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Old 09-15-2011, 05:27 PM   #4441
Sjoerd Bakker
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If you are thinking Mex 24 as a direct connector between Mex 15 to Parral , be warned it is not a completely paved route yet.I've been as far as Badiriguato coming north from Mex 15 north of Culiacan , and the pavement stops as the road enters the scarp/ mountain face.I just turned around so I don't know the condition of the unpaved section but it could be a bit rough, but hey ,it is a road and trucks and locals do it. The pavement picks up again at Guadalupe Y Calvo and from there to Parral it is a great scenic high country route with several really snaky bits as it goes down and through Rio Verde side arms of the Copper Canyon sytem. In the past there have beeen reports of narco criminal activity along this route in the unpaved section , so keep your nose clean, don't go exploring in off the road fields, and find a place to stay well before dark.
If you are going to Creel by this method you need not go as far as Parral because the Mex 23 turnoff is about 40km west of that pretty city. It is Mex 23 in some spots but there also are roadside signs calling it Chih.23 and some other numbers too, just depends on what leftover signs they had I guess.Mex 23 is a great paved highway all the way north through Creel up to Mex 16, canyon crossings, high country pine forest etc.
The same is true for the other unpaved routes to Creel from Mex 15, unpaved , but likely a bit more developed, and with bridges over rivers now..

Snow and ice in the mountains is a definite possibility on Dec 21 .This is winter there and it can get mighty cold in the high country, like -15C overnight in Creel. For instance this past winter was a doozy and in Feb they had a night of , get ready.... -23C !!! It was a massive cold outbreak and affected much of NW Mexico.
In Chihuahua and Durango it froze a lot of trees , either outright killed them or if lucky just the green leaves and young branches. It was so bad that even the coastal flats with hundreds of square km of corn and tomatos and such growing for the winter market were killed.In March when I passed down Mex 15 from Obregon to Mazatlan it was just recovering with replanted corn coming up between the frozen flattened yellow dead corn.
So if you must go there around new year be ready for cold Keep an eye on the weather forecasts and where systems are moving . This .is why fall and spring are always mentioned as ideal times to do CC- milder.
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Old 09-15-2011, 06:08 PM   #4442
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Thanks Sjoerd.

My tentative route was to take rte 16 from Hermosillo, then rte 127 down to Creel, followed by rte 23 out of Creel and join rte 24 about 46km west of Parral. I think that is all paved, but would like to hear from someone who had ridden it recently if that was still the case. Not too long ago, at least in Baja, the road condition could vary wildly from season to season. It's better now, but I have very limited experience of the other states.

The low temperatures might be a bummer. Don't have a heated suit, and was not planning on getting geared up for one. -23C sounds like stay the f*** inside weather! Any idea how far south I will have to go before it warms up? Maybe Taxco or Oaxaca? Would taking the coast road (rte 200) all the way down be a better chance of staying warm? I'll be coming back up in April/May, so maybe I should leave the mountains until then.
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Old 09-15-2011, 07:38 PM   #4443
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It would seem pretty logical if you stay on coastal roads you'll be warm...er.
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Old 09-15-2011, 08:32 PM   #4444
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Excellent post Sjoerd.
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Old 09-15-2011, 08:46 PM   #4445
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Excellent post Sjoerd.
I agree, and thank you again Sjoerd for the otherwise extremely difficult to obtain information. I love this thread!

I am also aware that the coast will be warmer, but how far South do I need to go before the mountains stop believing in the Winter?
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Old 09-15-2011, 10:20 PM   #4446
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viva México !
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Old 09-16-2011, 04:52 AM   #4447
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Originally Posted by Sjoerd Bakker View Post
it could be a bit rough, but hey ,it is a road and trucks and locals do it.
It's that kind of thinking that takes you to where the fun is!
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Old 09-16-2011, 08:17 AM   #4448
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viva México !

Oh. Almost forgot about that.

+1, Arte
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Old 09-16-2011, 09:14 AM   #4449
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VIVA!!!!!!!
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Old 09-16-2011, 11:02 AM   #4450
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Viva Mexico !
Yes Indeedy , Mex 23 between Mex 16 and Mex 24 is all pavement of exellent quality, we just rode up through from the south this mid March 2011 and I cant see it degrading much since then.
I don't have my notes with me at the moment but I think that by Mex 127 you are referring to the road from Basaseachic to San Juanito where it joins Mex 23 south to Creel , verdad?
This road from Basaseachic to S.Juanito is also pavimentado, completamente nueva de alta calidad.
We used it as the short cut from Creel to Bas, this March when they were still working on paving the last 500m , exact measurement! Having done it in the past when it was gravel I must say that asphalt has not destroyed the charm and beauty of this route. . This road climbs up over the Cuesta Prieta , very high country with pines and even aspens and some valley farms. In Mid March we could still see traces of snow drifts melting in some of the high shaded roadside areas.
A few years ago I visited Creel just around new years and on a clear night the temp went down to -15C putting a thick layer of ice in a rain barrel. This year in mid March it was clear and frost on the bike behind Hotel Korachi where a woodburning stove in the hall provided heat.
On that same first mentioned January trip we took Mex40 from Durango to Mazatlan and there was a cover of snow between the pines for many km in the high country northeast of El Salto., this year in March it was mild and sunny. So yes snow is possible in much of the high country even as far as south of Guadalajara, in fact in ANY high mountain area. So the point is to watch your planned route for ELEVATION as well as watching weather reports.
Mex 15 is ,except for rare outbreaks of winter extremes , not going to be a problem, neither is Mex 200 which is much farther south and always near the Pacific air.There are plenty of good routes where winter can be avoided with a bit of care. Mex45 and Mex 49, Mex 57 only receive dustings of snow in the high deserts in winter events
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Old 09-16-2011, 12:28 PM   #4451
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Thanks Sjoerd.


The low temperatures might be a bummer. Don't have a heated suit, and was not planning on getting geared up for one. -23C sounds like stay the f*** inside weather! Any idea how far south I will have to go before it warms up? Maybe Taxco or Oaxaca? Would taking the coast road (rte 200) all the way down be a better chance of staying warm? I'll be coming back up in April/May, so maybe I should leave the mountains until then.

I wouldn’t completely rule out the high country in Mexico in winter. At least here in NW Mexico, in winter (December-February) we tend to get about half a dozen cold snaps that last less than a week. The days and weeks in between can be very nice short sleeve riding whether. These cold snaps come in on a predictable whether pattern and the forecasts are good. Just keep an eye on the prognostico.
As Sjoerd said, altitude is key. It can get very cold in a lot of parts of Mexico in the winter even Taxco and Oaxaca. Last week there was a little blurb in the Durango newspaper that we got our first frost of the year, somewhere up in La Sierra.

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Old 09-16-2011, 01:24 PM   #4452
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I'll keep that offer in mind Sr
Now maybe you can explain something about the Mexican weather reports . I frequently catch them in
M exican hotels on the morning shows before starting off the ride for the day The better reports are on Televisa, but I see now that Marta Guzman has been fired and is now acting in soaps . . The cold fronts are given numbers as the season progresses but I still do not know exactly at which date they start each season with #1. By February they are up around # 30
Is it the start of winter in December or the first of december or....?
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Old 09-16-2011, 03:34 PM   #4453
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The first cold front is usually at the end of October, but due to all the hotter/humid air from Central America they become upper drafts with a mix of rain and mild winds. They usually close hurricane season.

The first cold one is pretty much clockwork, it comes on thanks giving week (USA Txs giving). Most people do not realize Mexico can be very cold, people imagine a desert environment, with cactuses and people seeking shade for a nap wearing sombreros. The opposite is true. You can visit Puebla in July and see the snow capped volcano, or freeze your ass off in San Cristobal (Chiapas) no cold front required.

The coast line is usually mild for the exception of cold fronts Nov to March (cold for us, but coming from Michigan it is mild) the mountains on the other hand will surprise you.

I'm sure MikeMike will be of more help with this since he can ride in tropical paradise and in just two hours riding towards Puebla he can wish he had heated gear. I am definitely jelous
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Old 09-16-2011, 06:50 PM   #4454
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Originally Posted by Supa12 Pilot View Post
The first cold front is usually at the end of October, but due to all the hotter/humid air from Central America they become upper drafts with a mix of rain and mild winds. They usually close hurricane season.

The first cold one is pretty much clockwork, it comes on thanks giving week (USA Txs giving). Most people do not realize Mexico can be very cold, people imagine a desert environment, with cactuses and people seeking shade for a nap wearing sombreros. The opposite is true. You can visit Puebla in July and see the snow capped volcano, or freeze your ass off in San Cristobal (Chiapas) no cold front required.

The coast line is usually mild for the exception of cold fronts Nov to March (cold for us, but coming from Michigan it is mild) the mountains on the other hand will surprise you.

I'm sure MikeMike will be of more help with this since he can ride in tropical paradise and in just two hours riding towards Puebla he can wish he had heated gear. I am definitely jelous
Actually we already had our first official cold front 2 weeks ago. Temperature dropped to a pleasant 80's, but just for a couple days. It was a weird thing here, since was kinda early. So hurricane season is almost over!!

http://www.kztv10.com/news/first-col...opical-update/
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Old 09-16-2011, 07:14 PM   #4455
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Arte, my Independence Day ride...Acocomotla, Puebla via La Gloria, Veracruz. 10,500ft at the pass and 54f. You guys are going to love this route. Xalapa-Perote-La Gloria, Veracruz-Gonzalez Ortega, Puebla-Maravillas-Saltillo Lafragua-Acocomotla-La Trinidad-Rafael Garcia-Patlanalan, Puebla-Teocelo, Veracruz-Xico-Coatepec-Xalapa-Boca Del Rio, Ver.

Cecina with picadas for breakfast $4 bucks along with coffee and a coke. Viva!
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