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Old 04-07-2012, 08:20 AM   #1231
bross
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boxer-lust View Post
I don't give a shit who rides what but facts are facts...
I had never any problems with driveshafts on my beemers but would change them as preventive maintenance around the 80K mark...
Now that's a great recommendation for a shaft if I've ever heard one. Maybe if you lubed your splines they'd last a little longer than 80k. Do you ever here of Goldwing riders, or FJR riders or heck pick any old shaft driven Japanese bike from the 80s; complain about their shaft drive or replace them. Many, many GW and FJR riders pile on hundreds of thousands of miles and wouldn't think of "changing the shaft" as a preventative measure. Wow!
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Old 04-07-2012, 08:40 AM   #1232
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Originally Posted by bross View Post
Now that's a great recommendation for a shaft if I've ever heard one. Maybe if you lubed your splines they'd last a little longer than 80k. Do you ever here of Goldwing riders, or FJR riders or heck pick any old shaft driven Japanese bike from the 80s; complain about their shaft drive or replace them. Many, many GW and FJR riders pile on hundreds of thousands of miles and wouldn't think of "changing the shaft" as a preventative measure. Wow!
Changing... drive shaft... yeah, that sounds solid. Shit, got a couple hours this afternoon, I'll just go out and change my final drive. Damn, I should do this every week! I'm such a fool....
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Old 04-07-2012, 08:54 AM   #1233
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Old 04-07-2012, 06:46 PM   #1234
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I just can't see how this is going to work. At $30,000+ for a base model, and $35,000 for the upscale model, they have priced this thing above Harley, BMW, Ducati, and a top of the line Goldwing. Most Harley, BMW, Ducati, and Goldwing riders are brand loyal to the core, so I don't think any of them will be buying one of these. Those that ride Japanese sport tourers like the FJR, ST, and Concours are not likely to pay double for one of these. There is an old saying in retail. You can sell a FEW of anything. But once those buyers have one, the market is likely to disappear. I see shades of Excelsior Henderson here. They priced their bike too high, mismarketed it, trying to sell a name rather than a motorcycle (yes, Harley gets away with it, but their name is 110 years old, plus you never have to worry about Harley parts) This company has what looks like a decent enough bike (except for the chain drive) but it is seriously overpriced, and lacks a solid foundation, and future support. If the company fails on startup like EH, owners will be left with bikes they cannot get parts or service for. I'd take an FJR or ST any day, but I can't even afford one of those, not new anyway. If I could have any bike I wanted, at my age and in my condition, it would be a new Goldwing. But because of the price, that will never happen. I'll have to make do with my 1985 model.
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Old 04-07-2012, 06:56 PM   #1235
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Originally Posted by apessino View Post
The "rumor" came from the fact that MOTUS repeatedly stated that the pricing would be "competitive with similar offerings from Ducati and BMW," hence the speculation that low to mid $20K would be reasonable to expect (and even generous, given the price of the Multistrada).

Whew, at +30K it was going to have a shaft to convince me to buy one...
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Old 04-07-2012, 07:01 PM   #1236
JerryH
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Originally Posted by bross View Post
Now that's a great recommendation for a shaft if I've ever heard one. Maybe if you lubed your splines they'd last a little longer than 80k. Do you ever here of Goldwing riders, or FJR riders or heck pick any old shaft driven Japanese bike from the 80s; complain about their shaft drive or replace them. Many, many GW and FJR riders pile on hundreds of thousands of miles and wouldn't think of "changing the shaft" as a preventative measure. Wow!

There is at least one exception to that, and I own one. The Kawasaki Vulcan 750, from 1985 through 2006 requires it's driveshaft splines to be lubed every 10,000 miles, or it will chew them up. And unfortunately, if that happens, it also chews up the splines on the final drive gearcase and engine output shaft, doing about $2500 worth of damage. Even though the Vulcan was made for 22 straight years, there aren't many of them around. My guess is that is what happened to most of them.

My '85 Goldwing, which I bought with 56,000 miles on it, will go 4 times that long. It's rear splines are lubricated by gear oil from the final drive gearcase. When I first got it, I tore it down, and did a full spline lube on it. Splines looked like new. It now has just over 100,000 miles on it, and 10,000 miles ago I did another spline lube, and the splines still looked like new. Hoping for 200,000 out of it.

But BMWs do have a reputation for eating final drives, you would think a company like BMW would have solved that problem long ago. It has been my experience that final drive parts on shaft drive bikes are not made out of hard enough metal. BMW, for what their bikes cost, could have used the hardest metal in existence.

Shaft drives could also be designed the way they are on cars, and like the rear splines on a Goldwing are. Use the final drive gear oil to lube the rear splines, and engine oil to lube the front splines. All it would take is a couple of oil seals.
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Old 04-07-2012, 07:35 PM   #1237
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Originally Posted by Boxer-lust View Post
Enough said !

By you ?
I f@#king hope so !
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Old 04-07-2012, 09:19 PM   #1238
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Originally Posted by JerryH View Post
I just can't see how this is going to work. At $30,000+ for a base model, and $35,000 for the upscale model, they have priced this thing above Harley, BMW, Ducati, and a top of the line Goldwing. Most Harley, BMW, Ducati, and Goldwing riders are brand loyal to the core, so I don't think any of them will be buying one of these. Those that ride Japanese sport tourers like the FJR, ST, and Concours are not likely to pay double for one of these. There is an old saying in retail. You can sell a FEW of anything. But once those buyers have one, the market is likely to disappear. I see shades of Excelsior Henderson here. They priced their bike too high, mismarketed it, trying to sell a name rather than a motorcycle (yes, Harley gets away with it, but their name is 110 years old, plus you never have to worry about Harley parts) This company has what looks like a decent enough bike (except for the chain drive) but it is seriously overpriced, and lacks a solid foundation, and future support. If the company fails on startup like EH, owners will be left with bikes they cannot get parts or service for. I'd take an FJR or ST any day, but I can't even afford one of those, not new anyway. If I could have any bike I wanted, at my age and in my condition, it would be a new Goldwing. But because of the price, that will never happen. I'll have to make do with my 1985 model.
Owning a EH I can shed a light on this-
You can get parts, just about any of them. Not difficult. Several places bought up all the parts from the factory.
You can get service- just about anywhere. They are not that hard to work on and have a very loyal internet following for info.
You can also custom tune your bike with $300 in software and make it run perfect...something you can't do for a lot of bikes.
EH is different than Motus- they were a typical venture capital firm:
Borrow 110 million from investors, promise a ROI, build factory to meet promised ROI, and sales don't match. They laid a good line of BS, overspent, didn't plan for failure or lack of sales.

Motus can ebb and flow with sales so models don't sit on the floor. They don't need big expensive dealers, just exotic ones. Should be an interesting ride to watch.
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Old 04-07-2012, 10:12 PM   #1239
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The "rumor" came from the fact that MOTUS repeatedly stated that the pricing would be "competitive with similar offerings from Ducati and BMW," hence the speculation that low to mid $20K would be reasonable to expect (and even generous, given the price of the Multistrada).
Piss poor management of expectations, far and away the company's biggest mistake - the employee that said that really fucked it up for a lot of people. I think most people, myself included, knew that was BS, and didn't believe the Motus could be made for 20 grand a pop.
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Old 04-08-2012, 01:36 AM   #1240
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Originally Posted by Krasniewski View Post
Piss poor management of expectations, far and away the company's biggest mistake - the employee that said that really fucked it up for a lot of people. I think most people, myself included, knew that was BS, and didn't believe the Motus could be made for 20 grand a pop.

When I saw that, I inferred that by "similar" they meant low-volume special, and so was not surprised to see their range-topper match the Ducati 1198R at about $40K. And frankly, to me the Motus looks like way better value.

I too would have been stunned if they had matched the Multi 1200S, the R1200RT or even the K1600GT, all produced in large multiples of the Motus numbers.

Okay that is it from me on the price thing. Even to my own ears, I am sounding like a scratched LP.
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Old 04-08-2012, 04:43 AM   #1241
NC Scott
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I've been watching bits and pieces of Barrett-Jackson's Palm Beach auction this weekend on Speedtv. Car after car crossing the block and going for $30K +. I realize that this is a collector car market and not entirely related to motorcycles, but I see it as a boatload of people spending a boatload of money on their hobby.

I don't know what the commissions and auction fees add up to, but a $30,000 hammer price likely means closer to $35,0000 out-the-door. The money is definitely out there. There just may be more Motus buyers in the Barrett-Jackson crowd than in the ADV crowd.
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Old 04-08-2012, 05:05 AM   #1242
GB
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Originally Posted by Bueller View Post
There's really only one way to end this discussion:

You're right. the MOTUS is crap. Every bike that doesn't fall into favor with you is crap. Screw logic, science, engineering, and absolute fact. You're just right. How can the rest of us ever repent for our sins?
Guys.. we have the IGNORE function, just go to a certain inmate's username, then View Public Profile, then click on User lists, and then select Add to Ignore list.

Ignore is truly bliss
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Old 04-08-2012, 05:21 AM   #1243
RydRy
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I have to wonder what MOTUS guys think of all this and BE SURE, THEY ARE READING IT!!! maybe they thought "any talk about us is good" but Id say this all equals a bunch of pissed off people and a few who are supportive but Id imagine, not customers :) so in the end hey MOTUS speak up.......come on STEP UP
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Old 04-08-2012, 06:54 AM   #1244
Yostwerks
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I've owned several sport touring bikes over the years, and find the price of the Motus both
arrogant and insulting... and I'm one of those who can afford to buy one.

I certainly welcome comments by Motus management justifying the cost of the emperors new clothes.
That's the least they can do considering all the attention and free press they've been given by us !

Tom
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Old 04-08-2012, 07:07 AM   #1245
scrannel
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The Motus is what it is, costs what it costs. If you want one. Get one. I could also afford this bike and if I didn't already have what I consider the best sports/touring machine available then the Motus would have been in my sights. Maybe someday it will be. So, it's not just price. But I would end up riding my K12r and I don't want to buy a bike to have it sit in the garage. Maybe they plan a super-striped down "sportster"-like version in the future.

As far as the collector thing goes... I don't think this bike would qualify for a very long time.. People want "period" machines or something with a racing pedigree.
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