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Old 08-24-2012, 04:46 PM   #13336
pluric
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wreckchecker View Post
Not very noticeable, and definitely not what we had in some of the 1980s-ish bikes.

The biggest difference is that it takes more thought and effort to wheelie with the shaft. And even there, when the front wheel comes up, the traction control typically won't let it come up more than a couple of inches.
Quote:
Originally Posted by pretbek View Post
Why is that? Please explain.
It's the whole angle of the dangle thing. Very technical. Not to mention 1st gear is way
too high to even think about it.

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Old 08-24-2012, 07:24 PM   #13337
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Originally Posted by pluric View Post
It's the whole angle of the dangle thing. Very technical. Not to mention 1st gear is way
too high to even think about it.


Nice photochops then, Pluric. Just like the ones of you surrounded by hot chicks.

Stop spreading the false and dangerous information that you can actually wheelie a shaft driven bike, armchair physics says you kan't.
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Old 08-24-2012, 08:23 PM   #13338
pluric
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Originally Posted by pretbek View Post
Stop spreading the false and dangerous information that you can actually wheelie a shaft driven bike, armchair physics says you kan't.
Don''t even get into trying to take one off road. Another internet proven no no.
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Old 08-24-2012, 09:41 PM   #13339
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pretbek View Post
Why is that? Please explain.
The physics of why shafts take more effort to wheelie has to do with how far from the axle center that torque is applied. Think in terms of a lever, like a teeter-totter. On the long side is the weight of the bike and rider, and on the short side is the engine power. The meshing of the gear set in the pumpkin is at a smaller radius than the sprocket teeth. So in terms of leverage (yes it's simplified & the values are made up):

For an example chain drive with:
750 lb bike and rider center of gravity,
55" from the center of gravity to the axle center
49 inches from their center of gravity to the edge of the sprocket
6 inches from the sprocket teeth to axle center.
The ratio of 6" into the total 55" is about 9 to 1.

For an example chain drive with:
750 lb bike and rider center of gravity,
55 inches from the center of gravity to the axle center
51 inches from their center of gravity to the pinion/gear mesh
4 inches from the pinion/gear mesh to axle center.
The ratio of 4" into the total 55" is almost 14 to 1.

With this shaft example, the ratio of 4" into the total 55" is 13.75 to 1, so about half again the power is needed to "lift" the bike and rider.

I didn't write that a shaft COULD not wheelie, I wrote that it takes more effort. Of course, when dealing with hundred horse machines, more effort just means twisting the handle a bit more. Exactly how much depends on how heavy the rider is and where he is. Some skinny little chick with her but slid aft or standing doesn't have to work as hard as a good big guy from Utah, who is closer to the handle bars.
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Old 08-24-2012, 10:21 PM   #13340
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congrats homey.
Thanks Man!!!...and now i can add to face plant section as well...NOT on the new bike...once this beer wears off i'll do a thread.
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Old 08-24-2012, 11:40 PM   #13341
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wreckchecker View Post
The physics of why shafts take more effort to wheelie has to do with.
Yeah, I knew that.

More shit to understand. Why wasn't I just born an "arty type"
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Old 08-25-2012, 04:16 AM   #13342
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pluric View Post
Don''t even get into trying to take one off road. Another internet proven no no.
Don't forget it's too heavy and underpowered to be any fun in the twisties as well... I mean they didn't even put a peg feeler on the right side - bike must not be able to lean that far...





And don't even think about it with a DS tire like the K60.

XRAnimal from YST.com may disagree, but what does he know?
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Old 08-25-2012, 04:55 AM   #13343
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wreckchecker View Post
The physics of why shafts take more effort to wheelie has to do with how far from the axle center that torque is applied. Think in terms of a lever, like a teeter-totter. On the long side is the weight of the bike and rider, and on the short side is the engine power. The meshing of the gear set in the pumpkin is at a smaller radius than the sprocket teeth. So in terms of leverage (yes it's simplified & the values are made up):

For an example chain drive with:
750 lb bike and rider center of gravity,
55" from the center of gravity to the axle center
49 inches from their center of gravity to the edge of the sprocket
6 inches from the sprocket teeth to axle center.
The ratio of 6" into the total 55" is about 9 to 1.

For an example chain drive with:
750 lb bike and rider center of gravity,
55 inches from the center of gravity to the axle center
51 inches from their center of gravity to the pinion/gear mesh
4 inches from the pinion/gear mesh to axle center.
The ratio of 4" into the total 55" is almost 14 to 1.

With this shaft example, the ratio of 4" into the total 55" is 13.75 to 1, so about half again the power is needed to "lift" the bike and rider.

I didn't write that a shaft COULD not wheelie, I wrote that it takes more effort. Of course, when dealing with hundred horse machines, more effort just means twisting the handle a bit more. Exactly how much depends on how heavy the rider is and where he is. Some skinny little chick with her but slid aft or standing doesn't have to work as hard as a good big guy from Utah, who is closer to the handle bars.
I think you should make more of an effort to be accurate in what you write, people could well be misled.
Its "butt" not "but".
Graeme
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Old 08-25-2012, 05:16 AM   #13344
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wreckchecker View Post
The physics of why shafts take more effort to wheelie has to do with how far from the axle center that torque is applied. Think in terms of a lever, like a teeter-totter. On the long side is the weight of the bike and rider, and on the short side is the engine power. The meshing of the gear set in the pumpkin is at a smaller radius than the sprocket teeth. So in terms of leverage (yes it's simplified & the values are made up):

For an example chain drive with:
750 lb bike and rider center of gravity,
55" from the center of gravity to the axle center
49 inches from their center of gravity to the edge of the sprocket
6 inches from the sprocket teeth to axle center.
The ratio of 6" into the total 55" is about 9 to 1.

For an example chain drive with:
750 lb bike and rider center of gravity,
55 inches from the center of gravity to the axle center
51 inches from their center of gravity to the pinion/gear mesh
4 inches from the pinion/gear mesh to axle center.
The ratio of 4" into the total 55" is almost 14 to 1.

With this shaft example, the ratio of 4" into the total 55" is 13.75 to 1, so about half again the power is needed to "lift" the bike and rider.

I didn't write that a shaft COULD not wheelie, I wrote that it takes more effort. Of course, when dealing with hundred horse machines, more effort just means twisting the handle a bit more. Exactly how much depends on how heavy the rider is and where he is. Some skinny little chick with her but slid aft or standing doesn't have to work as hard as a good big guy from Utah, who is closer to the handle bars.
Thank you for that. First lucid and well thought out explanation of that topic I've ever read.
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Old 08-25-2012, 06:00 AM   #13345
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Quote:
Originally Posted by omeoxlv View Post
I think you should make more of an effort to be accurate in what you write, people could well be misled.
Its "butt" not "but".
Graeme
Hmmm - I'll have to research it...


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Old 08-25-2012, 07:30 AM   #13346
pluric
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anticyclone View Post
Thank you for that. First lucid and well thought out explanation of that topic I've ever read.
It was nicely explained. I would have left it at "It's easier with an empty tank".
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Old 08-25-2012, 01:34 PM   #13347
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CafeRacer99 View Post
This shot doesn't show it very well, but the tube is well out of the line of travel of the tire.







And it's held solidly. I spent some time trying to push it under the seat and it won't go. I'll be keeping an eye on it to see if vibration over time makes it move.
Caferacer99, what tires do you have on your S10. could not recognize the design of them...

Thanks
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Old 08-25-2012, 01:39 PM   #13348
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Originally Posted by sxsxsxa View Post
Caferacer99, what tires do you have on your S10. could not recognize the design of them...

Thanks
Heidenau K60 Scouts:

http://www.rideonadv.com/Ride_On_Adv/TIRES.html

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Old 08-25-2012, 03:15 PM   #13349
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thanx Mike. completely a new one to me. any comments?
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Old 08-25-2012, 03:43 PM   #13350
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Hmmm - I'll have to research it...


Im sure Pluric can find a pic from him with this two girls

I love the white Yamaha's !!!
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