Dirt Bike History 101

[TimberlineAdventure]

Originally Posted by roadholder

I suspect that back in in the 70's some old codgers were also saying the same thing about the "current" generation of dirt bikes versus the previous era.
Thing is...they might have been right too!

Attachment 160323

You may be right... now that is a dirt bike..

[nachtflug]

Originally Posted by vintagemxr

"A dirtbike for adults probably should have an aluminum tank." I love that line!



Doug

well I'm going against the grain because today I bought a 2008 Yamaha WR250R.

Here is what I get. Fuel injection. 6 speed. 24K valve service intervals. STREET LEGAL!! Very respectable suspension. wave rotors. etc etc.

did I mention STREET LEGAL!!!

and to tell you the truth I can't even figure out which part is actually the gas tank.

pick it up this thursday. gottal love 0 down 60 month financing.

[Stagehand]

Originally Posted by nachtflug

well I'm going against the grain because today I bought a 2008 Yamaha WR250R.

Here is what I get. Fuel injection. 6 speed. 24K valve service intervals. STREET LEGAL!! Very respectable suspension. wave rotors. etc etc.

did I mention STREET LEGAL!!!

and to tell you the truth I can't even figure out which part is actually the gas tank.

pick it up this thursday. gottal love 0 down 60 month financing.

I know a PERFECT place to run it through the paces

[ChopSuey]

Originally Posted by nachtflug

well I'm going against the grain because today I bought a 2008 Yamaha WR250R.

Here is what I get. Fuel injection. 6 speed. 24K valve service intervals. STREET LEGAL!! Very respectable suspension. wave rotors. etc etc.

did I mention STREET LEGAL!!!

and to tell you the truth I can't even figure out which part is actually the gas tank.

pick it up this thursday. gottal love 0 down 60 month financing.

Wow, that's a pretty darn nice bike! Good job. Personally, I like my street legal Italian Husky. But everyone knows the Italian made Huskys aren't real Huskys.

[305racer]

Originally Posted by nachtflug

well I'm going against the grain because today I bought a 2008 Yamaha WR250R.

Here is what I get. Fuel injection. 6 speed. 24K valve service intervals. STREET LEGAL!! Very respectable suspension. wave rotors. etc etc.

did I mention STREET LEGAL!!!

and to tell you the truth I can't even figure out which part is actually the gas tank.

pick it up this thursday. gottal love 0 down 60 month financing.

I thought you were gonna buy a BMW

[Sal Paradise]

Originally Posted by ChopSuey

Any idea what head configuration this is called? I've now heard about the porcupine and sunburst. Is this a variation of the sunburst maybe or is it a sunburst? Thanks!

Thats a 74.5 GP 400 Maico, this was the radial era. late 72 to 76 (in 76 the cylinder was basically the same except fins were cut at the back.) This is the same basic head as the CZ one above. Just called radial or sunburst.

[vintagemxr]

Originally Posted by ChopSuey

Are these the ones? Pursang 1968 MK3 250 and 1968 MK4 250?

Yup, those are the models give or take a little. The styling was evolutionary and probably from the Rickman's Bro's orginal stuff. Don and Derrick Rickman raced Bultaco's (I'm a little fuzzy on that but I think one or both of them road for the factory) and it's said that Sr. Bulto looked upon the Rickman brothers with the highest regard. I think if you look at the general lines of today's rather industrial looking moto-appliances you'll see that the look is in fact decendent or maybe devolutionary from the M48 Bultaco.

I had a Model 68 for a while but as sometimes happens in life, I had more motorcycles at one point than money to pay bills and so the M68 wound up leaving. You'll find the Bultaco geeks will refer to the bikes as M68 or M30 or M-whatever because Bultaco tended to let models drift across more than one model year so the best way to tell one from another is by the VIN which would start with M and then the model designation Bultaco gave the bike. I have an M30 engine restored and sitting in my living room.

As Nachtflug noted (and paid for), a modern bike is miles ahead of the old iron in functionality and usability. But it's the old bikes up through the mid-70's that will always be valued for their classic lines and surfaces as the decades roll by. I believe the advent of long travel suspension brought an ungainly appearance and proportion to dirtbikes that cannot be overcome with styling tricks. Function wins races though and racing is about winning.

Doug

[FR700]

[ChopSuey]

As if he needed any encouragement, I've gotten my husband interested in looking at the older bikes and he found this one currently on fleabay:

"1974 Suzuki TM 400 Engine # TM400-40239, Steering Head Label # - 40254, Engine # TM 40254.

I have been riding dirt bikes for 41 years. This bike is the nicest 70's Suzuki dirt bike I have ever seen!

Bike was purchased from the original owner 6 yrs. ago ( a gentleman in his early 70's) I have had it on display in my garage for the last 2 yrs. I estimate this bike has 3 - 5 hrs. use since new. This is not a nuts and bolts restoration, (no engine removal, no frame, seat, hub, or swingarm repainting - I touched-up frame in one spot by rear fender) I took off seat, side panels, exhaust, etc. to take better pictures of the "insides" of bike. When the winning bidder see's this bike they will not believe its original condition! I started bike 4 times this Wednesday - first kick all 4 times. Bike runs, shifts, and rides like new.

Bike Details
New Dunlop tires w/Moose Heavy Duty Tubes (original tires showed little wear - but were checked)

Sprockets & Chain are the originals (can see wear on rear sprocket if you use magnification) Front sprocket looks like new. NOS bolt locks installed.
Checked engine compression on Wednesday - 150 to 155 PSI
Remove cylinder head to look at bore - clean, shows no wear.
Removed exhaust pipe - exhaust gasket at head was not discolored.
Yes, those are the original side panels & decals!
Gas tank is shiny inside. Decals on tank have a few scraped areas. Gas cap and decals are original.
I installed a new gas petcock - the original is included w/bike. It had a piece of wire around it - dont know why.
Gas line, bolt that mount the silencer bracket to frame, and engine hex bolts are not original.
Handlebars, grips, levers, front & rear brake cables are original (not even a scuff on either brake cable)
Clutch "snaps" just like new.
Fork seals are original and do not leak! Shocks do not leak.
Front and rear fenders are new (the originals were excellent, but each had a white crease in them.)
The front half of the rear fender and the mud flap are the originals and they still look like new (see photo shot down thru frame)
The underside of seat (see photo) was not painted!. I just wiped it clean.
Forks have new Maxima 10w Fork Oil. See photo of original oil I drained out - looks almost as clean as the new oil.
Transmission has new Golden Spectro 75-80 gear oil.
Oil injection tank has Klotz Techniplate synthetic oil.
Oil injection system works like new.
Carb is clean inside and out. Carb slide shows no wear.
Air cleaner housing was not painted! Just wiped clean. New Twin Air filter installed
Both rims roll very true. Most spokes are tarnished Rims have a couple tiny scratches and no nicks.
I never looked at the brakes, bike stops very well.
Exhaust is very good condition, had some small dents repaired w/All-metal. Exhaust springs are NOS, originals were discolored.
Silencer is excellent with 1 small dent.
Service Manual goes w/bike

The negative things are: Left side of handlebars are slightly tweeked. Left side of gas tank has a smooth dent (no scuffs or scrapes in dent) probably was dented by someones knee. Very difficult to see - I had bike a month before I noticed it. Ends of both levers have scrapes in the coating, decals on right side of tank are scraped. Cover on cross-bar does not go with bike.
I am sure I forgot many things - just tried to be as accurate as possible with description. This is a no-reserve auction. Please do not ask if there is a buy-it now price. Bike sold with a bill of sale only and it is sold as-is. I will not accept bids outside the United States and Canada. I can hold bike for awhile if need be. I will require a 200.00 down payment minimum -or 10% of sale price. I can deliver up to 500 miles from home -ask for a delivery quote if interested. Only trade I would be interested in is a partial trade for an RD Yamaha or a H1 or H2 Kawaski in need of restoration. Thanks for looking and bidding."



Since I work in Petoskey, I might try and take a look at this bike.

[ChopSuey]

Originally Posted by onanysunday

Thats a 74.5 GP 400 Maico, this was the radial era. late 72 to 76 (in 76 the cylinder was basically the same except fins were cut at the back.) This is the same basic head as the CZ one above. Just called radial or sunburst.

Thanks oas! So is that it for different looking cylinder heads? The porcupine is pretty bizzare looking for sure. What was the purpose of designs like this? Air flow? Slicing someone's leg off?

And just out of curiosity, how did you know that the bike I posted was a 74.5 GP 400 Maico? Do you have them all memorized? Do you have books or links with all models? And I still have a hard time believing that you're only 18!!

[ChopSuey]

Originally Posted by TLtrials

I was thumbing around in my photo files today and ran across some shots from Mid-Ohio in 2005:

Shots from the AMA Motocross America Opening night:

Cool pictures TLtrials! Do you know what model the Suzuki is (RH67 maybe)? Same for Lackey's bike RM250 - what year?

[ChopSuey]

Originally Posted by ChopSuey

Five bucks says the Elsinore brings more than the YZ250.

Edit? YZ360, not 250 dummy.

Well poop. The auction for the Elsinore ended early. He probably got an offer he couldn't refuse, but I still loose, dammit.

[ChopSuey]

Originally Posted by Strong Bad

I stumbled across this site this afternoon:

http://www.vintagefactory.com/Vintage%20Tests.htm

That is a good link Strong Bad, thanks! I had a couple of emails back and forth with Rick Sieman after I finished reading Monkey Butt in in response to my question about further reading, he suggested trying to get ahold of old copies of dirt bike magazines. He was right, there's a treasure trove of information and some of it can be found online. Those old magazines sure do go for a pretty penny though.

[OaklandStrom]

I can't seem to find a picture of it, but I have my grandfather's '68 DT-1. It has 3,600 miles, and is 100% original - including tires. I had to clean the tank to get it to run, but I rode it out in the desert a few years ago.

I'm not really sure what to do with it. Currently, it's in Oregon, and I'm in the Bay Area. There's no reason to bring it here.

Originally Posted by TimberlineAdventure

I have posted this before in a two stoke thread, but thought that you may get a kick out of it..... Although, this bike is an enduro, it certainly was a major part of the Dirt Bike History. This is my 1972 DT250, the picture was taken last week, it is bone stock, still on the same bore with about 2,200 miles. Used to be my grandfathers..... This is a FANTASTIC thread !!

[dan-c]

Originally Posted by Tackett

I can't seem to find a picture of it, but I have my grandfather's '68 DT-1. It has 3,600 miles, and is 100% original - including tires. I had to clean the tank to get it to run, but I rode it out in the desert a few years ago.

I'm not really sure what to do with it. Currently, it's in Oregon, and I'm in the Bay Area. There's no reason to bring it here.

'68 is the first year of the Japanese Dirt Bike (non high pipe scrambler) invasion. The '68 is the first year DT-1. It is a collector for sure and they ain't making anymore of 'em. Keep it and ride it on occasion