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Old 04-17-2012, 08:37 PM   #1081
ben2go
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You guys may be interested in reading this.

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/tax-ti...204320491.html
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Old 04-18-2012, 11:19 AM   #1082
Witold
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Originally Posted by ben2go View Post
You guys may be interested in reading this.

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/tax-ti...204320491.html
Being a US citizen is often a big PIA if you have a typical life in a different country. I would guess most of those renouncing their citizenship have not lived in US for decades.

It's pretty ridiculous that Americans have to pay US taxes on income earned abroad and follow US laws when they are abroad but it is what it is.
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Old 05-04-2012, 09:37 PM   #1083
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am retiring in a month and slowly working my way through the entire thread, excellent stuff.....anyway there was an interesting article on the book made after this post and it sounds like much of the book is fiction or at the least heavily embellished http://reason.com/archives/2011/04/0...ley/singlepage ....still an excellent book though but it might be better to think of it as a novel like Steinbeck's other books, read most of them long ago and enjoyed them greatly
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Old 05-05-2012, 09:29 AM   #1084
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Originally Posted by Witold View Post
Being a US citizen is often a big PIA if you have a typical life in a different country. I would guess most of those renouncing their citizenship have not lived in US for decades.

It's pretty ridiculous that Americans have to pay US taxes on income earned abroad and follow US laws when they are abroad but it is what it is.
While nothing is impossible I would say that if you have a legal entrepreneurial foreign income and it's under a few million a year then you have little to worry about. Few countries that we have discussed will extradite you back to the USA for tax matters, and they have trouble calculating income for their own tax purposes, never mind assisting the IRS.
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Old 05-05-2012, 10:20 AM   #1085
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While nothing is impossible I would say that if you have a legal entrepreneurial foreign income and it's under a few million a year then you have little to worry about. Few countries that we have discussed will extradite you back to the USA for tax matters, and they have trouble calculating income for their own tax purposes, never mind assisting the IRS.
you can earn up to $92,900 overseas tax exempt in the US. you technically still need to file however and fill out the proper forms.
http://www.overseastaxservices.com/i...Itemid=57#sec2

...now if you have no income from the US and no records ie W2, 1099, SS heading to the IRS each year and you don't file...are they really gonna know about your foreign income?

not sure if foreign income affects future SS payments, but I doubt it.
you'll still have to deal w/ the local tax issue of the country you're earning the $ however.

when i was living in mexico i meet expats working full time, from professional, tourism, real estate to waiting tables and i asked about taxes (as i was thinking about working myself). they basicly all said, i live in mexico full time, i get paid in mexico and it didn't go beyond there as far as IRS is concerned.

take that how you want.
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Old 05-05-2012, 10:26 AM   #1086
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some of the most successful entrepreneurs in the world have no degrees, bailed on finishing or do just average or below if they finished.

the entrepreneurial mindset and rank and order study and take test mindset are often very far apart.

when i talk w/ other business owners, most felt college did very little for them running a business in the real world. they felt college was intake and spit back out and then stop for the day, but as a business owner there was still 6 more hrs of work to do. college did not teach you how to work long and hard and persist awhile properly dealing with setbacks.

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My Grandfather was a non-degreed engineer. He worked for Grumman Aerospace for over 40 years. He helped put fighters in the sky in wartime, the first men on the moon (safely), and later in his career was an educator in the vocational school system (under the auspices of Grumman). He retired in the 1970s.

That career path is rare if not impossible to duplicate today. And like PirateJohn said, family ties and apprenticeship are usually required. Whether formal or informal, education is never a waste though debt can make it seem so. Whether you realize it or not, your education and life experiences make you who you are today and your view of the world is affected by these. Your problem solving skills will be sharper, your communication skills honed. Your vocabulary will expand and your tolerance for those somehow different than you will change.

There are plenty of very successful people with, and without, degrees. I am just about convinced that these people would be successful no matter what, and that education was just another tool to get them where they are today.

No tradesman would work with a dull chisel, why take that chance with your mind when opportunity knocks?
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Old 05-05-2012, 10:36 AM   #1087
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Originally Posted by Witold View Post
Being a US citizen is often a big PIA if you have a typical life in a different country. I would guess most of those renouncing their citizenship have not lived in US for decades.

It's pretty ridiculous that Americans have to pay US taxes on income earned abroad and follow US laws when they are abroad but it is what it is.
on the flipside, i've meet an huge amount of retired expats in mexico who are very happy to be receiving that SS check each month while living in cheaper mexico (there are books and websites about how to do it as it's one of the better places in the world to do it...i will when the day comes). didn't really ask anyone from this group, unfortunately, about filing taxes and what they do. i know you're not getting over 90K in SS but i'm sure most file and claim the exemption form as the gov. know what they're paying out to these people and you don't want to do anything to loose that income. my landlady was collecting her SS and her husbands pension so she had a great life in mexico.
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Old 05-05-2012, 04:55 PM   #1088
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Originally Posted by eakins View Post
some of the most successful entrepreneurs in the world have no degrees, bailed on finishing or do just average or below if they finished.

the entrepreneurial mindset and rank and order study and take test mindset are often very far apart.

when i talk w/ other business owners, most felt college did very little for them running a business in the real world. they felt college was intake and spit back out and then stop for the day, but as a business owner there was still 6 more hrs of work to do. college did not teach you how to work long and hard and persist awhile properly dealing with setbacks.
There are established programs for the young and naturally ignorant people to follow. An 'education'. A path.
The initial intentions of these programs were good, imo.
The execution of these programs is now 'mostly' (subjective) controlled by weak people (personally weak, imo) with polarlized and idealoigally different views, and agendas than what was the norm and understood when these programs were first founded.
The seed that's planted becomes the tree...but not in all cases.

There will always be people who do not - and will not - get in the pre-programed line. Good, or bad - just human nature.

I agree with what you posted. Against whatever odds, there will always be some people jumping out of the pre-programed line.

Self education is not difficult. It occurs at it's own natural pace, as the need is - not pre-planned robotic-like. When thirsty, you drink. Some people drink more often than others.

Anyway, good post, imo.
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Old 05-06-2012, 07:49 AM   #1089
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i've meet an huge amount of retired expats in mexico who are very happy to be receiving that SS check each month while living in cheaper mexico (there are books and websites about how to do it as it's one of the better places in the world to do it...i will when the day comes). didn't really ask anyone from this group, unfortunately, about filing taxes and what they do.
I'm afraid some here are confusing several issues. First of all, even if you reside overseas you ALWAYS have to report and pay taxes on US-source income, whether it's Social Security, dividends from investments, interest from your US bank, or a salary check from the US. The $95K exemption is on foreign-source income that you earn over there and does not originate in the US. However, even on that income you can claim a foreign tax credit for any amount you pay in tax to a foreign government.

This whole discussion is irrelevant to those who do not expect to make more than $95K in local income overseas in any year -- which, I think, probably includes most reading this. All the average Advrider denizen can aspire to is ekeing out a modest living running a combination bar and brothel in some run-down port city. And that's if you are lucky.
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Old 05-06-2012, 08:06 AM   #1090
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Didn't read this whole post but does anyone consider the Mexican Federal work permit process for working in Mexico as a foreigner?

I believe it is quite complicated and you risk jail time if you are caught working without one.

Work Permits: Advice from an old hat


By Julie Black 1999 All Rights Reserved.
Ask no more. Yes, foreigners can legally work in Mexico, for any length of time, provided they obtain the required permission from the Mexican Immigrations Office. If you are one of those souls here in Mexico for an "extended stay" or longer, you may wonder, fret, or even wring your hands in worry, as the case may be, about how to acquire that most essential of documents - the work permit.
The answer's simple, although painstaking at times. It's a matter of accumulating an inordinate amount of paper work and dutifully paying the fee. Over the years I've become quite familiar with obtaining this permit, known as an FM-3 Visa and would like to share the procedure with you. Please bear in mind that minor changes may occur and expect the entire procedure to require at least several trips to the Immigrations Office; in my own experience, up to five. Also, make sure to have two photo copies of each document that you present.
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Old 05-06-2012, 12:01 PM   #1091
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In Mexico, like many places, there is the law and there is reality.

If you are working at a salaried position, or making pretty big buck$, then you probably want to jump through hoops and get your permits in order.

If you are talking sales or being an intermediary for food and beer money then not so much

Before the economy turned down there was a small army of gringos in Nuevo Progreso who were steering tourists to certain dentists and so forth. Clearly illegal activities, but since they were boosting the local economy they were tolerated.
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Old 05-07-2012, 07:21 AM   #1092
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Originally Posted by ben2go View Post
You guys may be interested in reading this.

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/tax-ti...204320491.html
Screw taxes. If I knew how I could dodge them, I would. protection racket.
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Old 05-07-2012, 07:23 AM   #1093
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Originally Posted by victor441 View Post
am retiring in a month and slowly working my way through the entire thread, excellent stuff.....anyway there was an interesting article on the book made after this post and it sounds like much of the book is fiction or at the least heavily embellished http://reason.com/archives/2011/04/0...ley/singlepage ....still an excellent book though but it might be better to think of it as a novel like Steinbeck's other books, read most of them long ago and enjoyed them greatly
I don't think I will ever get the option of retiring. There is no way SS is going to cover me enough to be able to get by. And I have done zero investment or anything. I know nothing about that. I pretty much live barely keeping my account above 2 or 3 paychecks worth. And this is with student loans being my only real debt, though that is probably the worst debt to have...
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Old 05-07-2012, 08:38 AM   #1094
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Originally Posted by BaronVonDarrin View Post
I don't think I will ever get the option of retiring. There is no way SS is going to cover me enough to be able to get by. And I have done zero investment or anything. I know nothing about that. I pretty much live barely keeping my account above 2 or 3 paychecks worth. And this is with student loans being my only real debt, though that is probably the worst debt to have...
Well what some have done is to build up their credit card limit high enough to pay off their student loans and then when/if things get tough......you have a loan that CAN be discharged through BK. Then you would not have to worry about what little, if any, of your SS check would be kept to pay the student loans. I believe way back in this thread there was someone who built up their credit to the point they bought a house in Mexico on their Visa and then just left to live there debt free so to say.
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Old 05-07-2012, 02:29 PM   #1095
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...now if you have no income from the US and no records ie W2, 1099, SS heading to the IRS each year and you don't file...are they really gonna know about your foreign income?

not sure if foreign income affects future SS payments, but I doubt it.
you'll still have to deal w/ the local tax issue of the country you're earning the $ however.

when i was living in mexico i meet expats working full time, from professional, tourism, real estate to waiting tables and i asked about taxes (as i was thinking about working myself). they basicly all said, i live in mexico full time, i get paid in mexico and it didn't go beyond there as far as IRS is concerned.

take that how you want.
Well, what do people do with their earned income? They generally put it in a bank. And what are foreign banks REQUIRED to do for each USA citizen account holder? That's right... they are required to report it back to the USA. (Not all countries, but USA is working on this.)

Just because you are abroad doesn't mean the USA doesn't know what you are doing. As we all know, there are thousands of people who are not filing taxes each year living right here in the USA as well, but that doesn't make it a good idea, either. As technology increases and the world is getting smaller each year, it is increasingly easy to track people down who are trying to pull a fast one.

Witold screwed with this post 05-07-2012 at 02:47 PM
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