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Old 02-22-2015, 01:54 AM   #1
wrecklessrobbie OP
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Hello......and information and help required

Hello
I have just joined this site.
I am called robbie ( in case you had guessed from my user name).
I live in the UK in the city of York, which is more or less give a little bit in the centre of the UK.
Over the years i have had various scooters... Mainly vespas and lambretta 2 strokes. I have a zr7s and two lambrettas at the moment.

I have just purchased a canadian import into the Uk...a honda elite 150.
It has done 7000 miles or so (thats if the speedo is correct and working).
It has not been run for many years apparently. I bought it as i wanted a challenge. I know nothing about these scooters. In the uk they were honda spacy's i believe.
I have read a thread on here about the elite.
Yesterday i bought a new battery. I fitted it. All the lights came on and indicators and horn worked. The indicators would not flash and the rear brake light worked.
When i tried to start the scooter by pressing the start button all the lights dimmed as they appear to be on permanently.
The starter motor made no sound whatsoever.
What should i do next? I would like to get it running or at least see if it will attempt to turn over and fire before i attempt a total refurbishment.

Any advice gratefully accepted
Robbie
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Old 02-22-2015, 02:57 AM   #2
TheNorthernMonkey
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Is the new battery fully charged? It doesn't sound like it is.
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Old 02-22-2015, 03:12 AM   #3
syncro87
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Could be a faulty starter solenoid, or worst case, piston is seized in the cylinder. I would remove the spark plug and see if you can turn the engine over manually to determine if the piston moves or is frozen in place. Also, check the small stuff such as battery being fully charged, electrical connections clean and tight, etc.

I would want to know if first I have power, then do I have power making it to the starter.

Its usually more likely its something small versus something catastrophic. But anything is possible if its an older machine that hasn't run in a long time.
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Old 02-22-2015, 05:57 AM   #4
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Change the oil, try to turn the engine over manually, check for spark.. That's where I'd probably start off.

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Old 02-22-2015, 08:49 AM   #5
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A little bit of silicone spray or WD40 down the plug hole might help the motor to turn over. Allowing a couple of hours for the spray to seep into the rings and free them up is helpful. Simply putting in a new battery and attempting to crank on a motor that has sat for a few years isn't the best idea - patience will be rewarded. As mentioned above an oil change should be among the first things you. More than likely the carb will need rebuilding unless someone had the presence of mind to drain all the gas prior to storing it.
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Old 02-22-2015, 06:04 PM   #6
wrecklessrobbie OP
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Thanks guys
Yeah i know patience is a virtue.
I went back to the scooter today.
After pressing the rear footbrake down hard and holding it the starter motor fired up.
I left it at that. My next task is to clean the carb and drain the petrol tank.

I shall change the oil and spray wd40 into the cylinder.

I will let you know how i get on. :)

Robbie
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Old 02-23-2015, 12:13 AM   #7
fullmetalscooter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wrecklessrobbie View Post
Thanks guys
Yeah i know patience is a virtue.
I went back to the scooter today.
After pressing the rear foot brake down hard and holding it the starter motor fired up.
I left it at that. My next task is to clean the carb and drain the petrol tank.

I shall change the oil and spray wd40 into the cylinder.

I will let you know how i get on. :)

Robbie
Will robbie almost all honda have brake cut outs switches . I thinking that the one that is attached to the foot brake need engesting . To start most scooters you have to hold the brake on ether at the foot or handle bars. Rather then spray Wd40 into the cylinder just inject some reg oil down it . some people just use a needle to do that . The reason is that any bike that sat for awhile has no oil in the cylinder which mean during the first 10 sec there no lub which isnt a good thing. Always oil just burns off.

1) check fuel lines due to age and replace with standard bulk auto fuil lines.
2) Check air cleaner is still good. I guess ebay, honda or david sliver spares will sell you a new one. Do a quick visual check of wiring to see that there no issues.
3) new spark plug .
4) Take off all the cables . Clean and lube them. It's not like you can buy them over there I m guessing but whom knows.
5) Check date code on the tires and replace if 4 years old. Google if you don't know how to read it
6) If the black panels are fading use something like back to black to restore them
7) Doing the carb and tank cleaning. Don't run it with ethanol based fuels since it eats up old rubber gaskets including the ones in fuel pumps and carbs. Not good for oil bikes per 1990 or so.
8) does the pop up light work or not? Guys what the fix I forgot if it doesn't ? It's not that hard to do.
LInk for info and oem service manual. http://www.motorscooterguide.net/Hon.../Elite150.html
9) Check the drive belt isn't cracked from age
10) if it starting and runing then also check the vavlue are adjusted right. Youtube has videos that show how to do that if you don't know. The elite ch150 is a tough scooter and many rusted up ch150 have been brought back to life with some THC Woops that pot I mean TLC. 2 Things the do go wrong and can be blamed for rough running are the Carbs bystarter and the CDI failing. The bystarter going often mean it starts Runs and runs rough . often dies out when. CDi going means that it runs for a while and randomly dies . Will start up sooner or latter. The parts are 10 to 30 bucks off ebay.
Once it going you find you get around 75 Mpg and it goes about 55 MPH give or take. Good for your B roads or city etc.
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Old 02-23-2015, 12:48 PM   #8
wrecklessrobbie OP
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Hi
great to get so many replies.
I removed the spark plug today.....a problem in itself. I have two socket sets and the spark plug sockets are 17mm and 21mm. The one I removed is between 17 and 18. Glad I had some extension sockets.
I poured some oil in.left it and tried the starter. The piston was moving. Well I presume it was as I was leaning over the scooter and oil squirted out of the cylinder head.....I think I look good with slick backed hair :)
Hopefully I haven't damaged the rings and piston or cylinder bore by trying it the other day with out lubrication...time will tell.
Whilst the plug was out I ground it onto the frame. It had oil on the end, but was giving a spark. An orange spark. I suspect I need a blue spark.
I couldn't smell petrol. I suspect it is not getting through to the cylinder.
If I can work out how to get the carb off I will work on that next.I removed the dip stick and the oil appeared very clear and clean.hopefully a good sign of a looked after engine.
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Old 02-23-2015, 05:22 PM   #9
Wentwest
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The engine will only start with the footbrake pressed down hard. There is no interlock with the front brake.

The fuel line is controlled by a vacuum operated valve. It's under the tank on the right side. If I were you I would look around on the internet for a service manual, and the take off the plastic bodywork around the engine and rear wheel. You can put the seat back on and the lights do not have to be removed. You can ride it safely without the plastic, and you can get into things to adjust them and replace them without so much fuss.

There are a few vacuum lines that are probably cracked. Get new line at a car parts store, and replace them one by one. It's not worth checking if they are bad; just do it.

Change the oil and the coolant. There is oil in a reduction gear case at the rear wheel that never gets checked and is often low or dry. Find it and check it.

Check the tires for age, and check the tire valves, too. They are tubeless tires and if a valve cracks you are going to lose control. Very dangerous; replace them.

There are lots of "tech tips" at a website called www.ch250.net. Your scooter is a 150, but they are very similar and you can use lots of the help you will find there.

A fine machine, well worth your time.
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Old 03-02-2015, 01:00 PM   #10
wrecklessrobbie OP
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Hi guys,
I had an hour or so on my elite today.
I think its an 85 model. It has a headlight on the handlebars not a flip up headlight.
Where do I find the chassis number?

I have downloaded a manual but it is very hard to read and not very clear on the photos. Can anyone suggest a good link to a manual?

How does the fuel system work?
No petrol flowed out of the petcock. When I blew up the pipe leading into the petcock petrol flooded out but then stopped is this normal or am I blowing debris in the tank away from the petcock.I will remove the tank and empty it.

I have removed the carb finally. Lots of pipes on it. Totally different to the two stroke carb on my lambretta. Out of some of the pipes flowed a orangy liquid. Really smelly. Bit like the goo on top of gloss paint before it is mixed. I am presuming the petrol has broken down into constituent parts.

Is it possible to fit a manual choke onto the carb. If so what type? If not us it possible to get a replacement auto choke?

Do I need to prime the carb when I refit it or will it autonatically draw petrol?

Is it still possible to get new carb manifolds?

Robbie
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Old 03-02-2015, 08:20 PM   #11
fullmetalscooter
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Buy the manual off ebay for 30 pounds with shipping . http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_fr...Text=&_sacat=0
that smelly stuff is old gas which mean everything for the gas tank to the carb may be blocked up with ship. You ll have to clean it . Some guys just buy a china replacement carb off ebay 2 along with a non oem cdi . http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Carburetor...item20f4d4d225
For old parts try these guys in the uk the larage old new stock honda parts guys. https://www.davidsilverspares.co.uk/ID-MY-HONDA/
Barring your honda dealer you could buy this one of ebay . Also ask around you city for independant scooter dealer whom deal with china stuff. Bring them you manafold and they might have something that works. Anyone that sell cfmoto 150 scooter stuff should have one that work.s http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Scooter-Mo...item417e9369d5
Don't bother with stock honda manifold it's 40 pounds and thats a rip off. Go with the china clone one for 10 pounds.
Heres the link for the the egine etc diagames online . There one of the uk honda parts dealers . http://www.cmsnl.com/honda-ch150-eli...927/partslist/

For stuff like rollers etc buy china clone stuff because honda wants far to much for parts . One more thing please post pictures because it save time . What you ll call the fuel peacock to me mean a gas tank that has a 3 positions on , off reserve . you on the other hand might just be holding the fuel pump and calling it something else . So post a picture please . I m thinking your holding the fuel pump so yep it only goes one way. Beside with picture more guys get involed in your thread . Used photobuck it's free. .
As to bystarter choke you can buy a china clone part or again just buy the whole new clone carb and be done with it for 35 pounds or less. More then one guy has gone that way and never bitched about it. it's 15 pounds for just the bystarter .
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Old 03-07-2015, 12:14 PM   #12
wrecklessrobbie OP
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Thank you full metal scooter.....some useful links there.I may go for the carb. I will go for a manifold.

I am useless at trying to upload photos of my tablet. I will try.

I stripped the carb. The petrol had evaporated leaving a rock hard covering over all the internals.
The pilot jet took ages to clean. It was completely blocked and took some sorting.
The choke was that glued/gummed up it snapped trying to remove i had to remove the plug with long nose pliers.:(

I removed the petrol tank and valve (petcock). I flushed the filter and refueled.

The engine started, I ran it on tick over for 30 mins or so.
It ran fine. Everyonce in a while the revs started to creep up. I am presuming this is due to the choke not working.
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Old 03-07-2015, 12:57 PM   #13
wrecklessrobbie OP
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I am having trouble posting. It cut me off half way.

I run the elite on tickover for 30 mins or so. I noticed the temperature gauge started to creep up to the red. I could hear the fan going. At least I think I could.

How can I tell if water is being pumped around the cooling system. I removed a water pipe that was conne Ted on the carb side but not a lot of water came out. I was expecting it to squirt out. Is there a quick method of checking if the coolant is circulating?


Robbie.
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Old 03-07-2015, 02:25 PM   #14
Eliter85
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my fan worked, yet in the summer it would start to reach the red after 20 minutes of riding or so. Changed the coolant and it fixed it right away. The coolant in there was real old and probably a little too much like sludge.

So I'd start there, cheap and pretty easy start anyways. Mine did however take a rather long time for the new coolant to drain into the scooter.
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Old 03-07-2015, 07:20 PM   #15
fullmetalscooter
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One more thing DON T RUN EETHANOL base gas It kill old rubber gaskets and fuel pumps . anything older then 15 years or so doesn't take kindly to that type of gas. Some fiberglass fuel tanks will just turn to gunk and melt away. No a worry on your elite. Just something to know. Glad it's running. Hope it passes you mot but I think old stuff like this doesn't need to get one anymore.
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