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Old 08-22-2012, 06:49 PM   #1546
Blakebird
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coloradorider View Post
they just threw it on there and are charging like they engineered all of it from scratch.
no...they're charging for developing and tooling up for production of a clean sheet engine/transmission design.
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Old 08-22-2012, 07:04 PM   #1547
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Gee. I guess it's been 3 weeks since the last time we had a piss on Motus barrage.

Why bother? We've been over each and every point several times before Go out and ride.
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Old 08-22-2012, 07:05 PM   #1548
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Originally Posted by gixxersteph View Post
Gee. I guess it's been 3 weeks since the last time we had a piss on Motus barrage.

Why bother? We've been over each and every point several times before Go out and ride.
the line for thread moderator is around that corner to your left
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Old 08-22-2012, 08:22 PM   #1549
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Do you complain about Ohlins suspension? That is COTS (commercial off the shelf) parts, too. What about Bosch ecu or Brembo brakes? Marchesini wheels? Why literally reinvent the wheel? Ducati and Guzzi use Givi.

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Old 08-22-2012, 08:33 PM   #1550
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the line for thread moderator is around that corner to your left
Not sure I understand. We both seem to want Motus to succeed.
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Old 08-22-2012, 08:43 PM   #1551
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They had to develop the engine and tranny, everything else is bolted on. Ducati does that but not even close tot he same level. A Sargent seat? That's fine but to charge this much is just stupid. I hope they FAIL! Now for all of this to cost $20,000 like it should and what it's worth..Me want me want! But no, they priced it right out of the buyers market that willl actually use it for what it was intended for. Now we have to watch douchbags like Tom Cruz and Brad Pitt ride one around in between pr events. Screw you motus!
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Old 08-22-2012, 09:14 PM   #1552
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Originally Posted by Coloradorider View Post
They had to develop the engine and tranny, everything else is bolted on. Ducati does that but not even close tot he same level. A Sargent seat? That's fine but to charge this much is just stupid.
Would you be happier with a Corbin? How many people bring their new BMW home and immediately buy a Sargeant seat for $500? How many Harley riders spend $5k on engine upgrades right off the floor?

Do you want Erik Buell to fail, too? He charges over $30k for his sportbike and he bought an engine and transmission from Rotax. Nobody complained about that - we were all so happy to see the end of the Harley lump!
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Old 08-22-2012, 09:16 PM   #1553
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Ya know…

Offering an opinion is one thing but wishing a startup american motorcycle company (the first one in how long?) to fail right out of the gate sounds more like you guys have personal problems.

I mean this 1st offering is outside of your budget, ok so does that mean that they won't come out with a 2nd generation that will be better AND affordable?

And to wish them to fail so that it precludes any and all subsequent designs is short sighted at best.

And it sounds like from here that you really have no clue what is involved with setting up a whole new franchise, from scratch, for the whole country. And that if successful, this enables a second generation bike to have a dealer network from which to launch from. You know being able to get it serviced and repaired and get warranty claims and parts and such from a dealer near you instead of long distance to the factory… And all of this completely whooshes right over your heads.

Is it just that your expectations are so completely dashed that you want THEM to eat worms and die?

You really should at least try and see a bigger picture here.

JJ
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Old 08-22-2012, 09:20 PM   #1554
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnjen View Post
Ya know…

Offering an opinion is one thing but wishing a startup american motorcycle company (the first one in how long?) to fail right out of the gate sounds more like you guys have personal problems.

I mean this 1st offering is outside of your budget, ok so does that mean that they won't come out with a 2nd generation that will be better AND affordable?

And to wish them to fail so that it precludes any and all subsequent designs is short sighted at best.

And it sounds like from here that you really have no clue what is involved with setting up a whole new franchise, from scratch, for the whole country. And that if successful, this enables a second generation bike to have a dealer network from which to launch from. You know being able to get it serviced and repaired and get warranty claims and parts and such from a dealer near you instead of long distance to the factory… And all of this completely whooshes right over your heads.

Is it just that your expectations are so completely dashed that you want THEM to eat worms and die?

You really should at least try and see a bigger picture here.

JJ
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Old 08-22-2012, 09:48 PM   #1555
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnjen View Post
Ya know…

Offering an opinion is one thing but wishing a startup american motorcycle company (the first one in how long?) to fail right out of the gate sounds more like you guys have personal problems.

I mean this 1st offering is outside of your budget, ok so does that mean that they won't come out with a 2nd generation that will be better AND affordable?

And to wish them to fail so that it precludes any and all subsequent designs is short sighted at best.

And it sounds like from here that you really have no clue what is involved with setting up a whole new franchise, from scratch, for the whole country. And that if successful, this enables a second generation bike to have a dealer network from which to launch from. You know being able to get it serviced and repaired and get warranty claims and parts and such from a dealer near you instead of long distance to the factory… And all of this completely whooshes right over your heads.

Is it just that your expectations are so completely dashed that you want THEM to eat worms and die?

You really should at least try and see a bigger picture here.

JJ
I hope they sell a million of them.

It seems to me that Triumph has shown that niche aspirational motorcycles isn't the path to success for a motorcycle start up.

Modular design is.

I would love to see one up close.
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Old 08-22-2012, 10:18 PM   #1556
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Originally Posted by Meter Man View Post
I hope they sell a million of them.

It seems to me that Triumph has shown that niche aspirational motorcycles isn't the path to success for a motorcycle start up.

Modular design is.

I would love to see one up close.
That (modular design) is what BMW uses as well.
And the fact that they offer the engine for sale tells me they are already thinking modular.

But a completely new startup with no brand recognition, no dealer network, of ANY kind, and starting with a clean piece of paper is costly (in time & money), no matter how you look at it. So they are (I believe) being realistic in building their bus model and doing so in as expedient a fashion as possible. No sense in stripping the gears nor riding the brake just to prolong a slow death.

JJ
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Old 08-23-2012, 02:55 AM   #1557
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I'll most likely never buy a Motus, but I hope they succeed.

These guys have put a lot of money behind a dream, and they've gotten pretty far. Crossing the chasm into production is hugely difficult, and I hope they pull it off. We need dreamers, and everyone knows we need good manufacturing jobs here in the USA.

Why will I probably not buy one? Because while I think it will be a better performing motorcycle than my FJR1300, I don't see how the increase in performance will justify the $15k price differential. I could pick up an adventurer tourer for that price, or two new KTM Freerides (the gas and electric one). There isn't sufficient additional value, to me.

Now, maybe Motus will take their V4 engine and build a 31" seat height adventure tourer around it. Then I'd be seriously interested... especially with shaft drive.
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Old 08-23-2012, 03:55 AM   #1558
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They are in Birmingham, same town as Confederate, which has stayed afloat for 20 years building $100,000 motorcycles in tiny numbers with, AFAIK, no dealer network.

Confederate is hoping this one will be a big seller:



It's only $50,000. They are planning to build two a week. Link for more pics.

One of the Motus guys is ex-Confederate.

Would not greatly surprise me if they were looking at Confederate's business model, or a development of it.

Saw an interview with the present Confederate designer. He said they were aiming to build bikes that people passed on to their kids after they got too old to ride them.

Silly idea in this disposable age of rapid tech change. The kids will have electric hoverbikes and won't need smooth roads. Why would they want one of these things? But it appears enough people are attracted.
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Old 08-23-2012, 09:43 AM   #1559
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Saw an interview with the present Confederate designer. He said they were aiming to build bikes that people passed on to their kids after they got too old to ride them..
Sounds like the same stuff Lee Conn was saying about Motus in that interview a while back when he was talking about "heirloom quality."

Most engines and transmissions are reliable enough these days. The shit that goes wrong seems to be with the electronics, rubber/plastic components, seals, etc., and I don't see anything to support that Motus is sourcing components any more rugged than anyone else.
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Old 08-23-2012, 10:04 AM   #1560
Mr. Canoehead
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Moronic View Post
They are in Birmingham, same town as Confederate, which has stayed afloat for 20 years building $100,000 motorcycles in tiny numbers with, AFAIK, no dealer network.

Confederate is hoping this one will be a big seller:



It's only $50,000. They are planning to build two a week. Link for more pics.
Wow, people complain about the price of the Motus and that abomination is $50k? Nice EPA approved exhaust - no way that bike is street legal, so who is going to buy them? The Motus is a bargain in comparison and it can be ridden on the street.

Also, doesn't Confederate use S&S engines and an off the shelf gearbox? I also like the routing of the throttle cables...

What happened to the American tradition of rooting for the underdog? Everyone loves EBR but hates Motus?
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