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Old 08-29-2012, 11:28 AM   #26566
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Originally Posted by GoGo Gadget View Post
Maybe so as you reholster you will not push the slide out of battery? I habitually place my thumb on the back of the slide of my Glock as I reholster for that reason. With a 1911 I would not need to.
Ah, that makes some sense.
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Old 08-29-2012, 11:30 AM   #26567
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Originally Posted by EvilGenius View Post
Ah, that makes some sense.
In "makes no sense at all" category, the 1911's are probably that way because the Army asked for it.
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Old 08-29-2012, 12:05 PM   #26568
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Originally Posted by Trixie View Post
In "makes no sense at all" category, the 1911's are probably that way because the Army asked for it.
I am betting it had to do with taking the gun out of or slightly out of battery whilst being carried.
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Old 08-29-2012, 02:57 PM   #26569
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Originally Posted by Sniper X View Post
I am betting it had to do with taking the gun out of or slightly out of battery whilst being carried.
I'd agree, and it was probably specified somewhere. not the slide lock per se, just that it couldn't come out of battery whilst being carried.

I should have used a smiley with my previous post. You know, "jumbo shrimp", "plastic silverware" and "army Intelligence"
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Old 08-29-2012, 03:20 PM   #26570
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It makes sense in that manner.

Was he designing it specifically for army trials at the time?
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Old 08-29-2012, 03:22 PM   #26571
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Originally Posted by Trixie View Post
In "makes no sense at all" category, the 1911's are probably that way because the Army asked for it.

Remember there is the right way, the wrong way, and the army way for doing everything!
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Old 08-29-2012, 03:46 PM   #26572
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Originally Posted by EvilGenius View Post
It makes sense in that manner.

Was he designing it specifically for army trials at the time?
Bear in mind that the Army was interested in a horse cavalry weapon. The 1911 was developed from the Browning 1905 .45 auto. The first experimental model had no thumb safety, and the Army asked for one. Browning was working closely with Army Ordnance for several years. The 1911 was adopted because it was the only weapon in the trials that didn't malfunction or break parts. IIRC, it fired about 6000 rounds and was still going strong at the end.
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Old 08-29-2012, 03:50 PM   #26573
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Bear in mind that the Army was interested in a horse cavalry weapon. The 1911 was developed from the Browning 1905 .45 auto. The first experimental model had no thumb safety, and the Army asked for one. Browning was working closely with Army Ordnance for several years. The 1911 was adopted because it was the only weapon in the trials that didn't malfunction or break parts. IIRC, it fired about 6000 rounds and was still going strong at the end.
That oughta tell you something if people can't get their $1000+ 1911 past 1000 rds without a malfunction.
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Old 08-29-2012, 03:57 PM   #26574
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That oughta tell you something if people can't get their $1000+ 1911 past 1000 rds without a malfunction.
Ah, but there IS a reason for that. All these 1911s made now are either very accurate, or very malfunction free. Not both unless you hit the happy medium of accuracy vs reliability. The reason a old war relic 1911 can ingest thousands of rounds with no malfunctions is because they were built so loose, they can get very very dirty with nothing tightening up enough to malfunction.

A tighter 1911 will out shoot a looser one so these custom companies try and make the gun as tight as they can whilst maintaining the most reliability they can.

You can have a super reliable 1911 or a super accurate one or a combination of both...but there are trade offs.
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Old 08-29-2012, 04:04 PM   #26575
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Here's a short history of the trials: http://www.americanrifleman.org/arti...ials-of-m1911/
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Old 08-29-2012, 05:55 PM   #26576
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Ah, but there IS a reason for that. All these 1911s made now are either very accurate, or very malfunction free. Not both unless you hit the happy medium of accuracy vs reliability. The reason a old war relic 1911 can ingest thousands of rounds with no malfunctions is because they were built so loose, they can get very very dirty with nothing tightening up enough to malfunction.

A tighter 1911 will out shoot a looser one so these custom companies try and make the gun as tight as they can whilst maintaining the most reliability they can.

You can have a super reliable 1911 or a super accurate one or a combination of both...but there are trade offs.
How much more accurate though?

We talking 2" vs 5" groups out of a vise at 50yds, or rifle vs shotgun kind of improvement?
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Old 08-29-2012, 11:51 PM   #26577
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How much more accurate though?

We talking 2" vs 5" groups out of a vise at 50yds, or rifle vs shotgun kind of improvement?
Les Baer says his PremieirII will shoot 3 inch groups at 50 yards. You can pay more and have a 1 1/2 group. I doubt either of those guns will malfunction after break in.

Ed Brown doesnt give an accuracy garentee but I've had no malfunctions with my Special Forces in 2000 rounds.
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Old 08-30-2012, 04:33 AM   #26578
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Les Baer says his PremieirII will shoot 3 inch groups at 50 yards. You can pay more and have a 1 1/2 group. I doubt either of those guns will malfunction after break in.

Ed Brown doesnt give an accuracy garentee but I've had no malfunctions with my Special Forces in 2000 rounds.
I bet it would fail if subject to the same type of tests the original 1911 was put through.

People forget that the reason for the military side arm is it is more handy then picking up a rock....that said if you need it the thing has to work, this is why most of the military weapons of that era are so loose.....so that when you are knocked down in the mud get up and pull that 1911 out of its holster with water running out of every crack it will still go bang, bang, bang....not bang, click. A military pistol only has to be a minute of man at around 25 yards...or less...anything further away and you have the wrong tool for the job.

I would bet money that if you ran 2000 rounds in your ed brown and 2000 rounds in an "old war horse" that old gun would mop the floor in terms of running....no cleaning of any kind.

Not trying to start anything, just saying they are two machines built for two VERY different jobs. One is a toy, the other is to save your life.
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Old 08-30-2012, 07:38 AM   #26579
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[QUOTE=EvilGenius;19476178]How much more accurate though?

We talking 2" vs 5" groups out of a vise at 50yds, or rifle vs shotgun kind of improvement?[/QUOTE

I think the most accurate a 1911 can be at 50 out of a vise is about an inch and still cycle. But a Govt 1911 may make 1 foot at that range.

Speaking of 1911s. My GSG sees a lot of holster work round my land and as a DC every so often and was looking pretty bad. The finish they have is kinda hard and flakes off when used in a plastic holster. I decided since it has an alloy slide to take all the black off. Here's a bad celly pic.

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Old 08-30-2012, 10:00 AM   #26580
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Looks good, I am still enjoying mine...even with some of the newer options I like the GSG 1911 the best.

Have you seen this.....I almost bought one on a whim a few weeks ago.....it looked just soo cool.

A 22 STG44....what in the world do I need this thing for....why do I want one....must resist...it is from GSG so I am thinking the quality should be on par with their 1911.

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