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Old 09-09-2013, 05:23 AM   #19741
GrahamD
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paulvt1 View Post
Wow. Surprised to read about Yamaha dropping the S10. Agree with what previous posters have said about the varied reasons behind such a decision. It never really stood a chance over here and the new GS has just knocked it even further out of the buying publics mind.
Lets hope there is a 900cc version in the wings...
Just before this goes right off the rails..

There are multiple reasons why you may not bring in next years model.
We get that all the time where I live. We had 2010, 2013,, ??? Not 2011, Not 2012.

YAMAHA have just announced a new direction which may mean the S10 is about to get "DARK".

Who knows.
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Old 09-09-2013, 06:28 AM   #19742
Dallara
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Super Tenere's Future...

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I'm the one who started the thread over in the Super Tenere forum about the bike's future...

And just for the record, my source was speaking strictly about the demise of the Super Tenere in the *UNITED STATES*. From all indications it appears the model will continue everywhere else it's being sold - just not in the USA, and perhaps not in Canada.

Just don't want any confusion there. We have a very, very different market here in the USA... One where very, very few actually use motorcycles for transportation. They are much more of a *recreational vehicle* here, and more of a "toy", for want of a better word. It is also only a very, very small minority of our motorcycle market that actually rides a motorcycle more than a couple of thousand miles a year...

Over here the motorcycle market is all about "image", and most of the motorcycle buyers based their purchase decision based on the "image" they want people to *see* them as. Unfortunately right now that "image" is one of being on a cruiser and looking like a Bandito, "outlaw", bad-boy wanna'-be... That, or the next biggest two segments - either the leather-clad Valentino Rossi wanna'-be or the baggy-pants-on-the-ground, gunboat-showed, ultra-moronic *stunter*... Hence, the big Jap Four motorcycle manufacturers gravitate to those markets - cruisers and sport bikes.

Sure, boutique manufacturers like BMW, Triumph, KTM, Guzzi, etc. all make "adventure" bikes and will continue to sell them over here, but that's simply because what they call "big sales volume" in a segment are not ones the Jap's see as viable numbers to justify bringing a model here. That's why both the FJR and the Super Tenere were both here first under the PDP program... So Yamaha wouldn't get left with any surplus inventory in USA warehouses. With the FJR the PDP continued from 2003 through 2006. With the Super Tenere they did it only one model year - 2012 - and then offered it as a regular line model, and from all reports that first PDP justified continuing it, but then sales on the bike here in the USA fell to nothing for the 2013 model year.

I'm fairly positive the Super Tenere will continue to be sold in other countries, but it's future here in the United States is dubious at best. We may never see it, or any evolutionary progression of it again.

OTOH, the product refresh cycle of the FJR was about every four to six model years, and the Super Tenere is on it's fourth model year in other, non-USA markets. Perhaps... just perhaps... When Yamaha does a worldwide refresh and update of the Super Tenere we'll get another shot at it here in the USA with a PDP.

I sure hope so...

Dallara




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Old 09-09-2013, 07:29 AM   #19743
VEGASGSA
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Originally Posted by grahamd View Post
if your luck is any indication, and i mean that in an "owner of exotic bikes" sense, the us importer decided it didn't want to be caught with old stock as the new one is about to be announced.

maybe it will an 850 triple one of these...




that would separate the fakes from the real adventurers..
tw 200....
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Old 09-09-2013, 09:27 AM   #19744
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At least bring the XT660 over and sell it at a price to compete against the KLR and DR and call it good.
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Old 09-09-2013, 01:27 PM   #19745
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Originally Posted by TeneRay View Post
At least bring the XT660 over and sell it at a price to compete against the KLR and DR and call it good.
Good except Yamaha would lose money on every one it sold.

- Mark
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Old 09-09-2013, 02:08 PM   #19746
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What does the collective think this news will do to prices on
current stock?
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Old 09-09-2013, 02:15 PM   #19747
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Conventional wisdom would point to "worth" declining. At least in the short term.

We aren't talking "collectable" without a lot of historical time passing.
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Old 09-09-2013, 02:39 PM   #19748
lukasteam
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For some reason I think the new Super Tenere 900 is still going to be a twin. Take a look at these two new motors Yamaha has developed a triple and a parallel twin . Now a might be wrong , but the new twin with the "locomotive torque" as they say might be a really good motor for a new Super Tenere 900 keeping the simplicity , reliability and tradition . Lighter and more grunt in the first three gears... isn't that's what we were asking for ???

http://www.cycleworld.com/2013/07/07...rcycle-engine/

Hey Dalara take it easy on me , would 'ya ?!?!?!
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Old 09-09-2013, 02:49 PM   #19749
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markjenn View Post
Good except Yamaha would lose money on every one it sold.

- Mark
Yeah. They need to stop spending all that money into making it look so damn sexy.



Looks like a Ruckus and a TeeDub got it on and this was the end result

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Old 09-09-2013, 03:04 PM   #19750
Dallara
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Laugh I hope, and imagine, you're right!

Quote:
Originally Posted by lukasteam View Post
For some reason I think the new Super Tenere 900 is still going to be a twin. Take a look at these two new motors Yamaha has developed a triple and a parallel twin . Now a might be wrong , but the new twin with the "locomotive torque" as they say might be a really good motor for a new Super Tenere 900 keeping the simplicity , reliability and tradition . Lighter and more grunt in the first three gears... isn't that's what we were asking for ???

http://www.cycleworld.com/2013/07/07...rcycle-engine/

Hey Dalara take it easy on me , would 'ya ?!?!?!


Actually, I think if Yamaha comes with a new Tenere at all for any market that you're exactly right - it will use that new 900cc twin engine as shown in 'Cycle World" some months ago. I even posted about that engine either here or over on the Super Tenere forum.

I think Kevin Cameron is spot-on with everything in that article except for one thing... That "larger housing above the exhaust cam’s sprocket" on the right side of the head does not "conceal a powerband-broadening exhaust cam phaser" for variable cam-timing. No, I imagine it is simply for the same oil-pressure driven compression-reducing mechanism we already have on our XT1200Z Super Tenere's, as the head casting and cam cover on the current Super Tenere have much the same "bulge" and casting profile.

My only disappointment with the 900cc twin shown in the "Cycle World" article is that it's quite obviously got a chain-drive power output. For me that's a *HUGE* negative, but it's one I could live with if the rest of the bike showed as much dedication to reduction of weight and mass centralization.

However, all that said... While I think that wonderfully compact 900cc twin shown in the "Cycle World" article probably will make it into some new Yamaha "adventure" model, I still have my doubts as to whether any such bike will make it into Yamaha USA's line-up...

Not while there are so many 2013 Yamaha Super Tenere's sitting stagnant on USA dealers' showroom floors and Yamaha USA's warehouses.

Dallara



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Old 09-09-2013, 03:04 PM   #19751
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Originally Posted by markjenn View Post
Good except Yamaha would lose money on every one it sold.

- Mark
Why?

Old engine sold it many years
Cheap suspensions
Chep components...

Why they can't compete with these bikes??
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Old 09-09-2013, 03:09 PM   #19752
Dallara
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jaumev View Post
Why?

Old engine sold it many years
Cheap suspensions
Chep components...

Why they can't compete with these bikes??


Because it will cost Yamaha USA a relative ton to certify them for USA emissions regs, and the even tougher California emission regulations, not to mention mounting DOT lighting, etc. Add to that the fact they would have to sell them for a much lower cost-per-unit to the dealers than they do in other markets just to try and keep it competitive to the way, way cheap KLR (which has way cheaper suspension components, an engine that's been built even longer than the 660 Yamaha, and the KLR is built in Malaysia, or is it Thailand? I can't remember), etc. and you've got a recipe for a massive money loser.

I think Mark's right...

That's also why I think it's the little 250 Tenere that *IS* coming here - because that engine *IS* already US emissions certified.

Dallara




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Old 09-09-2013, 03:43 PM   #19753
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I would not trade my WRR for that POS. No adjustable suspension, the frame is not as good, and it still weighs the same.

I would have to buy a different brand and so would most of the guys riding the WRR.

It is made more for road than dirt.

What we need is a bike that is between the WRR and 700cc with good dirt capabilities. The price should be more and the quality at least the same as what we have.

Just my two cents..
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Old 09-09-2013, 04:10 PM   #19754
Dallara
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No doubt...

Quote:
Originally Posted by japako View Post
I would not trade my WRR for that POS. No adjustable suspension, the frame is not as good, and it still weighs the same.

I would have to buy a different brand and so would most of the guys riding the WRR.

It is made more for road than dirt.

What we need is a bike that is between the WRR and 700cc with good dirt capabilities. The price should be more and the quality at least the same as what we have.

Just my two cents..


No doubt it's not near the dirt machine the WRR is, Jim...

I don't think anybody would argue that, and remember, I *LOVE* the WRR... I've almost bought one myself numerous times.

And I don't think Yamaha would bring the 250 Tenere in to replace the WRR. Yamaha has quite a captive market IMHO with the WRR. It's a way better dual-purpose dirt machine than any of the Jap manufacturers produce at the moment - like, say, the Honda CRF250L - yet it is far more reliable and road worthy than anything the Europeans offer. The WRR really is the very best at what it does, IMHO.

OTOH, it's way expensive compared the Honda CRF250L or Kawasaki KLX250S, yet the current Yamaha XT250 is overmatched against those two. I honestly think that Yamaha will bring the 250 Tenere in to compete against the Honda CRF250L in the "entry level" dual-purpose market, only it will be a much better bike than the Honda, both on-road and off.

Just my two centavos...

Dallara



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Old 09-09-2013, 04:17 PM   #19755
markjenn
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Originally Posted by jaumev View Post
Why?

Old engine sold it many years
Cheap suspensions
Chep components...

Why they can't compete with these bikes??
The engine, suspension, etc. of the XT660Z is quite an upgrade from a KLR. I'm not even sure of whether it is an "old engine" - I thought it was a new design around 2007. It's certainly fuel injected and the old bikes weren't. Also think it has ABS, at least as an option as well as options for hard bags and the like. It's pretty high-tech compared to a KLR or DR.

The Teneres are also built in Europe, Italy I think. KLR's are currently assembled in Thailand.

There has been a lot of speculation about what the price of a Tenere would be in the US. Given higher mfg costs, higher spec level, need to amortize relatively new tooling, emissions tests, channel costs, etc., I think $9K is where the bike would end up for Yamaha to make a modest profit. Will people spend $2.5K more for a higher-tech KLR? So far Yamaha doesn't feel so and I tend to agree. Certainly their experience so far with selling their bigger adventure bike hasn't given them a warm fuzzy feeling.

- Mark
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