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Old 05-04-2013, 07:08 PM   #17431
WestVirginia
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Location: Morgantown, WV
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Thanks and more

Thanks for all the new rider tips and braking info.

Before I bought my bike, a salty Harley rider told me riding on the dirt is the fastest way to learn to ride as 'everything happens so fast.' So I have spent most of my time on dirt and with under 30 miles I have (slowly) dropped it about 8 or 9 times due to bad construction dirt roads with deep rain trenches.

On my last drop today I bent the stuff next to the left peg. Namely, I bent in the shift lever so that I could only ride in first gear and the martian antenna attached to the kickstand in front of the left peg. I was able to get home and use the nail puller end of a hammer to pull out the shift lever. Tapped the martian antenna back but it split the metal at the base and is barely hanging on.

Now that I have bent two things on my Tenere, is there some "Pluric Patch" that I am eligible to wear?

BRAKING:
Hmm, from the manual that came with my Tenere:
This model is equiped with a unified braking system (UBS).
When pulling the brake lever, the front brake and a portion of the rear brake are applied. For full braking performance, apply both the brake lever and the brake pedal simultaneously.
The UBS does not function when the brake pedal is applied alone or before the brake lever is applied.

WestVirginia screwed with this post 05-04-2013 at 08:20 PM
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Old 05-04-2013, 07:21 PM   #17432
Dirty bike
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Braking -

Guys that spend a lot of time on the track, or spend the time to really learn to threshold brake well, tend to use mostly the front brake.

(For those not aware, threshold braking is braking so hard that you are right on the feathery edge of locking the wheel. In theory, ABS, when you stomp on it/grab a full hand of brake, is supposed to mimic threshold braking. In theory. In reality, it's not quite the same, but it's a pretty damn good imitation on modern ABS systems.)

It's a weight transfer thing. The more front brake you use, the more weight transfers to the front wheel. At some point, the rear is so light that almost any rear brake will simply lock the wheel, reducing control, which is not desirable.

However, for the average street rider, using both brakes will equate to more stopping power. Both tires are in contact with the ground, more friction surface, more brake rotor surface engaged. Weight transfer still occurs, (hey, it's a law), but since the threshold is lower, there isn't nearly as much danger of locking the rear brake. (bonus, the S10 has ABS, so you'll feel it, but it won't lock up)

On the track, you're either on the gas or on the brakes, never just cruising along. Gas or braking, the bike is settled and under a suspension load. You hammer, right up to the braking point, then threshold brake into the apex, then roll on throttle as you cross the apex, and hammer out of the corner. Repeat. (At least if you're doing it right)

On the street, well, you simply can't ride like that w/o endangering yourself and other road users. There are too many unknowns and idiots out there. 10/10ths is for the track. Some would say 8/10ths is for the track too, but that's a personal decision for each of us to make. Often, it's a locational factor that decides how hard someone will push.

AC makes some very valid points. But you need to take it with a grain of salt and consider how it applies to your skill level, your riding style, your location.

And yes, the front brake only aspect works the same with UBS systems because weight transfer under hard braking is going to happen regardless of brake system design. But that's only a reality for riders that are threshold breaking. Most riders are not.
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Old 05-04-2013, 09:14 PM   #17433
GrahamD
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Location: Blue Mnts Ozstralia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WestVirginia View Post

... the martian antenna...
.... "Pluric Patch" ....


Well breaking things and being a comedian will get you a "pluric patch" in the end but only one man can issue those.

This series has some useful info especially about how forks used to flex..



Anyway back to the excellent posts by others...
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GrahamD screwed with this post 05-04-2013 at 09:41 PM
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Old 05-04-2013, 10:42 PM   #17434
pluric
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WestVirginia View Post
Now that I have bent two things on my Tenere, is there some "Pluric Patch" that I am eligible to wear?
Wear it in good health.





I only caught this because Graham quoted it. I admit I skimmed the last couple pages.
Never seen braking get so analytical. I guess I never thought about it. You put the
brakes on and it stops or at least slows down.

It's as simple as.....


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Old 05-05-2013, 12:59 AM   #17435
Martin_404
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My driving instructor explained to me, that when usign the rear brake (also at speeds where you rely 99% on your front brake) it functions like dragging an anchor behind a ship, helping the bike stay on its course.

I think this anchor effect, also means you will not dive into the front suspention as much, as when you use front brakes only. (thus maintaining more steering controll)
Especially with ADV bikes, with their longer/deeper front wheel suspention dive, this would be a more relevent factor.

If also using your rear brake at higher speeds, did not have an important funtion, then it would be very irrisponsible of (for instance) Yamaha to introduce UBS and they would not have done it. (concidering liability claims etc.)
Right?

Martin_404 screwed with this post 05-05-2013 at 08:36 AM
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Old 05-05-2013, 01:25 AM   #17436
jaumev
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pluric View Post
..................

Never seen braking get so analytical. I guess I never thought about it. You put the
brakes on and it stops or at least slows down.

It's as simple as.....
+1

Just pull the brakes untill it stops!!
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Old 05-05-2013, 07:06 AM   #17437
avc8130
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Martin_404 View Post
My driving instructor explained to me, that when usign the rear brake (also at speeds where you rely 99% on your front brake) it functions like dragging an anker behind a ship, helping the bike stay on its course.

I think this anker effect, also means you will not dive into the front suspention as much, as when you use front brakes only. (thus maintaining more steering controll)
Especially with ADV bikes, with their longer/deeper front wheel suspention dive, this would be a more relevent factor.

If also using your rear brake at higher speeds, did not have an important funtion, then it would be very irrisponsible of (for instance) Yamaha to introduce UBS and they would not have done it. (concidering liability claims etc.)
Right?
On the street, that braking "dive" can be very useful. It changes the chassis geometry of the bike and allows the bike to steer more quickly and more precise. On the Tenere, I find braking hard and trail braking to really improve how quickly I can negotiate corners since the factory geometry is very lax for off pavement confidence.

I try not to determine what the "engineers" at a manufacture were thinking when they designed something. Generally the marketing and law departments do more work to develop a product than the engineers.

I originally thought I would hate the UBS. But, just like the ABS, other than the fact that I have just about smoked my rear brake rotor in 20k miles I can barely tell it is working on the pavement.

Off the pavement, I have never ridden a bike that feels so comfortable using the front brake lever.

ac
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Old 05-05-2013, 01:35 PM   #17438
rickdotcom
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Hi im new here, in need of some help im having issue with my bike my abs light is on and my speedo reading is at zero while traveling and after riding for some time the engine light turn on. While taking bend i could heard some scraping sound on my front disc bake even thou i had just change my brake pad recently. Could it be my disc brake is bend and that cause the abs and the speedo to not fuction or could it be the abs sensor is faulty? Really in need of some advice. Hope you guys can help solve my problem thanks.
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Old 05-05-2013, 01:59 PM   #17439
Anticyclone
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rickdotcom View Post
Hi im new here, in need of some help im having issue with my bike my abs light is on and my speedo reading is at zero while traveling and after riding for some time the engine light turn on. While taking bend i could heard some scraping sound on my front disc bake even thou i had just change my brake pad recently. Could it be my disc brake is bend and that cause the abs and the speedo to not fuction or could it be the abs sensor is faulty? Really in need of some advice. Hope you guys can help solve my problem thanks.
Sounds like the ABS sensor was either not installed properly, damaged, or not installed at all after removing and installing the front wheel. Did you use a magnetic screwdriver while removing/installing the sensor?
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Old 05-05-2013, 02:33 PM   #17440
Dirty bike
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rickdotcom View Post
Hi im new here, in need of some help im having issue with my bike my abs light is on and my speedo reading is at zero while traveling and after riding for some time the engine light turn on. While taking bend i could heard some scraping sound on my front disc bake even thou i had just change my brake pad recently. Could it be my disc brake is bend and that cause the abs and the speedo to not fuction or could it be the abs sensor is faulty? Really in need of some advice. Hope you guys can help solve my problem thanks.
First, tell us some background info.
Where are you located?
How old is the bike? (miles/time)
Did you buy it new?
Warranty?


Problems are often related to the last work done. Did you change the pads, or did you have it done? If you had it done, buy whom? (dealer or??)

It's far more likely that the ABS sensor is bad or not giving a correct signal than the brake is bad. The speedo shouldn't be related to the sensor, getting it's input from the VSS sensor at the trans.

Was this a wrecked/salvage bike?

Did everything work before the last work done?
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Old 05-05-2013, 03:52 PM   #17441
rickdotcom
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anticyclone View Post
Sounds like the ABS sensor was either not installed properly, damaged, or not installed at all after removing and installing the front wheel. Did you use a magnetic screwdriver while removing/installing the sensor?
nope did not use a magnetic screwdriver to remove the sensor and have not remove my wheel due to im still on my oem tire.
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Old 05-05-2013, 03:57 PM   #17442
GrahamD
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Its the blue wire..
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Old 05-05-2013, 04:10 PM   #17443
Anticyclone
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rickdotcom View Post
nope did not use a magnetic screwdriver to remove the sensor and have not remove my wheel due to im still on my oem tire.


So this problem showed up immediately after changing the brake pads?
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Old 05-05-2013, 04:11 PM   #17444
Icecold Dan
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Location: Cape Fear Coast
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Question

Since my romp in the mud yesterday, my check engine light has been on. I hosed the bike down and thought it would clear over night but it hasn't. I removed and cleaned both abs sensors but I am still getting an error code 42. Any advice?
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Old 05-05-2013, 04:15 PM   #17445
rickdotcom
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Joined: May 2013
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dirty bike View Post
First, tell us some background info.
Where are you located?
How old is the bike? (miles/time)
Did you buy it new?
Warranty?


Problems are often related to the last work done. Did you change the pads, or did you have it done? If you had it done, buy whom? (dealer or??)

It's far more likely that the ABS sensor is bad or not giving a correct signal than the brake is bad. The speedo shouldn't be related to the sensor, getting it's input from the VSS sensor at the trans.

Was this a wrecked/salvage bike?

Did everything work before the last work done?
im located in Singapore.
its been a year and half around 20000km.
yup bought it brand new.
warrenty only 1 year, im 6 months over.

yup the pad i did it on my own by just removing both the caliper clear the brake dust and putting in the new pad before fixing the caliper back.

sorry still not to technically into the electronic stuff im not sure what is the VSS sensor.

nope the bike was not wrecked.

yup everything was working well eventually after i did my brake pad due to hearing some scraping sound from the front brake.

i did brought it back to the dealer and they also have no clue about what went wrong BUT they suspected is abs pump is at fault and they could not give me an assurance that after they change the abs pump it will be ok. they quote me a ridiculous price so i did not proceed with the job they suggest.
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