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Old 02-27-2010, 11:13 AM   #1591
blacktiger
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zuma

Was having a coffee this morning with some friends when two GS 1200 riders went past standing on the pegs, lotsa rough conditions in our urban environment, not! It goes without saying they ignored us too, gave us all a good laugh anyway; GS riders really are a world apart (or think they are)
Probably because the seat's crap.
I agree with the last statement in your paragraph. I'm convinced that here in the UK there's a lot of "badge buying" because BMW cars are seen as a status symbol. And, of course, they've watched The Long Way Round.
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Old 02-27-2010, 01:58 PM   #1592
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Quote:
Originally Posted by earthroamer
I think that's why so many riders are attracted to the GS. Also the rider that Ducati is targeting with the MS1200. A very valid criteria.
By all accounts, the MTS 12 is selling like life rafts in a flood. Probably going to be as important as the Monster to Ducati.
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Old 02-27-2010, 02:21 PM   #1593
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paul thompson
By all accounts, the MTS 12 is selling like life rafts in a flood. Probably going to be as important as the Monster to Ducati.
They've sold me, watching the enduro video you posted on the MS12 thread shows the extent that I'd ever ride the MS12 or Tenere on. I'll ride these bikes the same places I ride my Scrambler, just a little quicker is all. Having neither sat on, nor ridden either one, my money right now is on the Multistrada. Big part of that decision is that I will actually be able to buy the Multistrada, and even be able to ride it for a couple years before we even see the Tenere. The other part of the decision is that the Multistrada just looks like the better bike. Someone was knocking the Multistrada for it's high horsepower output, but their whole point in redesigning the 11 degree motor was to give it a strong mid range. I think the Tenere motor will be a gem, but for me at least it's going to be too late.

How many Concours 14s has Kawasaki sold, Yamaha FJRs, simply because it took Honda so long to come out with the new VFR. I have a couple friends riding around on Hayabusa's and loving it, again simply because they got tired of waiting for Kawasaki to release the Concours 14.
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Old 02-27-2010, 04:02 PM   #1594
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dcstrom
BTW, I just checked the specs on the '94 Super Tenere, a bike that some people wish the new one was more like;

750cc
70hp
240.0 kg (529.1 pounds) wet

That's a lot less power and only 21kg lighter than the 1200. If the 261kg quoted for the 1200 is including bags and stuff that are stock on this years model, that would make them roughly the same weight when you remove the extras.
That is all...
I owned two XTZ750s; they were a bit top-heavy, but slim toward the front and were well balanced otherwise. Yamaha will get this right imho.
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Old 02-27-2010, 04:31 PM   #1595
GrahamD
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ray_rev
Yamaha will get this right imho.
+1

Well they seem to have done a good job on most of their off road offerings, they are consistently competing in the DAKAR in good numbers (Except 1999 and 2000 for some reason) and have done since the beginning, and are always up near the top rankings, so why would people expect them to be clueless when it comes to this?

Correct, it is a big bike, yes it's not what you would choose for a Krusty Demons show, True proably 80% of sales will be poseurs but I am sure the engineers know about the trade offs when it comes to off road.

I don't get the skepticism.

The only stuff up will be the price points, which is something that the Australian importers really screwed up with the XT660z.

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Old 02-27-2010, 04:44 PM   #1596
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Originally Posted by R3B
Come again ???

The F800GS with its baseprice of 11.250€ ($$16,750 Aus$)costs a heck of a lot more than a XTZ which is for grabs at 7999€ (13.999 Aus$)so that looks to me as a somewhat silly dicision ...
(Aus$ by bikes.drive.com.au)
Mate, you forgot something very important here.

In Australia the BMW badge is worth +50% of the value of the vehicle.

Its commonly known as the BMW tax or the poseurs tax.

So now redo the calculations. Take the BMW price, multiply it by 0.666 and then compare that with the price of the competition. If the competition is more expensive you buy the BMW.

Same calculation applies to Harley Davidson.

But seriously YAMAHA Aus dropped a huge Price Tag on that bike and many people suffered sticker shock. Consequently the sales have been a bit off.

The price at the moment is a "distressed" price due to sales being somewhat BMW-ish.

But WTF if you are making BMW margins you don't need to sell that many do you?

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Old 02-27-2010, 04:46 PM   #1597
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dcstrom
Weight doesn't seem so bad when you look at it that way.
Especially since a standard 1200 GS Adventure puts 191,6kg on the scale wet (Swedish mag Bike No 2 2010). The Yamaha is a trial bike compared to that.
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Old 02-27-2010, 06:15 PM   #1598
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Molgan
Especially since a standard 1200 GS Adventure puts 191,6kg on the scale wet (Swedish mag Bike No 2 2010). The Yamaha is a trial bike compared to that.
you mean 291.6 kgs?
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Old 02-27-2010, 08:51 PM   #1599
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DakarBlues
you mean 291.6 kgs?
but the GSA also holds almost 9 gallons of gas....
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Old 02-27-2010, 09:31 PM   #1600
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrbreeze
but the GSA also holds almost 9 gallons of gas....
That's 24.5 kilo's
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Old 02-27-2010, 10:17 PM   #1601
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DakarBlues
you mean 291.6 kgs?
Yupp he lost 100 kg there, in the test that Molgan refers to the R1200GS/A had bags/brackets and a full tank of gas when i got on the scale.
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Old 02-27-2010, 11:48 PM   #1602
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DakarBlues








No doubt, it's really a SuperTenere



This lumpy exhaust by itself is worth easily 20 kgs (44 lbs.). Once replaced by a thiner an light one (carbon fiber...),
the XTZ 1200 will look almost wasp-waisted, I promise, well, at least its girth will decrease very markedly.



The original bashplate is string type, but the gear lever connecting rod is very exposed though.



Note: the catalyzer is located where the two header pipes meet, so it would be quite easy to replace the exhaust with something lighter while remaining
environment compliant.
Those Yamaha bags that outfit the XTZ 1200 are similar to the TRAx.
A trax alu bag weights 10.5 lbs, so the whole combo side bags +top box = 31.5 lbs =14.3 kgs.
Put 10 kgs (22 lbs.) for the luggage rack
261 kgs - 14.3 - 10 = 246.7 kgs (543.8 lbs.) fully fuelled and ready to roll without luggage which is less than the fully fuelled weight of the XTZ 750.

Ready to roll without luggage the BMW 1200 GSA is 256 kgs (564 lbs.)

We'll see.
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Old 02-27-2010, 11:53 PM   #1603
GrahamD
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DakarBlues
Those Yamaha bags that outfit the XTZ 1200 are similar to the TRAx.
A trax alu bag weights 10.5 lbs, so the whole combo side bags +top box = 31.5 lbs =14.3 kgs.
261 kgs - 14.3 = 246.7 kgs (543.8 lbs.) fully fuelled and ready to roll without luggage.

Ready to roll without luggage the BMW 1200 GSA is 256 kgs (564 lbs.)
I don't think the luggage is included in the weight unless it is an integral part of the bike, I could be wrong. If I am show me.

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Old 02-28-2010, 12:56 AM   #1604
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GrahamD
+1

Well they seem to have done a good job on most of their off road offerings, they are consistently competing in the DAKAR in good numbers (Except 1999 and 2000 for some reason) and have done since the beginning, and are always up near the top rankings, so why would people expect them to be clueless when it comes to this?
Yup the won the first two editions right away, and 9 times in total, no one bettered that yet...

KTM now has 9 victories too, but have to put in millions of dollars to achieve that, and what a lot of bikes they need to get one winning...







And about the weight, i only can suspect its with panniers et all, because on the dutch site (Yamaha europe is dutch) te XT660Z-LE version with panniers and Touratech gizmo's is quoted 218kg


While the basic version is quoted as weighing 206

So there is sufficient data to go on, but as always, we have to weight on the Das Motorrad real life testdata to be shure :-)
(the first info comes in next Das Motorrad in one week time, the 5th of March)
It being the same set of panniers as on the 660 (which are not really well thought out btw) the bare weight of the Standard S10 would be ~12 kg less then that of the "First Edition" making it 249 kilo.

I could take my scales to Dortmund, but i doubt the would let me weigh it...
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Old 02-28-2010, 01:42 AM   #1605
GrahamD
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Quote:
Originally Posted by R3B

And about the weight, i only can suspect its with panniers et all, because on the dutch site (Yamaha europe is dutch)

So there is sufficient data to go on, but as always, we have to weight on the Das Motorrad real life testdata to be shure :-)
Fair enough then it looks like it does include the luggage.

Thanx.

Cheers
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