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Old 09-06-2011, 07:13 PM   #586
Boxer-lust
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I have only seen the MOTUS bikes in Laguna Seca.
As for the shaft having more parasitic losses than a chain that is only true with shaft driven bikes like inline-4's where the power has to be angled at 90 degrees.
A Boxer,Guzzi ot MOTUS shaft with a longitudional crank would have actually less parasitic losses than a not perfectly maintained chain...
With an engine as torquey and powerful as the MOTUS' you need TC in rain and I did not see any ABS on the prototypes...
If they want to be a "premium product" charging premium price they better get with the program.
A chain on a rich man's sporty touring bike is already a big turn off made in usa or not...
It's a long way to the top if you wanna rock'n roll...
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Old 09-06-2011, 07:32 PM   #587
xtop20A
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boxer-lust View Post
I have only seen the MOTUS bikes in Laguna Seca.
As for the shaft having more parasitic losses than a chain that is only true with shaft driven bikes like inline-4's where the power has to be angled at 90 degrees.
A Boxer,Guzzi ot MOTUS shaft with a longitudional crank would have actually less parasitic losses than a not perfectly maintained chain...
With an engine as torquey and powerful as the MOTUS' you need TC in rain and I did not see any ABS on the prototypes...
If they want to be a "premium product" charging premium price they better get with the program.
A chain on a rich man's sporty touring bike is already a big turn off made in usa or not...
It's a long way to the top if you wanna rock'n roll...
dood ! you forget about the 90 degree bevel drive gear (rear gear)present in all shaft drive apps.chain drive will always be more efficient,even in the motus with the 90 degree drive up front . and only pussies need tc and abs
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Old 09-06-2011, 08:00 PM   #588
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boxer-lust View Post
I have only seen the MOTUS bikes in Laguna Seca.
As for the shaft having more parasitic losses than a chain that is only true with shaft driven bikes like inline-4's where the power has to be angled at 90 degrees.
A Boxer,Guzzi ot MOTUS shaft with a longitudional crank would have actually less parasitic losses than a not perfectly maintained chain...
With an engine as torquey and powerful as the MOTUS' you need TC in rain and I did not see any ABS on the prototypes...
If they want to be a "premium product" charging premium price they better get with the program.
A chain on a rich man's sporty touring bike is already a big turn off made in usa or not...
It's a long way to the top if you wanna rock'n roll...
Glad to see that the Motus is not for you (like all bikes are these days). You don't get the concept. You don't understand what the bike really is and what it does for some people.

That's fine. Stop looking for something that isn't there for you. It never will be.

The rest of us, however, will be waiting for our turn to try one.
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Old 09-06-2011, 08:09 PM   #589
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The rest of us, however, will be waiting for our turn to buy one.



(I'd love a belt though... )
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Old 09-06-2011, 09:11 PM   #590
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10,000 miles on a chain is fairly common and not at all impressive.
On a touring biased machine with a chain drive an enclosure for the chain is the ticket. With a proper enclosure , the chain stays clean, is protected from water when it rains and runs in it's own supply of grease. A set up like that will yeild a 50,000 mile life.
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Old 09-07-2011, 07:38 AM   #591
dceggert
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bk brkr baker View Post
10,000 miles on a chain is fairly common and not at all impressive.
On a touring biased machine with a chain drive an enclosure for the chain is the ticket. With a proper enclosure , the chain stays clean, is protected from water when it rains and runs in it's own supply of grease. A set up like that will yeild a 50,000 mile life.
Yup, and a good autotensioner as well. Think 'timing chain' on your 4-wheeler. Most people never think about the chain running in there but most engines have at least one! Reliability is great!
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Old 09-07-2011, 07:44 AM   #592
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boxer-lust View Post
I have only seen the MOTUS bikes in Laguna Seca.
As for the shaft having more parasitic losses than a chain that is only true with shaft driven bikes like inline-4's where the power has to be angled at 90 degrees.
A Boxer,Guzzi ot MOTUS shaft with a longitudional crank would have actually less parasitic losses than a not perfectly maintained chain...
With an engine as torquey and powerful as the MOTUS' you need TC in rain and I did not see any ABS on the prototypes...
If they want to be a "premium product" charging premium price they better get with the program.
A chain on a rich man's sporty touring bike is already a big turn off made in usa or not...
It's a long way to the top if you wanna rock'n roll...
You're absolutely wrong. Ring & Pinion setups are more parasitic due to excess friction/drag. I've never found a chain and sprocket setup that generates temperatures of 150 - 200 degrees under normal operating conditions. This is an every day occurrence for a ring & pinion, despite the fact that it runs in a bath of lubricant. When you put your hand on your BMW final drive after a couple of hours of riding and it's hot to the touch, ask yourself where all of that heat comes from.

I know you are a BMW fanboi and that's fine if that's what you want to be. But don't attempt to misrepresent facts to forward your own agenda.
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Old 09-07-2011, 07:47 AM   #593
Boxer-lust
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MOTUS vs ST1300

Kirb,not true!
I like the idea of a sporty and practical bike a lot.Low maintenance with hydraulic lifters,too.In this reagard the MOTUS is an interesting concept that could fit the bill.
But unfortunately the bike has a big flaw.Chaindrive doesn't fit the picture especially since the crank is perfect for shaftdrive like a BMW or Moto Guzzi...
A bike more torquey than a Hayabusa will stretch and eat chains and to give the excuse of parasitic losses (which is not true) or weight on a already 260Kg heavy bike is plain ridicolous...
And of course ABS and TC is only for pussies;like Rossi,Lorenzo and Stoner who won't ride around without that stuff either even if their bikes make way less torque and have much stickier tires...
If MOTUS is serious and they can't design their own driveshaft Getrag happily will do it for them like they did for Yamaha in 1977 when they came out with their XS750...
Until then compared to the ST1300 with the MOTUS you get 300cc more,hydraulic lifters and made in usa label but no ABS or cleandrive shaft for twice the money.
Sorry but I don't see too many takers after the first excitement is over.
With driveshaft and a modern ABS/TC combo they might have a fighting chance...
But lets get real as big and heavy as it is and no matter what the PR wants us to believe the MOTUS is no sportbike.Or maybe only in america where some people think of a Sportster being one...
But done right the MOTUS could become a sporty tourer and viable alternative to RT/GT/ST/FJR/C14...
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Old 09-07-2011, 07:57 AM   #594
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boxer-lust View Post
I have only seen the MOTUS bikes in Laguna Seca.
As for the shaft having more parasitic losses than a chain that is only true with shaft driven bikes like inline-4's where the power has to be angled at 90 degrees.
A Boxer,Guzzi ot MOTUS shaft with a longitudional crank would have actually less parasitic losses than a not perfectly maintained chain...
With an engine as torquey and powerful as the MOTUS' you need TC in rain and I did not see any ABS on the prototypes...
If they want to be a "premium product" charging premium price they better get with the program.
A chain on a rich man's sporty touring bike is already a big turn off made in usa or not...
It's a long way to the top if you wanna rock'n roll...
Chains have been doing OK for Ducati and I'd call the Multistrada and Diavel a 'Premium Product'. I think they also have a wee bit o horsepower going to the back wheel and frankly I have never heard of anyone complain of a chain on a Ducati, nor bitch about them wearing out.
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Old 09-07-2011, 08:14 AM   #595
Bueller
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boxer-lust View Post
Kirb,not true!
I like the idea of a sporty and practical bike a lot.Low maintenance with hydraulic lifters,too.In this reagard the MOTUS is an interesting concept that could fit the bill.
But unfortunately the bike has a big flaw.Chaindrive doesn't fit the picture especially since the crank is perfect for shaftdrive like a BMW or Moto Guzzi...
A bike more torquey than a Hayabusa will stretch and eat chains and to give the excuse of parasitic losses (which is not true) or weight on a already 260Kg heavy bike is plain ridicolous...
And of course ABS and TC is only for pussies;like Rossi,Lorenzo and Stoner who won't ride around without that stuff either even if their bikes make way less torque and have much stickier tires...
If MOTUS is serious and they can't design their own driveshaft Getrag happily will do it for them like they did for Yamaha in 1977 when they came out with their XS750...
Until then compared to the ST1300 with the MOTUS you get 300cc more,hydraulic lifters and made in usa label but no ABS or cleandrive shaft for twice the money.
Sorry but I don't see too many takers after the first excitement is over.
With driveshaft and a modern ABS/TC combo they might have a fighting chance...
But lets get real as big and heavy as it is and no matter what the PR wants us to believe the MOTUS is no sportbike.Or maybe only in america where some people think of a Sportster being one...
But done right the MOTUS could become a sporty tourer and viable alternative to RT/GT/ST/FJR/C14...
Apparently you don't know this, but just because you claim parasitic losses through shaft drive systems are not greater than a chain doesn't make it so. I'd suggest you post some proof of your claim.

Additionally, chains don't "stretch". You have a lot to learn, young fanboi.
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Old 09-07-2011, 08:41 AM   #596
Boxer-lust
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Bueller calling someone "fanboi" doesn't make a strong argument...
Anyways I remember a european magazine putting 2 bikes on a dyno and taking the power from the clutch and rear wheel.One was a Honda VTR 1000 the other a BMW R1100S.The difference between clutch and rearwheel was the prasitic loss.Both bikes lost around 10% between clutch and rearwheel.
Chain and shaft were the same.Than they put a slightly sticky badly maintained chain on the Honda and the loss went to 12%,more loss than the driveshaft...
They also put a XJ900 with inline four and shaft on it where the power had to be transformed another 90 degree due to the axis of the crank.Yes here the loss was 5% more compared to the chain or straight through crank/shaftdrive of the BMW.
So your argument is wrong or plain ridicolous especially if you already have a super strong 1600 cc engine that definately will wear strech chains and eat sprockets...
I wish them luck but I can't see that a lot of people who have the money and like the idea of a practical touring bike with sporty pretensions like to be hassled with chaindrive...i.m.h.o...of course.
They know that this will be their cryptonite because they said a belt can't take the power.
I say have someone design a driveshaft system if you want to be a serious contender.
Who would buy a ST,GT,FJR,C14 with a "power sapping driveshaft"...
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Old 09-07-2011, 09:13 AM   #597
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Can we just say 'you are right' to all sides of this and drop it now?
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Old 09-07-2011, 09:16 AM   #598
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Originally Posted by dceggert View Post
Can we just say 'you are right' to all sides of this and drop it now?
Woo hoo, I'm right.
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Old 09-07-2011, 09:23 AM   #599
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boxer-lust View Post
Who would buy a ST,GT,FJR,C14 with a "power sapping driveshaft"...
I have a K1200R BMW and that bike makes plenty of power, far more than I use on a daily basis. If it had come with a chain drive I still would have bought it. And I do consider it to be a sport/touring machine. If I really like the Motus, and it doesn't have a shaft drive, it won't stop me from buying it. Just my two cents as a long time BMW fan.
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Old 09-07-2011, 10:06 AM   #600
kirb
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boxer-lust View Post
Kirb,not true!
I like the idea of a sporty and practical bike a lot.Low maintenance with hydraulic lifters,too.In this reagard the MOTUS is an interesting concept that could fit the bill.
But unfortunately the bike has a big flaw.Chaindrive doesn't fit the picture especially since the crank is perfect for shaftdrive like a BMW or Moto Guzzi...
A bike more torquey than a Hayabusa will stretch and eat chains and to give the excuse of parasitic losses (which is not true) or weight on a already 260Kg heavy bike is plain ridicolous...
And of course ABS and TC is only for pussies;like Rossi,Lorenzo and Stoner who won't ride around without that stuff either even if their bikes make way less torque and have much stickier tires...
If MOTUS is serious and they can't design their own driveshaft Getrag happily will do it for them like they did for Yamaha in 1977 when they came out with their XS750...
Until then compared to the ST1300 with the MOTUS you get 300cc more,hydraulic lifters and made in usa label but no ABS or cleandrive shaft for twice the money.
Sorry but I don't see too many takers after the first excitement is over.
With driveshaft and a modern ABS/TC combo they might have a fighting chance...
But lets get real as big and heavy as it is and no matter what the PR wants us to believe the MOTUS is no sportbike.Or maybe only in america where some people think of a Sportster being one...
But done right the MOTUS could become a sporty tourer and viable alternative to RT/GT/ST/FJR/C14...
I own an FJR for over 5 years now. I used to own a ST1100 before that. I would drive over your mother with both of them to buy a Motus at $25k or less. It's not a bloated, over-complicated, heavy touring rig. It's a lighter, fast, touring rig without a lot of bullshit to deal with. Simple sells, Exclusive sells.

You are trying to rationalize a small unit MFG with everyone else. The Motus isn't like anything else. It is for sure not for you as you do not get what it is and what it isn't.

Quote:
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...i.m.h.o...of course.
There is nothing humble about your opinion.
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