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Old 02-23-2009, 10:03 PM   #106
ScottDill
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fazer6
Water-cooled V4? Dude, you're deaming
He said "4V" not "V4" ...... as in Desmoquattro, testastretta, etc.
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Old 02-24-2009, 04:47 AM   #107
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It'll be a sport tourer for us "larger frame" guys.
I'm interested..
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Old 02-24-2009, 04:58 AM   #108
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Motophoria
That is one awful photochopped creation.
Yes, but it's based on the clear spy shots of a lightly camouflaged bike.

I fail to see how it's really a GS rival, it has absolutely no hint of off-road pretensions. It's a sit-up-and-beg sports bike, like the multistrada but even sportier. I guess it is the same target market though (in the UK at least) where we're all ageing sports bike riders looking for something that our knees can cope with.
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Old 02-24-2009, 06:12 AM   #109
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With a 17" front wheel, the only thing you will be a rival to is perhaps a Versys or Ulysses. Yes, you will end up having a power advantage, but I can't see it having any more adventure capabilities than any other tall streetbike.
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Old 02-24-2009, 06:17 AM   #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 5th-Elefant
Yes, but it's based on the clear spy shots of a lightly camouflaged bike.

I fail to see how it's really a GS rival, it has absolutely no hint of off-road pretensions. It's a sit-up-and-beg sports bike, like the multistrada but even sportier. I guess it is the same target market though (in the UK at least) where we're all ageing sports bike riders looking for something that our knees can cope with.
The BMW GS is also "sit-up-and-beg sports bike" so this is an Italian alternative. Most GS boxers are never used off road and frankly shouldn't be anyway.

That' snot a did at the R-GS's ....yeah - I know lot's of people take them off road (I've even used one at Simon Pavey's off-road school in Wales...man those guys could ride). But MOST people use them where they shine - highways, back roads, unpaved roads. They should both excel on the bumpy roads I find all over the best riding riding ares in the UK.
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Old 02-24-2009, 07:16 AM   #111
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scodill
The BMW GS is also "sit-up-and-beg sports bike" so this is an Italian alternative. Most GS boxers are never used off road and frankly shouldn't be anyway.

That' snot a did at the R-GS's ....yeah - I know lot's of people take them off road (I've even used one at Simon Pavey's off-road school in Wales...man those guys could ride). But MOST people use them where they shine - highways, back roads, unpaved roads. They should both excel on the bumpy roads I find all over the best riding riding ares in the UK.
Nah. That logic doesn't work for me. You can use any bike for any job, it doesn't mean they're aimed at the same market.

The GS is a comfy long-distance tourer with off-road pretensions. If it was a car it would be a Range Rover.

The MS is a comfy long-distance tourer with sporty pretensions. If it was a car it would be a Ferrari 612.

Sure, the overlap in all practical terms is 99% but they're aimed at different markets.
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Old 02-24-2009, 07:38 AM   #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 5th-Elefant
Nah. That logic doesn't work for me. You can use any bike for any job, it doesn't mean they're aimed at the same market.

The GS is a comfy long-distance tourer with off-road pretensions. If it was a car it would be a Range Rover.

The MS is a comfy long-distance tourer with sporty pretensions. If it was a car it would be a Ferrari 612.

Sure, the overlap in all practical terms is 99% but they're aimed at different markets.
I don't think comparing bikes to cars works...maybe that's just me. Both of these bikes will smoke pretty much any car on the road and still have the suspension to handle rough roads.

They're both tall street bikes...that's all I'm saying. They are both targeting the adventure touring market. The BMW will be relatively better in the dirt and the Ducati will be relatively better on the road...but the same market.

I concede that the BMW will be easier to press into hard-core adventure duty, but that's not the the market so much as it's the image that BMW is using to sell it. BTW - I had one an loved it. I preferred the "jeep" like utilitarian styling to swoopy MTS styling.


Besides I thought "adventure poser" was the biggest market anyway
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Old 02-24-2009, 07:40 AM   #113
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Ducati's answer to the GS? I'm not convinced it's the answer to anything!
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Old 02-24-2009, 07:44 AM   #114
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scodill
The BMW GS is also "sit-up-and-beg sports bike" so this is an Italian alternative.

On what planet?
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Old 02-24-2009, 08:49 AM   #115
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Originally Posted by Fleg
On what planet?


I just think some of you have a narrower view of target market than I do...no big deal. I'm excited about his new Duc, but I don't plan on buying one....to me Duc's are all about the Superbikes......good to see more choices though.
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Old 02-24-2009, 10:22 AM   #116
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Seems like many manufacturers are attempting to establish a footprint in the so-called adventure riding category - a category which has an extremely broad definition. More choices for us is a positive outcome, but the reality is that brand loyalty is a huge factor in the thinking of the various manufacturers. Ducati does not want a loyal Ducatista switching brands because they do not have a bike in a popular category. Most of these offerings are simply placeholders to maintain brand loyalty. Every manufacturer has some "dogs" in the product line whose sole purpose is to retain long time customers.

Ducati lost a little ground with the 999 (the scarface), and quickly returned to the 916 "look" at the insistence of the marketing department.
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Old 02-24-2009, 10:38 AM   #117
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Seems like the same problem as the Hypermotard ... which isn't a supermotard, but a 'tard styled streetfighter. This is just an AT styled streetfighter, which will be fine for a lot of people, but not in the same class as a GS. It is a very sexy two wheeled SUV ...
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Old 02-24-2009, 12:11 PM   #118
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Probably more like Ducati's answer to Triumph's Tiger.....
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Old 02-24-2009, 06:16 PM   #119
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For it to be a true adventure bike, like a BMW R1200GS or even a V Strom it needs the following:

A Dealer Network that can handle "on the tour" issues
Much greater than 6K mile valve adjustments
ABS Brakes
19" front wheel (not a deal breaker)
Lots of aftermarket accessories
A big alternator
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Old 02-24-2009, 06:30 PM   #120
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RoyB
For it to be a true adventure bike, like a BMW R1200GS or even a V Strom it needs the following:

A Dealer Network that can handle "on the tour" issues
Much greater than 6K mile valve adjustments
ABS Brakes
19" front wheel (not a deal breaker)
Lots of aftermarket accessories
A big alternator
Ducati has extended the valve adjust interval to 12k miles on many of it's newer bikes.

ABS ??? You defiitely do not want ABS in the dirt, and I prefer no ABS on the street as well. ABS (on the bike) would be a deal killer for me.
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