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Old 12-20-2009, 02:39 PM   #151
kraven
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PJ, less is more. You might consider that you have too much crap.
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Old 12-20-2009, 03:36 PM   #152
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PirateJohn
I think that the maximum towing capacity of a Land Rover Disco II is around 5,500 lbs. My current open trailer weighs something like 4,000 lbs. empty, so you see one of the issues.
4,000 lbs for an empty trailer????
that thing ways more than many cars!
good grief. wouldn't it be easier to just tow the bimmer behind the range rover directly, without a trailer?
it's rear wheel drive, so just remove the drive shaft & you should be good-to-go.
as far as the bikes, your RV should be able to tow a shop trailer that can contain the bikes.
problem solved.
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Old 12-21-2009, 02:55 AM   #153
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bumfuzzle
I think it's telling that somebody comes on here and asks a question about dropping out of the rat race, riding, and living cheap somewhere new for awhile, only to have the conversation veer off to a long discussion of vehicle registration cost talk.

Almost everybody dreams of taking off and living the good life, but very very few ever follow through.

Somebody mentioned my website www.bumfuzzle.com back on page 1 of this thread and I was then written off as having made too much money to count. The truth is that I did make some money, but my wife and I also sold our condo, and every last belonging we owned. All of our belongings now fit in our car. We sailed around the world and spent more than we needed to thinking all along that we'd return and go back to work. But by the time we got back we realized that the last thing in the world we wanted to do was go back to Chicago and work. So we drove around in an old VW bus for a couple of years. Yes, my wife lived in the back of a fifty year old bus for two years. She's a rockstar. Now we're living in Mexico, just had a baby down here, and are contemplating our next move.

Anyway, it does take money. I don't think most people will find that their cost of living will be nearly as low as they think it would be. I'd be very suspect of the RV guy who says he lived for three hundred bucks one month. Could you do it for one month? Sure. But what about the next month when you need to get gas or restock your food.

The thing is, I'd guess that almost everybody on here could do it for a couple of years if they were willing to truly drop out and sell everything they own. It takes guts though to know that when the well runs dry you are going to be starting from scratch. My wife and I are on that path. We're not rich retirees, and at some point we're going to have to find a way to make money again. But for now we've just had the greatest six years of anybody's life. And life just seems to work out in the end anyway doesn't it?

So my long answer to the original question on this post is that most countries in Central America are doable on the cheap. Forget what you've read about Costa Rica and Panama though and go to Nicaragua or El Salvador. The biggest cost is going to be getting yourself and your bike there and settled in. It's not cheap to drive a few thousand miles and then find a place to live.

Lastly, if you do go, I think you'll find that your priorities change rather quickly and that even if you were to move back to the States you would live much more cheaply. My wife and I don't have cell phones, cable bills, insurance, new clothes, ipods, new computers, or Christmas gifts to buy. We live well within our means and are happy to do so, so that we can live life the way we want instead of how our parents society tells us we should.

So good luck. I really wish for everybody that they can have these sorts of experiences before they get too old and can't ride anymore.

Pat Schulte
bumfuzzle.com
Great post - great perspective.
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Old 12-21-2009, 07:50 AM   #154
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kraven
PJ, less is more. You might consider that you have too much crap.

But can one ever have too many motorcycles, parts, and tools?

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Old 12-21-2009, 07:51 AM   #155
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Originally Posted by ywr969
4,000 lbs for an empty trailer????
that thing ways more than many cars!

It's pretty stout. I wanted something that would hold up if I took it into Mexico.
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Old 12-21-2009, 04:16 PM   #156
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bumfuzzle
I think it's telling that somebody comes on here and asks a question about dropping out of the rat race, riding, and living cheap somewhere new for awhile, only to have the conversation veer off to a long discussion of vehicle registration cost talk.

Almost everybody dreams of taking off and living the good life, but very very few ever follow through.

Somebody mentioned my website www.bumfuzzle.com back on page 1 of this thread and I was then written off as having made too much money to count. The truth is that I did make some money, but my wife and I also sold our condo, and every last belonging we owned. All of our belongings now fit in our car. We sailed around the world and spent more than we needed to thinking all along that we'd return and go back to work. But by the time we got back we realized that the last thing in the world we wanted to do was go back to Chicago and work. So we drove around in an old VW bus for a couple of years. Yes, my wife lived in the back of a fifty year old bus for two years. She's a rockstar. Now we're living in Mexico, just had a baby down here, and are contemplating our next move.

Anyway, it does take money. I don't think most people will find that their cost of living will be nearly as low as they think it would be. I'd be very suspect of the RV guy who says he lived for three hundred bucks one month. Could you do it for one month? Sure. But what about the next month when you need to get gas or restock your food.

The thing is, I'd guess that almost everybody on here could do it for a couple of years if they were willing to truly drop out and sell everything they own. It takes guts though to know that when the well runs dry you are going to be starting from scratch. My wife and I are on that path. We're not rich retirees, and at some point we're going to have to find a way to make money again. But for now we've just had the greatest six years of anybody's life. And life just seems to work out in the end anyway doesn't it?

So my long answer to the original question on this post is that most countries in Central America are doable on the cheap. Forget what you've read about Costa Rica and Panama though and go to Nicaragua or El Salvador. The biggest cost is going to be getting yourself and your bike there and settled in. It's not cheap to drive a few thousand miles and then find a place to live.

Lastly, if you do go, I think you'll find that your priorities change rather quickly and that even if you were to move back to the States you would live much more cheaply. My wife and I don't have cell phones, cable bills, insurance, new clothes, ipods, new computers, or Christmas gifts to buy. We live well within our means and are happy to do so, so that we can live life the way we want instead of how our parents society tells us we should.

So good luck. I really wish for everybody that they can have these sorts of experiences before they get too old and can't ride anymore.

Pat Schulte
bumfuzzle.com
just for the hell of it I checked out your website

very cool and you made some pretty cool choices to get out of the ratrace

I am impressed and I think it takes serious cojones to make that call.

but as to costs

holy fuck

I just did some quick notepad math here, so maybe I missed something but here is how it broke down for just the boat trip

From Sep '03 until April of '07 (43 months) your monthly costs ran to a total of $131,142.00 with repair costs of $5,244.00 for a engine replacement on the sailboat and then $33,538.00 when the hull started to delaminate link.

Total costs, not including the boat, of $169,916.00.

Total average monthly cost of the voyage of $3,951.48.

This does not take into account the purchase price of the boat less the selling price (assuming it was sold, I have not been all the way through the website yet). A Wildcat35 is about a $200,000.00 boat new. A quick search of the internet shows a nice 2003 seems to run around 130K to 150K right now. Lets just say, for the sake of argument that your then ten month old boat was sold after three years of cruising for $30,000 less than you paid for it in 2003. A loss of that size takes us to $4,649.30 a month.

No matter how you cut it, almost 4 stacks a month going out with nothing coming in for over three years is simply not doable for most humans. Factor in the guess on the boat costs and you are getting closer to five stacks a month going out.

As for Jkam and his RV. I know Jkam. Jkam is a friend of mine, and Bumfuzzle is no Jkam.

I am not saying anything about the inherent value of either approach. Given the choice of steak or a peanut butter sandwich, I almost always pick the steak.

What Jkam is doing is probably closer to the spirit of the original question. Jay really does do it on the time vs. money plan. He is out there on the road and his costs vary month to month to be sure, but I bet he keeps it under four digits on a pretty regular basis.

I am grateful that the Bumfuzzle website is there and I intend to read all of it and probably buy the book, but traveling on the cheap it ain't. I think it was brave of you to post the costs and I would bet it is one of the more accurate ones available anywhere on the net.

That sort of travel requires a serious nest egg to plunder and no one counting on you to eat. Not a reality for most of us.
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Old 12-21-2009, 10:10 PM   #157
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Super Suz
I am just curiious if anyone here has been laid off or knows someone who was laid off and then put all the stuff in storage to go "lay low" for a while in a country where they can live cheaply.
I do this every year. The company I work for basically pays for everything while I work for them in the summer. I save my money carefully and dont work for the other 6 months and go traveling. Usually someplace warm and cheap.
For me, right now, I think its great. I often 'work' when i travel, but since wages are connected to cost of living, its more of a means of keeping myself occupied than earning a living.

IMO, its all about compromise. I dont have a wife, kids, house or any debts, and I think this is the required tradeoff to be able to do this. Also be prepared to lower your standards of living, privacy, cleanliness and personal belongings.

But is it worth it? HELL YA! Memories and experiences are priceless and irreplaceable.
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Old 12-22-2009, 02:55 AM   #158
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Quote:
Originally Posted by greenthumb
I do this every year. The company I work for basically pays for everything while I work for them in the summer. I save my money carefully and dont work for the other 6 months and go traveling. Usually someplace warm and cheap.
For me, right now, I think its great. I often 'work' when i travel, but since wages are connected to cost of living, its more of a means of keeping myself occupied than earning a living.

IMO, its all about compromise. I dont have a wife, kids, house or any debts, and I think this is the required tradeoff to be able to do this. Also be prepared to lower your standards of living, privacy, cleanliness and personal belongings.

I don't think that anyone has the perfect answer, but I was impressed when one of our inmates that I have discussed some Mexican travel with told me that he got by on an income of $8K per year. A frugal lifestyle, girlfriend that covered some expenses in exchange for him exploring on her behalf, friends south of the border, and a modest inheritance meant that he could tour South American for about 6 months of the year.

Where there is a will, there is a way.

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Old 12-22-2009, 07:25 AM   #159
ywr969
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PirateJohn
...a modest inheritance meant that he could tour South American for about 6 months of the year. Where there is a will, there is a way.
sounds like where there is a will, he's in it.

you're absolutely right, PJ (and others). it's all about setting priorities & making plans. if you want to travel for 6 months, save like crazy the rest of the time & learn to live very frugally. as benjamin franklin taught us: a penny saved is a penny earned. that kind of thinking leads to shedding debt (all debt, including your mortgage), stop eating out, ditch the cable (but keep the internet connection! ), etc. think twice before making any purchases, because every $ spent is less money that you'll have for your travel.
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Old 12-22-2009, 08:23 AM   #160
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ywr969
sounds like where there is a will, he's in it.


Of course, it's very important to mention that if you haven't been somewhere, don't develop doe-eyed ideals about what it is and isn't.
The perspective of a place changes when you go from being a well heeled gringo to a road bum with empty pockets.

It's also very easy to drop off the radar in the US and stay in CONUS without ever needing a visa or passport to slow you down.

Working while adventuring is how most people bum around the world. Living off your savings and starting from nothing when you're done isn't the only way to fly.
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Old 12-22-2009, 10:05 AM   #161
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Originally Posted by guzzigeezer
I
To a Somalian refugee it's water to drink and food to eat. Each to his own.

Who's being arrogant and elitist???
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Old 12-22-2009, 09:45 PM   #162
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PirateJohn

And I think (knocking on wood) that he's spot on when he talks about how we all simplify and slim down. If it doesn't fit into a motor home then it's not important, although I am looking for a way to move my bikes and workshop into a trailer so that they can move along with us as we wander.
Yeah, and then it's such a bitch to back the rig up... I could tell about a couple of hairballs. My rig is about 75 ft long, so even 40' OTR rigs don't mess with it!
I used oregon to register the rigs. I had the registration sent to a PO box in another state OK.
FL is the residence I use, which is income tax free.
After 6 months from purchase date (little known secret) FL no longer assesses the sales tax when a vehicle is being registered. Go in to register before the 6 month date, and you get hit with 5+% sales tax, (OUCH). This means that the temporary tags don't last long enough.
This sales tax issue was the primary reason for using OR to initially register, not the plate charges. You are talking 5+% of say $250 - 300K!
So, you buy a rig anywhere the price is best; get the temp. using your predetermined OR (or other sales tax free) address; then have it registered in OR or other state; then reside in an income tax free state, if you like, and possibly register the toys, but only after 6 months... Or just keep the rig registered in OR or other state.

RVing is not cheap however. A modern motor home, even less expensive ones, are significantly more complex than a house. Strange as that may seem. Things break, but a quality build and a rig with less than 100K miles, will have an easy 100 - 150K left if maintained. Maint. is crucial however. I have found that being informed and involved cuts down on costs. I can and do maintain the pvc plumbing system pretty easily.
And, because they are really complex creatures, maint. is not as easy mentally as say, a car. Plumbing anyone. And they are way different from your house. Chassis levelling system, anyone.
My rig has a dual 'command center' on an iside wall, about halfway to the back. This is not the 'command center' where I drive from. But it is like twice as complicated. It has buttons, and dials, and readouts galore... maybe 20 or 25 even!

Another fundamental cost is camping, especially when you haul a trailer (LOL). Boondocking has it's limitations, especially out in the desert, in a 25 year old Fleetwood, in a 40 knot 'breeze'. Even monthly, rates in a good RV park are $30 - 60 a day, especially in season. My travelling over the last 10 years though has been more point to point, with interests to attend to on each end. This meant that my meandering and parking for a couple of weeks in the boonies, was mostly kept to a minimum.
Advantages of the motorhome though, offset the costs and disadvantages by a mile, and are all that have been stated and more! It just depends on how far off the grid you want to get. The gypsies had and have a pretty good thing going, if the wine and the cheese are any good.
Whatever it is, getting more connected and saying goodby to the cubical life is compelling.
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Old 12-22-2009, 10:26 PM   #163
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lymanwhite
You are talking 5+% of say $250 - 300K!
i bought used for 1/20 of that price.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lymanwhite
Boondocking has it's limitations, especially out in the desert, in a 25 year old Fleetwood, in a 40 knot 'breeze'.
i resemble that remark!

Quote:
Originally Posted by lymanwhite
Even monthly, rates in a good RV park are $30 - 60 a day, especially in season.
i'm waaaaaaaaaay too cheap for those kind of prices (see KLR in .sig )
we paid $375/month up in the high country this past summer, & that included everything: power, water, sewer, garbage, & a very spacious, secluded lot with plenty of trees & nice weather.
it pays to shop around.
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Old 12-22-2009, 11:43 PM   #164
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ywr969
i'm waaaaaaaaaay too cheap for those kind of prices (see KLR in .sig )
we paid $375/month up in the high country this past summer, & that included everything: power, water, sewer, garbage, & a very spacious, secluded lot with plenty of trees & nice weather.
it pays to shop around.


Girlfriend really, really surprised me by finding a work camping gig. She's been running the kitchen here in exchange for lot rent and electricity.
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Old 12-23-2009, 08:19 AM   #165
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PirateJohn
Girlfriend really, really surprised me by finding a work camping gig. She's been running the kitchen here in exchange for lot rent and electricity.
now that really hits the nail on the head!
that's what this thread is about -- lying low on the cheap!
are you sure that you don't own a KLR?
because you definitely have potential!
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