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Old 12-19-2014, 07:02 PM   #1
Vertical C OP
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What evidence is there that group rides are more dangerous?

In a number of threads, I have seen other inmates claim that they won't ride with groups of other riders because they claim there is great danger.

Does anyone have any evidence of this risk? From what I have seen whilst you might get some people that might pass too close it just is a scare and that is just conjecture about it being dangerous, I don't see a whole lot of riders actually talking about being taken out.

It is also likely that a group ride might be safer in some ways such as a car might be more likely to see two lights not one. Also if you did have a solo crash I would rather be in a group ride than waiting for some car to notice me down off the road.

So what evidence is there of this huge danger? Studies?
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Old 12-19-2014, 07:05 PM   #2
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Because you can't be 100% sure that the others around you have the same skill level that you do. I would NEVER go on a group ride with a bunch of harley or cruiser riders for example. It's just a known fact that a lot of them are idiots who can't ride.

Secondly, there have been a few instances where a car still plows into a group of riders. If they don't see one, they won't see 20. Head up ass syndrome is a bad thing.
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Old 12-19-2014, 07:26 PM   #3
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I don't think its the people in the group rides that are in danger its all the other travelers that are trying to get past them any way and place that's possible. Throw in a little road rage and its a recipe for trouble.
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Old 12-19-2014, 07:30 PM   #4
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I don't require empirical data to convince me group riding is dangerous. If you and 20 or so of your buddies were all driving your cars to the same place at the same time, would you bunch up, almost bumper to bumper, in a tight string and drive 10 under the flow of traffic all the way there while denying other vehicles room to merge onto the road? Of course not, because it wouldn't be safe (and it'd be real dickish). Same with bikes, only more so--if one goes down the ones behind just don't have enough time or space to react. It's like "the big one" in a NASCAR race except instead of dented doors you have bodies on the ground.

If you're riding with people infected with a herd mentality, and you're all going to the same place, give everybody a map and send them out at intervals. If they still can't find their way, they probably shouldn't be turned loose in public by themselves anyway. Have someone ride sweep to deal with breakdowns and dropouts.

I mean really, if you want to travel in packs like tourists, rent a damn bus, stay in the slow lane, and let traffic flow naturally past you.
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Old 12-19-2014, 07:34 PM   #5
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I can't find the article now, but a few years back we had a couple riders killed in a group ride because an unskilled rider couldn't stop in time. While anecdotal and probably rare, it still precisely encapsulates my fear of pirate parades. A bunch of people around me of unknown skill level just isn't my thing. A bunch of my riding buddies I can deal with and enjoy. But not a bunch of strangers.
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Old 12-19-2014, 07:43 PM   #6
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Pretty sure it's safer to sit on the couch then ride.
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Old 12-19-2014, 07:47 PM   #7
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Not all 'group rides' are 40 or 50 HD riders of poor riding ability blocking up the road or squids doing stunts for Youtube videos. Where I live they are only a small minority. Virtually all the group rides I attend (at least one a week) comprise less than 10 riders on the day. A broad mix of people, 30+ years old, years of experience, even a currently serving police officer which I didn't know for years as no one talks 'shop'. They are just a group of people who love riding and connect with other riders to do regular day rides via a club or informal Facebook group.

The groups I ride with certainly don't hold up traffic. As its mostly the same people you have complete confidence in the riders around you.

JohnCW screwed with this post 12-19-2014 at 08:21 PM
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Old 12-19-2014, 08:05 PM   #8
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Location is a factor, I live up in the mountains of TN/NC.
It's very twisty and we do group rides up here but unless it's the Blue Ridge Parkway it's a ride at your on pace and we will all meet up at the next stop.
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Old 12-19-2014, 08:08 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnCW View Post
Not all 'group rides' are 40 or 50 HD riders of poor riding ability blocking up the road or squids doing stunts for Youtube videos. Where I live they are only a small minority. Virtually all the group rides I attend (at least one a week) comprise less than 10 riders on the day. A broad mix of people, mostly 30 - 40 years old, years of experience, even a currently serving police officer which I didn't know for years as no one talks 'shop'. They are just a group of people who love riding and connect with other riders to do regular day rides via a club or informal Facebook group.

The groups I ride with certainly don't hold up traffic. As its mostly the same people you have complete confidence in the riders around you.
It's funny you say "No one talks shop" I had no idea that 2 of the guys I ride with were retired airline pilots for the longest time.
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Old 12-19-2014, 08:21 PM   #10
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Any riders that are riding closely packed have little room to avoid obstacles or other dangers. It is akin to tailgaiting, just more accepted as you may know the people in the group. I won't ride close to, nor pass in the same lane as, another rider that I do not know nor know their skill level.

How is that not obvious that riding closely to another or many others is more dangerous than farther apart? This is the same regardless of speed relative to the rest of the roadway. They could be riding faster and have the same issues.
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Old 12-19-2014, 08:29 PM   #11
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uccjg9zoP0g

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vQcB4WpofAo
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Old 12-19-2014, 08:30 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bollocks View Post
it's a ride at your on pace and we will all meet up at the next stop.
Pretty much how all the groups I ride with work. Even the one large group of 40+ riders mid week (an over 40 age club so mostly retired riders) will quickly break out into 5 or so sub-groups to ride at a pace they are comfortable with, reforming at the next stop. Some of these guys are in their 70's and still 'ride like the wind'. Don't get to be 70+ being a lifetime regular motorcycle rider doing stupid things.
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Old 12-19-2014, 08:56 PM   #13
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I have gone on a lot of group rides although not the big "parade" style rides that many complain about. I do think that people are more likely to crash on group rides because of that desire to keep up even if the pace is uncomfortable for that rider. I have lost count of how many crashes I have seen on group rides for this reason. However, I have yet to see anyone take out another rider in the group. So while some riders may be at greater risk on group rides, I don't feel it poses any greater risk for me.

One advantage of a group ride is that if you do go off into the weeds or over a cliff, someone will be around to call an ambulance.

Just my opinion. I have no official statistics to back this up.
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Old 12-19-2014, 08:57 PM   #14
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That also pretty much how the "group ride" I've done go. F'rinstance, at the yearly MOA getogether they'll have a "ride to Russell Caverns" or a "ride to Barbers Speedway" at 10:00 (or whatever) and people will meet and move out in groups that tend to spread out and disperse once they hit the highway and people will plan to meet up at the destination. It's more like you have clumps of motorcycles moving along and not a procession.

Riding in tight groups makes me nervous (or at least "wary")...

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Old 12-19-2014, 09:01 PM   #15
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Can we break this off into two segments?

Slow cruiser type big rolling roadblock runs with riders of all abilities.

"Normal" rides with the 3-6 rider group as a whole moving a bit or a lot faster than the speed limit at all times except when the police might be around.

I have nothing to add about the former.


The latter however, passing cars safely in a group is the single most thing that some riders simply just don't comprehend.

It really bothers me as it seems obvious to me when I'm leading.

If you are in front, and you come up on a car in front that is slower than you were riding.

And there is a safe spot to pass....

Fucking go!... as soon as it's safe...not 3 seconds after.

When you are past the slower car, don't fucking roll off the throttle when you are 2-3 car lengths past the slower car.

Keep fucking going, at WOT or near WOT if it's safe to do so....untill you are way, way ahead.

There are other people with you, possibly within a bike length. I/we are expecting you to keep accelerating so that I/we can pass safely as well. I/we need room to get back in the lane.

If you are in front, you are not there to "ride your own ride".

You are leading and you should expect that you will be followed, and ride accordingly.

That is all.

Oh, and get a real mirror, it sure looks cool, but you never look in that 2" under bar mirror you have.
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