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Old 01-24-2013, 06:44 PM   #5971
NJ-Brett
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I think having more aggressive dual sport tires on a bike takes some power away, but the big thing is wind drag.
One of the road tests of the TU noted that the top speed went up 7 mph by tucking in.

The TU is supposed to have about 18 hp, but its a very broad power curve which helps a lot, and it was new bikes they tested on the dyno, and for whatever reason, the TU really seems to increase in power after it breaks in. You can really feel the difference. I ran a non o ring chain for a while as an experiment and felt a difference, but the chain seemed to wear fairly fast.
I think you notice even small changes in power on small bikes much more then larger bikes.
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Old 01-25-2013, 03:30 AM   #5972
Sierra Thumper
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Originally Posted by ALinUTAH View Post
I actually think it's the other way around. If you lose 20% off of 16hp you barely have enough to get out of your own way. If you lose 20% from 100hp you still have 80 which is plenty.

The problem I have is that I am up and down so much in a single ride. In a single trip I can be in 10k ft mtns and down to the desert at 4k. What I was doing end of last season was running a #30 main jet (2 sizes down from the stock 35) which feels about right at southern desert elevations with the airbox closed up, then opening the airbox when in the mountains. It's relatively easy to open/close, giving me two different intake settings. If I wanted to open the airbox and tune for highway performance, I would have to jet up and then I'd have a dog in the mountains. So I just avoid highways where 60mph isn't fast enough. That's half the fun of touring on a little bike anyway, going out of your way to stay off the beaten path. I didn't buy this bike for the highway. -al
Quote:
Originally Posted by NJ-Brett View Post
I think having more aggressive dual sport tires on a bike takes some power away, but the big thing is wind drag.
One of the road tests of the TU noted that the top speed went up 7 mph by tucking in.

The TU is supposed to have about 18 hp, but its a very broad power curve which helps a lot, and it was new bikes they tested on the dyno, and for whatever reason, the TU really seems to increase in power after it breaks in. You can really feel the difference. I ran a non o ring chain for a while as an experiment and felt a difference, but the chain seemed to wear fairly fast.
I think you notice even small changes in power on small bikes much more then larger bikes.
I prolly should have been clearer.....I meant with a low power dual sport thats not intended for big acceleration to begin with, but just tractoring around off-road, I don't miss the power like I do on my 170hp hayabusa, where the major reason I own it IS for the extreme acceleration and power. In that situation I do miss the 26hp I lose...not because I need it, but because I want it
144hp does just fine at motivating the bike, but after coming back up from sea level, it just feels slow...which isn't why I bought it

2 different bikes with 2 different purposes, one based on power being the last priority, the other one having power as the first priority
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Old 01-25-2013, 05:49 AM   #5973
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Originally Posted by SIKLR250 View Post
Welcome to the Minimalist Touring Thread:
...

Please introduce yourself and tell us about your bike and your travels.
First I'd like to thank Honda for issuing the CRF250L model

I had a "bike life" since i was 14, mx, dual-sport and street bikes, more and more powerful as i was aging until i became a true speed junkie. Then i became father and a survival instinct came on that made me switch into offroad 4 wheelers as a less risky hobby.

20 years laters (last july), i did enter a Honda dealer to have a look on the scooters, as an alternate vehicule to commute aroud getting rid of traffic jams. Then i saw the CRFL and i knew it was her i wanted. Excellent choice for getting me back on bikes at 53, conveniant for my first purpose witch was city traffic, with the fun of off-road as bonus.

The problem is now i'm used to it, i'm everyday more frustrated in the fun factor by the lack of power/acceleration. This remains the last legal "drug" we have, after all (sex & rock'n'roll dont count here), and when one need more and more of it, "250 and under" can soon become a bit frustrating. I know i dont need a bigger one for what im doing with, but i cant help thinking about and lurking 500 EXC and similars. I just dont know what to do ... brain against heart fighting now.

Well ... a small motorcycle would at least had the merit to get me back on the saddle

L
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Old 01-25-2013, 06:50 AM   #5974
NJ-Brett
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I am about the same age, started the same time as you, but never gave it up, just did not ride as much after marrage.

I find it the other way around, bigger more powerful bikes are boring on the street, and will hurt you in the dirt.
Its not like you can use a fast street bike around here, and its a lot more fun to ride a small under powered light bike like a mad man, then it is to loaf along on a big bike.
Light, nimble, fun, feels very fast at 70 mph, evey ride can be a road race.

Power in the dirt is fine, as long as it does not add weight.
At 54, a fall the wrong way on a tall heavy bike can end up in a hospital stay.

And when I tried a friends xt225 I thought it was so small and light, it was a hoot in the rough stuff.
I think some KTM's would be a REAL hoot, but would likely get me in trouble again with the speeds you can hit in the rough stuff.

Out west, a bigger bike is likely called for with all that wide open space, but on the East coast, smaller bikes can do and may be more fun.






Quote:
Originally Posted by Krono View Post
First I'd like to thank Honda for issuing the CRF250L model

I had a "bike life" since i was 14, mx, dual-sport and street bikes, more and more powerful as i was aging until i became a true speed junkie. Then i became father and a survival instinct came on that made me switch into offroad 4 wheelers as a less risky hobby.

The problem is now i'm used to it, i'm everyday more frustrated in the fun factor by the lack of power/acceleration. This remains the last legal "drug" we have, after all (sex & rock'n'roll dont count here), and when one need more and more of it, "250 and under" can soon become a bit frustrating. I know i dont need a bigger one for what im doing with, but i cant help thinking about and lurking 500 EXC and similars. I just dont know what to do ... brain against heart fighting now.

Well ... a small motorcycle would at least had the merit to get me back on the saddle

L
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Old 01-25-2013, 07:28 AM   #5975
GlennR
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Krono View Post
First I'd like to thank Honda for issuing the CRF250L model

I had a "bike life" since i was 14, mx, dual-sport and street bikes, more and more powerful as i was aging until i became a true speed junkie. Then i became father and a survival instinct came on that made me switch into offroad 4 wheelers as a less risky hobby.

20 years laters (last july), i did enter a Honda dealer to have a look on the scooters, as an alternate vehicule to commute aroud getting rid of traffic jams. Then i saw the CRFL and i knew it was her i wanted. Excellent choice for getting me back on bikes at 53, conveniant for my first purpose witch was city traffic, with the fun of off-road as bonus.

The problem is now i'm used to it, i'm everyday more frustrated in the fun factor by the lack of power/acceleration. This remains the last legal "drug" we have, after all (sex & rock'n'roll dont count here), and when one need more and more of it, "250 and under" can soon become a bit frustrating. I know i dont need a bigger one for what im doing with, but i cant help thinking about and lurking 500 EXC and similars. I just dont know what to do ... brain against heart fighting now.

Well ... a small motorcycle would at least had the merit to get me back on the saddle

L
If you can afford to own 2 bikes at the same time, I'd recommend you to go ahead and buy a more powerful dual sport & see how you like it. If you buy used at a good price you can always sell it wihout loosing money. You aren't getting any younger, and you will regret never trying one if you don't.
That being said, I have a Yamaha XT225 and a Yamaha WR450F, that's been converted to be street legal. I love both of them, and am lucky that I can afford to keep them both. The 450 has so much power & is a rush to ride, but I often find myself being drawn to riding the 225 because it's so easy & user friendly. I keep knobbies on the 450 & reserve it for 90% off-road riding. Btw, I'd shop for an older KTM if you want to try one. The WR450 only has a 5 speed tranny, and is a bit heavier. Avoid the Suzuki DRZ400, because they're heavy & under powered. I found the WR450 at a good price

It is a blast to ride a dual sport that has enough power to raise the front end just by twisting the throttle, in the first 4 gears!

But this thread is about small bikes, and I love riding small displacement bikes. I'll eventually sell off my bigger bikes, but I'll probably keep the 225 til I'm old & crippled....or dead. Every time I ride it I feel like I'm 15 again.
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Old 01-25-2013, 07:36 AM   #5976
SAPB
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Originally Posted by GlennR View Post
If you can afford to own 2 bikes at the same time, I'd recommend you to go ahead and buy a more powerful dual sport & see how you like it. If you buy used at a good price you can always sell it wihout loosing money. You aren't getting any younger, and you will regret never trying one if you don't.
That being said, I have a Yamaha XT225 and a Yamaha WR450F, that's been converted to be street legal. I love both of them, and am lucky that I can afford to keep them both. The 450 has so much power & is a rush to ride, but I often find myself being drawn to riding the 225 because it's so easy & user friendly. I keep knobbies on the 450 & reserve it for 90% off-road riding. Btw, I'd shop for an older KTM if you want to try one. The WR450 only has a 5 speed tranny, and is a bit heavier. Avoid the Suzuki DRZ400, because they're heavy & under powered. I found the WR450 at a good price

It is a blast to ride a dual sport that has enough power to raise the front end just by twisting the throttle, in the first 4 gears!

But this thread is about small bikes, and I love riding small displacement bikes. I'll eventually sell off my bigger bikes, but I'll probably keep the 225 til I'm old & crippled....or dead. Every time I ride it I feel like I'm 15 again.
Riding the 250 always puts a smile on my face, just not a the temperatures we've been experiencing here lately. I think it's suppose to be up in the 40's next week, high temp today is 27, up from the morning low of 6.
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Old 01-25-2013, 07:42 AM   #5977
Krono
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Thanks for your kind answer Brett

Quote:
Originally Posted by NJ-Brett View Post
....
Light, nimble, fun, feels very fast at 70 mph, evey ride can be a road race.

...
... just what i meant : always on the throttle. Im feeling dumb sometimes

More cavalery under my butt would make my driving more zen


Quote:
Originally Posted by NJ-Brett View Post
...
At 54, a fall the wrong way on a tall heavy bike can end up in a hospital stay.

...
Out west, a bigger bike is likely called for with all that wide open space, but on the East coast, smaller bikes can do and may be more fun.
Same here, and what my logic says. I'll stick with my 250 for the moment (at last until spring )

L
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Old 01-25-2013, 07:50 AM   #5978
Krono
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GlennR View Post
...
It is a blast to ride a dual sport that has enough power to raise the front end just by twisting the throttle, in the first 4 gears!

....
Yesssssssss !!!
The only lacking of my bike, otherwise its perfect

L
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Old 01-27-2013, 08:21 PM   #5979
Nevada
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NJ-Brett View Post
On the street, people seem to think they need huge motors, otherwise they might have to downshift to pass or go up a hill, and that just won't do.
So they ride a 600 pound bike that gets 40 mpg and costs more then most cars.
They have CB's, audio systems, abs, traction control, heated grips, power windshields, cup holders, cruise control, a trunk, gps, and who knows what else.
Not a lot of bikes have much of that stuff, even fewer have all of it. And yet, sometimes, it's absolutely necessary. Well, not necessarily the CB, audio system, etc, etc. But the power? yes. There are quite simply some places and situations where it's necessary.

Running down the interstate into a 30+ mph headwind. "Oh, take secondary roads" you say? Well, there are times and places without practical secondary roads. I had a Honda GL500, twice the displacement of this thread, and the only way I could keep from getting run over by the semi-s (which were moving slower than the cars) was to draft 'em. Now, I realize that where most folks in the US live, as well as pretty much all of Europe, don't have these challenges, but just as y'all are right to say that there's a lot more that can be done with small displacement bikes than most First Worlder's will credit, there's also some real world situations where they flat out don't cut it, situations that cannot always be avoided.

************************************************** *********
Now, moving to a second topic, I see very little description of what people are actually carrying, or how they're carrying. There's a 250 DS (WR250R or CRF250L) in my near future, and I'm looking for ideas and a sense of the limitations I'll be facing. It'll take some rethinking from my "other" ride, an ST1300 w/ a trailer.
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Old 01-27-2013, 09:14 PM   #5980
sandalscout
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nevada View Post
Now, moving to a second topic, I see very little description of what people are actually carrying, or how they're carrying. There's a 250 DS (WR250R or CRF250L) in my near future, and I'm looking for ideas and a sense of the limitations I'll be facing. It'll take some rethinking from my "other" ride, an ST1300 w/ a trailer.
I travel VERY light, in my opinion. I came from a hiking/backpacking background, and travel really light when hiking, on vacation, etc anyway, so I don't need much stuff. While I don't have a 250cc bike anymore, I still have and use the luggage I used on my 250, both on rental bikes and on my 650 now.

For a typical 5-7 day trip, I used a Giant Loop Diablo tank bag, Giant Loop Coyote saddle bag, and a 25 liter backpack (which is rarely full).

When travelling out of the country and renting a bike, I will use all three bags to carry my gear for a week, clothes (cargo pants, 2 shirts, 2 pairs of socks, , electronics usually limited to my phone, a usb powerhouse or two, nook e-reader, ipod, GPS, SPOT, water bottle, tennis shoes, maps, UV sterilizer, tools, spare tubes, etc. I usually get a day or two out of each shirt, and I do laundry in the sink as needed. It's "roughing it" for some, but the places I like to visit, I get by just fine. I imagine the only places anyone has a problem is in the airports back on US soil on the way home.

I have a tool tube and a small fender tube pack, and on my KLR I have a very small pelican-style case on the rear rack. This allows me to free up room in the backpack and coyote, plus I don't have to carry the UV pen, etc. What I carry in the new spaces is my hammock, small tarp, air mattress, etc.

It works very well for me, but no doubt some would want more.
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Old 01-27-2013, 09:38 PM   #5981
godwinmt
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nevada View Post
Now, moving to a second topic, I see very little description of what people are actually carrying, or how they're carrying. There's a 250 DS (WR250R or CRF250L) in my near future, and I'm looking for ideas and a sense of the limitations I'll be facing. It'll take some rethinking from my "other" ride, an ST1300 w/ a trailer.
Bigdog put together a nice video a bit ago showing exactly where/what he carries on his WR. He packs light, but comfortable.

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Old 01-28-2013, 07:49 AM   #5982
SAPB
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[QUOTE=godwinmt;20590684]Bigdog put together a nice video a bit ago showing exactly where/what he carries on his WR. He packs light, but comfortable.

Excellent! I look a lot over here, and don't post much, but just had to be on page 400.
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Old 01-28-2013, 09:49 AM   #5983
ALinUTAH
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Wow, if you tow a trailer, you definitely need an adjustment.

I'm a backpacker too, and I pack the same way on the mighty 250. All you really need is the stuff to sleep warm and dry and be on your way in the morning. That really isnt much. Wolfman expedition bags (19L) on a happy trail rack, gas and tent strapped onto the tail. One change of clothes (do some laundry after several days) and some light shoes or sandals, sleeping bag and big Agnes inflatable pad, my kitchen is a 1qt coffee pot with an alcohol stove inside, food is mountain house dehydrated plus granola bars, dried fruit and jerky. I don't carry food for the whole trip, I grab a meal here and there and buy some groceries now and then. Tent is a 3-man backpacking palace right now, Im thinking about getting a solo tent. Also a 3L camelback on my back. I usually carry an extra quart of water in the saddlebags. The camping gear weighs around 35 to 40 lbs, plus gas and tools. Oh, and I have a small tank bag. Al

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Old 01-28-2013, 10:52 AM   #5984
Nevada
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Originally Posted by GlennR View Post
It's really hard to complain about the lack of quality when we live in a country that doesn't manufacture anything anymore.
Riiiight.....

We don't manufacture:
Airliners
Boats
Locomotives
Cars
Trucks
Cookware
Handtools
Computer chips
...

I could go on, and on, and on. With the exception of consumer electronics and kitchen gadgets, I can't think of ANYTHING that we "don't manufacture" anymore.

Oh, and we do manufacture motorcycles as well..... the ones built here may not be to your taste, but we build 'em.
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Old 01-28-2013, 11:00 AM   #5985
Nevada
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Originally Posted by ALinUTAH View Post
Wow, if you tow a trailer, you definitely need an adjustment.

I'm a backpacker too, and I pack the same way on the mighty 250. All you really need is the stuff to sleep warm and dry and be on your way in the morning. That really isnt much. Wolfman expedition bags (19L) on a happy trail rack, gas and tent strapped onto the tail. One change of clothes (do some laundry after several days) and some light shoes or sandals, sleeping bag and big Agnes inflatable pad, my kitchen is a 1qt coffee pot with an alcohol stove inside, food is mountain house dehydrated plus granola bars, dried fruit and jerky. I don't carry food for the whole trip, I grab a meal here and there and buy some groceries now and then. Tent is a 3-man backpacking palace right now, Im thinking about getting a solo tent. Also a 3L camelback on my back. I usually carry an extra quart of water in the saddlebags. The camping gear weighs around 35 to 40 lbs, plus gas and tools. Oh, and I have a small tank bag. Al

Oh, I don't pull the trailer all the time. I've done 2-5 day trips with nothing more than a side bags. The trailer is most useful for extended trips that combine my interests (it's pretty hard to carry 200 pieces of N scale rolling stock on a WR), rolling two-up while camping, grocery shopping, and just having a really convenient place to toss my riding gear when I get somewhere. Thanks folks, I'll take a look at Big Dog's vid.
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