.3 as you note in your installation suggestions) would be similar to the LC4 Adventure setup. You would not have to fill it for known distances, but for the unknown it would give you about 200-225 miles (figuring 35 mpg).

Stu
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Old 02-12-2007, 08:26 AM   #86
Stu
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flux_capacitor
I agree with Stu about the subframe....I don't really worry too much about it. As you can see, the Wolfman bag sits halfway on the back end of the seat...I tend to pack the heavier items on the seat side, and the lighter items towards the rear fender. I too have been involved with a few wrecks that should have damaged the subframe, but hasn't. Hell, I flipped my bike once and it landed completely upside down, resting on the handlebars. THAT was fun!
I caught a trailing vine once that was about 1 1/2" thick by the handlebar that flipped me upside down at speed and the bike and I slid down the hill we were descending side by side with it coming to rest, upside down, next to me. I gave my poor old 250 a little hug before putting her back on her wheels.

Stu
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Old 02-12-2007, 09:17 AM   #87
vuugti
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Your test run will answer a lot of your questions.

I'll send a pic of my setup as it currently exists.

1. The eletrosport stator is supposedly good for 270 watts, this also replaces your wiring harness - (weak link).

2. I'm with the other guys here; I don't see a need to beef up the subframe. Hell anyone can weld aluminum (if needed), even in the middle of nowhere. Disconnect battery first.

Link to rear bag - http://www.wolfmanluggage.com/Expedi...xpRearBag.html
Link to tank bag - http://www.wolfmanluggage.com/Expedi...xpTankBag.html

Each are waterproof, no cover BS.

3. No need to change seat pan with Acerbis 6.6 tank. I have one. Fits perfect.

4. Use cush drive wheel from 05' Adventure, fits perfect. I have one. $650 US...need the number of the dealer, I'll give it to you. Unless you're some super dakar/baja stud I don't foresee bending the stock rim (Behr). FWIW the cush drive is cheaper than a tranny and more convienent in the middle of nowhere.

5. Buy the expensive parts used.....new Scotts dampners routinely go for $250 on eBay. Your exchange rate will kill the price.

6. I have heavier fork springs for the tank. Full fuel load didn't change a thing other than breaking.

7. Use the clutch lever adjuster for the front brake lever to gain more feel or feel at all.

8. I wouldn't get hung up on oil changes. 1000 mi on one and the oil looks new, kept for 2K.

jimeconomou must have been banned or something as he is no longer a user.

Basically, lots of good info here (site). I'd do you pre-run then hash out the problems.

Need part numbers or any other junk let me know. Pics to follow.

Andy
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Old 02-12-2007, 09:31 AM   #88
Stu
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Cush Drive

Vuugti,
I have an '06 wheel laced to a dirt star rim (tougher than Behr) with the '06 backing plate. The sprocket and rotor align correctly but the sprocket carrier backing plate does not go into the wheel by about 7~8 mm and that is the exact amount that the width of the complete unit with spacers is too wide.
Can you send me the part numbers for the wheel assembly, the backing plate assembly and tell me if the external spacers have a shoulder on them that are about 10mm thick? The internal spacer's shoulder in the wheel on the sprocket side should be about 1.5mm thick. So far as I can tell there is only one cush rubber insert ever made for the various combinations so that should not be where the extra width comes from. There may be a change from the '05 wheel assembly to the '06.
Thanks!
Stu
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Old 02-12-2007, 12:35 PM   #89
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This link might be of value to this thread. While it is a Dakar prep of a 525EX, many of the upgrades should be of interest.

http://24.240.192.148/prepbike.htm

DW
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Old 02-12-2007, 01:55 PM   #90
Gumbydave
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I just started plans today on my RFS/AFS(adventure four stroke) conversion. I have been wanting to do this for years. I hope to have it done by May 07
--------------------------
1. start with a street plated 525 XC (not exc)
2. install custom trans mod, exc 1st & 2nd, keep the MXC close ratio mid gears and lower 6th to pull the 15/42 final drive
3.install stroker crank and 540 cyl
4. build low pipe along frame to a stock exc muffler
5.build skid plate to cover all
6.install the acerbis 25 liter tank
7. build a carbon/kevlar dakar cowl w/2 baja designs stock style headlight reflectors, use the black SM front high fender
8.install trail tech Lynx vapor instrumentation
9. HT oil cooler
10.evans coolant and ktm fan, hardparts radiator guards
11.trail tech rewound stator and rare earth magnet +7 oz flywheel
12.Osram HID headlights hi/low and LED tail and turns
13. aluminum splinted subframe with soft steel rack and panier mounts with bolt-on segments similar to the 950 design, to allow option for soft panniers or pelicans and easily bent back in event of an incident
14 suspension set-up with scotts UBM and subtanks to compensate for the heavier mid valve settings

possible options to consider:
Wider rear rim and TKC 80
Tire balls or mousse insert in front tire
Heavier spokes and DID heavy duty rims
Custom heavy duty high volume radiators
Possibly use a 640 or 950 adventure cowl to hack up to start making the CF/kevlar cowl.
Posibly use the 950 adventure windscreen (for availability)
Possibly an aluminum tool kit on the right side of the engine where the pipe was
Trail tech helmet lights( in adition to the hi/lo fairing mount HIDs) with heavy duty hook/loop mounting to the fairing wired with release plug for instant quick change from fairing use to helmet use location
Cordless drill converted into a quick mount winch
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