Killboy failure Dragon Fest

[GSequoia]

Originally Posted by Easterner

And some would think it irresponsible to be riding if you have children.

I, for one, view it at irresponsible to have children.





I've learned that lesson...Twice now...Now wonder I never get to go on moto trips.

[RidingDonkeys]

Originally Posted by Mr_Gone

Maybe "criminal" was the wrong word, but if that little girl was riding in the back of a pickup truck, the police would ticket the driver. Different standards, I know.

I just can't fathom a parent putting their child at risk, albeit a "remote chance" of risk, of severe physical harm if they do go down.

Maybe I'm thinking about this wrong.

I think we're raising a generation of kids who don't know how to live. I see it everyday in the Army. The young guys coming in grew up on padded playgrounds, anti-bacterial everything, and pads for every activity on wheels. In short, they're a bunch of pussies and we have to retrain them to accept risk.

You ask any 8yo kid around if they want to ride a motorcycle, and they'll all smile and scream yes. Why train them to lose that sense of adventure? When I lived in Europe, I saw kids on scooters and motorcycles all the time. They didn't ride for fun, they rode because it was their only mode of transportation. Yet for some reason, when I throw my nephew in the sidecar with full gear, Americans flip the hell out. Meanwhile, he's having the time of his life. His mother hates motorcycles, and refuses to even let me get him a PW50. On the flip side, she'll let him ride with me. Bass ackwards? Yep, but it shows how uneducated the general public is about our sport.

Nevertheless, I've got a nephew who wants nothing more than to take a ride with me, and turn wrenches when we're done. A future motorcyclist has been born, whether momma likes it or not. If you want to grow our sport, and keep it vibrant, we have to engage kids when they are young.

[Conedodger]

Originally Posted by GSequoia

I, for one, view it at irresponsible to have children.

[Montague]

Originally Posted by doug s.

i agree w/you. but look at it this way - some folks would think it criminal to allow a child on a motorcycle even if in full gear...

doug s.

They tried to pass a law on just that up here in Ontario, Canuckistan.

Female member of the legislature, is a doctor and recently divorced. Apparently bad Daddy had a motorcycle and she was bound and determined to keep him from taking their kids for rides. So she came up with some cock and bull stats on injuries to children from motorcycles and introduced a private members bill.

Fortunately there was an election before it went very far and the bill died. She lost her seat. And it turns out the injury stats she quoted were for kids injured on dirt bikes/atvs and had nothing to do with road accidents.

[MattB]

Originally Posted by Mr_Gone

Maybe "criminal" was the wrong word...

I just can't fathom a parent putting their child at risk, albeit a "remote chance" of risk, of severe physical harm if they do go down.

Maybe I'm thinking about this wrong.

No, I think you had it correct the first time, it is criminal. Not in the jailtime sense, but that is SO wrong to make such a poor choice on behalf of a child. Children count on their parents to make WISE decisions on their behalf.

I suppose I feel even more strongly about this case then what I might otherwise. Consider the location of the picture, eg at the Dragon, and consider how many folks come across double yellow, etc upping the chance of issues significantly.

[doug s.]

Originally Posted by MattB

No, I think you had it correct the first time, it is criminal. Not in the jailtime sense, but that is SO wrong to make such a poor choice on behalf of a child. Children count on their parents to make WISE decisions on their behalf.

I suppose I feel even more strongly about this case then what I might otherwise. Consider the location of the picture, eg at the Dragon, and consider how many folks come across double yellow, etc upping the chance of issues significantly.

yup, it is criminal to ride a motorcycle on the dragon... not in the jailtime sense, but that is SO wrong to make such a poor choice on behalf of anyone including yourself. but, i bet if you asked, the kid wanted to go and wasn't forecd to go... would i take a kid on that road w/o gear? no, but i wouldn't ride the dragon w/o gear myself. to be honest, i really have no desire to ride that road, whatsoever...

doug s.

[Mr_Gone]

I don't have a problem with riding if you have kids. I know people on both sides of that debate, and I don't fault them for their choice, either way. I can see both sides of the issue.

Also, I'm not against taking kids as passengers on bikes.

But to choose not to mitigate their risk (ATGATT) in case of a crash... that just seems wrong. Maybe not criminal, but that woman just isn't thinking of the possible consequences.

The photo just instinctively made me cringe. First glance, gut reaction, it seemed wrong.

[Mr_Gone]

Originally Posted by Boon Booni

Umm..

I'd lay her down.

Me too...

Maybe even twice if I still had some chrome on the pipes.

[Mr_Gone]

Originally Posted by GSequoia

I, for one, view it at irresponsible to have children.


I've learned that lesson...Twice now...Now wonder I never get to go on moto trips.

+1 Same here. People are the #1 reason for global warming, pollution, war, and slow drivers in the left hand lane. And since kids grow up to be people, I chose not to add to the world's problems.

[doug s.]

Originally Posted by Mr_Gone

I don't have a problem with riding if you have kids. I know people on both sides of that debate, and I don't fault them for their choice, either way. I can see both sides of the issue.

Also, I'm not against taking kids as passengers on bikes.

But to choose not to mitigate their risk (ATGATT) in case of a crash... that just seems wrong. Maybe not criminal, but that woman just isn't thinking of the possible consequences.

The photo just instinctively made me cringe. First glance, gut reaction, it seemed wrong.

i have the same reaction when i see anyone riding like that. if there were yust the woman, and no kid, i would still cringe...

doug s.

[doug s.]

Originally Posted by Mr_Gone

+1 Same here. People are the #1 reason for global warming, pollution, war, and slow drivers in the left hand lane. And since kids grow up to be people, I chose not to add to the world's problems.

people are also the #1 reason for fighting global warming, protesting wars, fighting pollution, proper lane courtesy, fast cars, motorcycles, blissful orgasms, etc...

i, personally, believe the human population has way exceeded its carrying capacity and it's only a matter of time for the j-curve correction to kick in. now, it seems those who perceive the seriousness of the issues facing humanity - the intelligent ones - are those who should be reproducing and are not. the ignorant masses are going at it like there's no tomorrow. and there wery well may not be. at least for the humans. but mebbe my thoughts are a product of my ethnocentric bias. regardless, mother nature knows best...

doug s.

[Montague]

Originally Posted by doug s.

people are also the #1 reason for fighting global warming, protesting wars, fighting pollution, proper lane courtesy, fast cars, motorcycles, blissful orgasms, etc...

i, personally, believe the human population has way exceeded its carrying capacity and it's only a matter of time for the j-curve correction to kick in. now, it seems those who perceive the seriousness of the issues facing humanity - the intelligent ones - are those who should be reproducing and are not. the ignorant masses are going at it like there's no tomorrow. and there wery well may not be. at least for the humans. but mebbe my thoughts are a product of my ethnocentric bias. regardless, mother nature knows best...

doug s.

You have seen the movie Idiocracy, yes?

[doug s.]

Originally Posted by Montague

You have seen the movie Idiocracy, yes?

uh yes, unfortunately i did. it seems the ignorance of the future is already here; thus the making of that movie... it reminded me of that "people of walmart" website...

doug s.

[wannaklr]

Originally Posted by Mr_Gone

Ah, I forgot. Only HD riders lay 'er down.

Maybe "criminal" was the wrong word, but if that little girl was riding in the back of a pickup truck, the police would ticket the driver. Different standards, I know.

I just can't fathom a parent putting their child at risk, albeit a "remote chance" of risk, of severe physical harm if they do go down.

Maybe I'm thinking about this wrong.

You aren't. I look at that picture and see the possible consequences of their actions. Not something I would want to live with. Other folks see the risk differently.

[duck]

Originally Posted by Mr_Gone

I don't have a problem with riding if you have kids. I know people on both sides of that debate, and I don't fault them for their choice, either way. I can see both sides of the issue.

Also, I'm not against taking kids as passengers on bikes.

But to choose not to mitigate their risk (ATGATT) in case of a crash... that just seems wrong. Maybe not criminal, but that woman just isn't thinking of the possible consequences.

The photo just instinctively made me cringe. First glance, gut reaction, it seemed wrong.

Sorry but it's not your kid and, as long as it's legal, it's none of your business. Just like it's nobody else's business if you take a kid riding ATGATT - which lots of folks would still disapprove of.