The Honda XL (and other vintage singles) thread!

[skorpioskorpio]

Originally Posted by Gravytrain

Thanks,
Anyone using and happy with ATF? I have a hard time picturing it being better than some good fork oil.

Is all ATF the same weight? What weight?

Thanks for playing twenty questions. Honda shop manual on the way from eBay

ATF was the common recommondation back then, as there really wasn't specific fork oil yet. ATF was often specifies as a generic hydralic fluid. It has a low temperature breakdown threshold, very low viscosity weight, but does resist foaming and has good flow at low temperature. It works but typically if you are changing fluid in your forks you'll use a 10 weight fork oil, or even 5. 10 Weight will probably stiffen your forks somewhat and help compensate for the spring sag that has developed over the last 35 years.

[frdbronco8]

I just torn into the valve cover on my 80 XL500s to reseal it. I see what looks like pins that hold the shaft that the rocker arms rotate on. This shaft is leaking by the flat head screw looking end. How does one get these pins out? I think I read somewhere that someone notched them, was that to get a better grip with a tool to pull them out?
Thanks

[redprimo]

I ground flats so I could grip them with a pair of vice grips. one came out pretty easy the other not so much. by being able to turn them you can pull out at the same time you turn them and they come out. cut the notch rather then ruining them the way I did. I had to buy new pins. while you have the lid off check the theads on the valve covers they tend to get worn and stripped. I have the same model

[frdbronco8]

Thanks, Ill try that out, I wasn't going to mess with that part but it does weep and as long as I have it on the bench.... The threads seem good so far but I hear that is common so I will be gentle. I did put a crack in the cover on the bottom half of one of the access openings when I was removing it (dont ask). I notched it and filled it with "high temp" JB weld so we will see how that holds...... I was going to use Yamabond on the cover when I am done, how thin a coat does it need and you put it on only one side right?

Its my dad's old bike and is in great shape with 6k on it. Ill post pics when its done!

[KTJ]

I recently bought a XL 250 1976, and it needs some work minor but one some what major lol. The last guy who owned it over tightened the spark plug and now the threads are so out of wack the spark plug does not sit in it properly. My friend suggested a healicoil. Any other suggestions?

Thanks

[redprimo]

Originally Posted by frdbronco8

Thanks, Ill try that out, I wasn't going to mess with that part but it does weep and as long as I have it on the bench.... The threads seem good so far but I hear that is common so I will be gentle. I did put a crack in the cover on the bottom half of one of the access openings when I was removing it (dont ask). I notched it and filled it with "high temp" JB weld so we will see how that holds...... I was going to use Yamabond on the cover when I am done, how thin a coat does it need and you put it on only one side right?

Its my dad's old bike and is in great shape with 6k on it. Ill post pics when its done!

When repairng a crack you also need to find the end and drill a small hole through the material to keep the crack from growing. Its not a stressed part so your repair might hold and if it dosent you can replace it with the motor still in the frame. If it were me I would start looking for a replacement part for when it starts leaking again.

[redprimo]

Originally Posted by KTJ

I recently bought a XL 250 1976, and it needs some work minor but one some what major lol. The last guy who owned it over tightened the spark plug and now the threads are so out of wack the spark plug does not sit in it properly. My friend suggested a healicoil. Any other suggestions?

Thanks

I would go with a Timecert. Some will say they are the same thing, which they are not, and others will say that a heli coi is just as good, and for some things they are. For something that will be repeatedly removed and installed like a spark plug a Timesert is going to be better suited.

My local dealer will insatall a Timesert for $45 if I remove the art and take it to them. I bought a 8mm Timesert kit and it came with all the tooling and 10 inserts for $70, replacement inserts are a couble of bucks each. No machine tools are required

[KTJ]

Originally Posted by redprimo

I would go with a Timecert. Some will say they are the same thing, which they are not, and others will say that a heli coi is just as good, and for some things they are. For something that will be repeatedly removed and installed like a spark plug a Timesert is going to be better suited.

My local dealer will insatall a Timesert for $45 if I remove the art and take it to them. I bought a 8mm Timesert kit and it came with all the tooling and 10 inserts for $70, replacement inserts are a couble of bucks each. No machine tools are required

Great idea! Thanks a lot

[pommie john]

OK team, what does everyone use to paint/coat the magnesium engine side covers on the early Motosport XL 250?

Mine were pretty flakey and corroded so I cleaned them off, rubbed them down and painted them with a nice "Cast Iron" grey engine enamel. In no time it's flaking off and looks like shit.

Any suggestions for something that will stick to magnesium?

Thanks
John

[thisflatearth]

Get them powder coated and be done with it. Just make sure the coater preps them real good.

[skorpioskorpio]

Here's what I do and I've done several and they seem to have held up pretty good.

Wash throughly with some grease cutting dish liquid.
Scuff with 240 grit paper, if there is a metric equivalent, I'm not sure what that is.
Don't touch the surface you are going to paint.
Wipe down with ammonia, let dry completely.
Don't touch the surface you are going to paint.
Paint at above 70 Degrees F, preferably 80F to 85F.
Light spray, 3 coats of Duplicolor Engine Enamel Primer. Between about 5 and 10 minutes apart.
Not sure what year your bike is but, for 1972-1975 250s and 350 Sideport engines the best color is Duplicolor Ford Spruce Green, and 3 to 4 coats lightly sprayed. Again between about 5 and 10 minutes apart and same amount of time after the primer.
Another 5 to 10 minutes later coat with Duplicolor Engine Enamel Clear, a couple of coats a little heavier than the others (The Spruce Green is just a tad to metallic and a little heavier coat takes some of the sparkle away).
Let sit preferably in a cool dry place, less than 75, and out of the sun for 5-8 hours so the paint sets to the touch.
Put part in the oven and turn on to 300F (after the part is in) set a timer for 20-30 min. When timer goes off turn oven off.
Don't remove until oven has cooled completely off. This pre-cures the engine enamel which is meant to be cured by the heat of the engine, but if you try to let engine heat cure the paint on a cover the screws with just chip the paint off trying to put it on. Some chipping will happen anyway but it should be localized to under the screws if it's cured.
Inspect your work to make sure it looks like an authentic early Honda part, there should be at least one drip or a couple bubbles.

[anonny]

Originally Posted by pommie john

OK team, what does everyone use to paint/coat the magnesium engine side covers on the early Motosport XL 250?

Mine were pretty flakey and corroded so I cleaned them off, rubbed them down and painted them with a nice "Cast Iron" grey engine enamel. In no time it's flaking off and looks like shit.

Any suggestions for something that will stick to magnesium?

Thanks
John

I use a powder coat called "Standard Silver" it's a ringer for Honda's case color.

[pommie john]

Originally Posted by anonny

I use a powder coat called "Standard Silver" it's a ringer for Honda's case color.

Looks good!


Thanks for all the answers.

One more question:
I was told that the main reason my paint came off was that the magnesium is so porous that oil seeps through from the inside.
Is that true, and if so wouldn't that affect any kind of finish?

[soshiant]

HONDA XL 125S 1983

[skorpioskorpio]

Originally Posted by pommie john

Looks good!


Thanks for all the answers.

One more question:
I was told that the main reason my paint came off was that the magnesium is so porous that oil seeps through from the inside.
Is that true, and if so wouldn't that affect any kind of finish?

Porous, hmm, I don't think that is the reason, I think it probably has more to do with the fact that you are really painting magnesium oxide and not really magnesium, same basic problem aluminum has but worse. Both these metals spontaneously react with oxygen on their surface. Magnesium is highly reactive, think sparklers, road flares and flash bulbs. Aluminum is also highly reactive but requires a higher temperature to reach its reaction point. Both these metals once in a full reaction will take oxygen from anywhere, so they will steal the "O" out of H2O if you try to put them out with water. Anyway, I plan on doing an engine with GunKote soon but more for the reason that it's really tough stuff, high heat and thin enough to not disrupt cooling, I haven't tried it yet but have heard it works well.